Don't offend the Muslims!!!! (here we go again)

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: hutch622
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.
Salman Rushdie

True , but at what point does offence morph into hate .

At about the 4th or 5th post here, from what I've witnessed today. Sad really, ATS members are better than that IMO.

Strangely enough, this is a really good point Krakatoa. I wonder if there are experts analyzing the flow of vitriol in places like this and the possibility that this could be a pattern that can be manipulated.

a reply to: Expat888

Agree Pat but to me the killers are only human in the physical sense. Their mind set is no better than animal.

Kind regards,

Bally

Where are all you anti-hate people when the all too common posts show up here on ATS, calling Jesus a fictitious creation, a zombie, and all that?
Why aren't those threads closed?
Why aren't Muslims expected to be tolerant while Christians are?
Why is it OK for Muslims to have an extremely homophobic stance, but if a Christian simply calls homosexuality a sin.... there are threads dedicated to railing against them?

a reply to: AreUKiddingMe

Don't offend the Muslims a?

well I happen to think the 'Muslims' is just front for someone else. Ask the question, who is behind all all this 'anti hate speech? It would'nt be our old middle east friends from Is..... would it?

Who benfits from 'don't offend .....? How shrewed might it be to not to let anyone know your behind 'don't offend .....? by putting someones face out in front of masses so they dont see your own ???

* * * ATTENTION ALL * * *

We understand emotions are running wild and tension is high.

These are troubling times indeed.

BUT the TERMS AND CONDITIONS still apply. That means NO name-calling or personal attacks.

“You cannot shake hands with a clinched fist.”

Thank you.

a reply to: daaskapital

Totally agree.

I felt quite embarrassed by the thread yesterday, how are we supposed to move away from hate and violence, when people carry out the exact actions known to incite it?

Under the guise of free speech, I watched people posting things that are causing deaths across the world. Quite surprised at some of the names and positions posting too.

There is free speech, and there's purposely posting material to antagonise someone or a culture. I really can't understand it.

I have to admit that I've only met a few Muslims in my time, a Muslim family has just moved in next door to my girlfriend and are without doubt the nicest, most thoughtful, most generous people I have ever met. They have helped my girlfriend no end when she hasn't been well (post cancer stuff), and rarely a day goes by when they don't knock on the door with courses of food for her.

Not once have they ever preached about Islam, but i'm confused....due to the Paris attacks should I go draw a ton of cartoons that I know will offend them, and knock on their door and show them....just so they know I support free speech?

When people say "be the change you want to see"....does it really sound like the correct way to start is by insulting a whole culture?

CX

a reply to: butcherguy

Where are all you anti-hate people when the all too common posts show up here on ATS, calling Jesus a fictitious creation, a zombie, and all that?

Can you show proof that he actually existed?

Why aren't Muslims expected to be tolerant while Christians are?

Christians are allowed to say whatever they want as long as it isn't hate speech the same goes for Muslims or anyone from any faith.

Why is it OK for Muslims to have an extremely homophobic stance, but if a Christian simply calls homosexuality a sin.... there are threads dedicated to railing against them?

Because if the Christians were to read that book they hold up while they are screaming at gays it would tell them that it isn't their place to judge people but rather love people. It isn't ok for Muslims to do that either but let's face it Christians scream about gays far louder than Muslims do.

Blame the system not the players.

Use your anger to make some changes, or spread more hate... it's up to your brain to make that decision.

a reply to: buster2010

Can you show proof that he actually existed?

As much proof as the Muslims have that Mohammed is the messenger of Allah.... and deserves super special kid gloves treatment in the editorial cartoon department. Do you have proof of the existence of Allah.... or God?
I am not debating the reality of Jesus, God, Allah or Mohammmed as a Messenger of Allah.
I am pointing out inconsistencies in how people handle their hate, depending on whether you are a Christian, Jew or Muslim.

Christians are allowed to say whatever they want as long as it isn't hate speech the same goes for Muslims or anyone from any faith.

