Something i found interesting... Perhaps ironic?

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: IndependentOpinion
Reincarnation removes accountability from yourself...

I would think that the blanket and all encompassing forgiveness of Christianity removes accountability from the person .. but with reincarnation you have to pay for your own karmic debt ... with reincarnation you are responsible for your own sin debt and everyone else is responsible for their own.

I think the idea of there being a separate world called heaven in the sky removes accountability. By reincarnation you could say you create paradise or hell here for the future. Though, did the bible even mention the sky? I don't know. Seems to be a TV influence.
By all being one, which was also mentioned in there, you would directly cause the damage to yourself.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

If you know Revelations then you should know that there will be 7 trumpets, and when the last trumpet sounds, He will come.

a reply to: Shiloh7

However going back to your point that we die, get judged and then reincarnate - where does the reward of heaven or the punishment of hell come in if you reincarnate again? I don't understand your point.

Well again, as I've said previously... heaven is "the afterlife" whatever that might be... and Hell is nothing more then a manipulation tool for the masses used as a means of conversion.... which essentially takes advantage of ones fear of the unknown.

IF one reads the gospels they will notice said reward system is the first will be last, and the last will be first...

IF one has been a good person, yet has not learned the lessons they were sent here to learn, they are returned to "try again" so to speak... They are not burned in a pit of firey torture...

a Father would not burn his children... I don't care what Christians will tell you

originally posted by: IndependentOpinion
a reply to: Akragon

Because there is no hell in your view, you will never be held accountable for your actions after death..

that is simply not true....

Only man could be so sadistic as to believe God will burn people... its just disgusting

After death if one does not progress, said peron is placed in the body they deserve...

a reply to: IndependentOpinion

Yes, and each trumpet signifies one of the 7 senses. Yes, we have 7 of them. Once all 7 have "blown", life is created once again and a functional organism is created.

a reply to: FlyersFan

would think that the blanket and all encompassing forgiveness of Christianity removes accountability from the person ..

This 'ALL loving, ALL forgiving' religion is a myth, and actually now true christianity, but the new-age misleading christianity, because it goes against scripture....

a reply to: Akragon

The big thing is that IF I am proven wrong after death, I will lose after death, and all will be well.

But if you are proven wrong after death, you will lose, well, everything.


So which is the safest way to go.....?

But I see that arguing about this is useless, because you have already made up your mind.

!Bye!

originally posted by: IndependentOpinion
a reply to: Akragon

The big thing is that IF I am proven wrong after death, I will lose after death, and all will be well.
But if you are proven wrong after death, you will lose, well, everything.
So which is the safest way to go.....?

Well no.... technically IF you are wrong after death and reincarnation does happen... your fate will rely on your actions in this life... and you may be returned or you may progress...

With Christianity... all one has to do is believe and you're all good.... except Jesus didn't teach that... Paul did... so you may be screwed anyways unless you actually read what Jesus taught... that being Faith plus works, NOT faith alone...

SO I personally would say... Go with what Jesus said is the safest bet...

That being... Don't judge... because we really don't know... and denying reincarnation exists at all is placing limits on the Father... which is probably not wise

But I see that arguing about this is useless, because you have already made up your mind.

Why would I write this thread if I thought It was only a possibility?

Perhaps you missed the part where I said "I believe this with all my heart"

Taa taa... *waves*

a reply to: Akragon

Being no fan of christianity and its guilt trips etc the concept of a heaven without a body once one is dead needs a little thinking about before accepting it …heaven… without my body and senses how would I know I wonder?

But you raise an interesting thing that I have wondered about. I was a trained therapist and did quite a lot of hypnotherapy. This on occasions involved regression. I had a number of people telling me their past lives so I cannot go along with out reincarnation in my belief system because I have witnessed it.

But what I wanted to ask you was you make the point that we are here to learn lessons - but who sets those lessons that we are to learn and why does no religion actually tell us about the purpose of those lessons and the rewards we will get on learning them - I find the concept of a single god, such a busy-bee with the lot of us, that my mind boggles at the personal counting of every hair on ones head concept, not that it isn't a comforting thought -= but sh-t happens so he must have been looking the other way.

a reply to: Shiloh7

But what I wanted to ask you was you make the point that we are here to learn lessons - but who sets those lessons that we are to learn

I would assume God does... but I've heard a theory that we are the ones who actually write our own destiny in life before we incarnate... I don't know if its true of course

why does no religion actually tell us about the purpose of those lessons and the rewards we will get on learning them

Technically most religions do... the gospels tell us we're here to learn tolerance, patience and love... even self sacrifice, which is basically the same in Buddhism as well...

Gnostic writing tells us that we need to learn "the gnosis"... yet what that gnosis might be is not discussed... Ironically the gospels tell us what it is...

Love

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Sorry I misread your post and couldn't stop laughing - the wife's still giggling.

a reply to: Shiloh7

Get your heads outta the gutter!

Orga-ni-sm

a reply to: Akragon

I think you could possibly take the 'gnosis' as the first two or most important 'commandments' love the god in yourself and in your neighbour. (From Nag Hammadi it appears that Jesus did not view himself as divine) (my words can't remember his exact ones)

For me this belongs to the dogma of religion but somewhere from there, I get into the world of spirituality and spiritual ideals which I would describe as those ideals that come from within ourselves and occur naturally without any dogma etc. But in reality these are incredibly difficult to maintain whilst living, eg - in the fast lane on the motorway etc bankers, paedophiles in westminster etc etc Life today is so fraught even if you are pretty well quietly organised spirituality simply goes out the door just coping. Perhaps that's why we have to keep reincarnating but I suspect the pace for improving is going to get slower and harder as more and more people live on the earth and we all struggle to live.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Still giggling - could be quite a night in the gutter.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

We are all born with souls, but our spirits are stillborn. Thats why Jesus said we must be born of water and spirit.

There is a difference between soul and spirit, and I have experienced being conscious while my soul and spirit where temporarily separated.

a reply to: Shiloh7

I understand what you mean... truly life can be completely confusing

I know people who deny God exists completely on the basis of the fact that there are bad people in this world... Why would God let such things happen...

Though I have come to a very simple solution to this problem... God leaves us to our lives, we are free to run it as we wish... with complete and utter free will, but we return to him in the end regardless of how we may have acted...

Some.... IF not most do not realise this, and in that day there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth as it is said

The rules we should live by are written on our hearts... ALL know them, but not all choose to follow them...

The path is narrow, and few find it... and there is either spiritual progression after this incarnation, or reincarnation for the purpose of learning what you did not... until we break the cycle and learn what we are here to learn...

Some spiral downward endlessly... others progress...

interesting topic,
Just the other day I was thinking about this whole NWO thing and I couldn`t understand why would all these different generations continue to carry out the plan to create a NWO? It has taken so long that most of them are dead now and will never see or benefit from a NWO so why did they bother to dedicate their whole lives to stick to the NWO plan that was handed down to them?
These aren`t the kind of people that are unselfish and are just doing it so that future generations of their off spring will have the benefits of being the rulers of a NWO.These architects of the NWO are the most selfish, cold hearted,power hungry things to ever walk the earth.

Then I thought what if they will be alive to benefit from their centuries of efforts to bring about a NWO?
What if they know, have proof, of reincarnation and it has been the same people, reincarnated, that have been steadfastly working towards this NWO for all these centuries?

As far as jesus and reincarnation I think he was talking about reincarnation,wasn`t jesus himself reincarnated?

a reply to: Tardacus

As far as jesus and reincarnation I think he was talking about reincarnation,wasn`t jesus himself reincarnated?

that is a view that a few Christian denominations have... I've heard some say that Jesus was actually Adam...

I personally don't have any belief in Adam and Eve or most of the legends found in the OT though...

Perhaps you are thinking of John the Baptist... He was Elijah according to Jesus...

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Jesus meant it as one event in my opinion. A stillborn child is only born of water and not Spirit, a living baby is born of both water AND Spirit because the body is animated and has life. If you are not born again, of water AND Spirit, you will not see the kingdom. This is not the kingdom here on Earth, the kingdom is somewhere else.