Sorry to break it to you, but hate speech is, like most other speech, allowed in these United States. Ask the New Black Panthers or the KKK, they do it all the time.

It isn't ok for Muslims to do that either but let's face it Christians scream about gays far louder than Muslims do.

Muslims have been known to do far more than scream about it. Anyway, you just proved my point about a double standard between Muslims and Christians treatment by some members here. It shows your hatred.... 'let it flow, young Skywalker.'

originally posted by: butcherguy
Where are all you anti-hate people when the all too common posts show up here on ATS, calling Jesus a fictitious creation, a zombie, and all that?
Why aren't those threads closed?
Why aren't Muslims expected to be tolerant while Christians are?
Why is it OK for Muslims to have an extremely homophobic stance, but if a Christian simply calls homosexuality a sin.... there are threads dedicated to railing against them?

Couldnt agree with you more.
All religions take a beating here. Star for you.

originally posted by: SkepticOverlord

originally posted by: AreUKiddingMe
A thread got closed recently "Mohammed Challenge" or something like that.

The thread was closed (not trashed) because it devolved into an expression of hate, instead of the embrace and celebration of free speech I was hoping for.


It's sad.



I'm embarrassed because of our ATS members. The response to the idea on Twitter was exponentially more along the lines of what I had oped to see here on ATS.

We're still getting lots of people clicking-through from Twitter… and now they see hate.

It's not hate.

It's anger.

In my humble opinion.

a reply to: Domo1

Whoa... I mean NO disrespect to you, I was trying to answer your question honestly, I really was. Nothing stubborn or disrespectful intended and I do apologize if it came across that way.

a reply to: butcherguy

Why is it OK for Muslims to have an extremely homophobic stance, but if a Christian simply calls homosexuality a sin.... there are threads dedicated to railing against them?

It's because Christians own the joint - or think they do. They have power - real power. Actual power over other people's lives - they are not a minority, and they are not persecuted

Muslims - peaceful Muslims - are a vulnerable people right now in so many places

I don't believe in permitting censorship - I don't believe in permitting hate speech

Tough call - isn't it?

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

they are not a minority,

Current number of Christians world-wide is 2.1 billion. World population now.... 7 billion.
I think that gives them minority status.

they are not persecuted

You are doing it now.

I don't believe in permitting censorship - I don't believe in permitting hate speech

Tough call - isn't it?

They are mutually exclusive.... not a tough call. You either believe in one or the other.

a reply to: butcherguy

Current number of Christians world-wide is 2.1 billion. World population now.... 7 billion. I think that gives them minority status.

In the USA - North America - the Americas? Europe? Those countries where Muslims have immigrated - they are the minority. Those countries have economic and military might - Christians are not persecuted. Unless you think criticism is persecution?

You are doing it now.

How is my pointing out that Christians have real power persecution?

They are mutually exclusive.... not a tough call. You either believe in one or the other.

A real dilemma - yes. Do you live in such a simple universe? I believe in both. I like to think

If you want to make a choice that will eliminate all your other choices - because it's easier - that's up to you

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

A real dilemma - yes. Do you live in such a simple universe? I believe in both. I like to think If you want to make a choice that will eliminate all your other choices - because it's easier - that's up to you

I will choose freedom over censorship. I may not agree with you, but I don't want to shut you up and trample your right to expression. It would be far easier to choose to shut you up, don't you think?

How is my pointing out that Christians have real power persecution?

Because I say so.... Just like you can state that Christians own the world... when they don't.

I honestly didn't see what got everyone upset.

The site owner is certainly entitled to his opinion.

The thread didn't go the direction he had hoped. Happens to everyone.

Stop holding the owner an impossible standard of not offending anyone.

If you are that upset about his opinion...Head back to Facebook.

Cause, your friends already know what a candy ass you are.

originally posted by: Domo1
I just wanted it clarified than not all members should be an embarrassment.

I'm sorry it was taken that way, which was not my intent.

I accidentally used a broad stroke, in a response from me that seemed necessary, during a crazy-busy day (for me, and unrelated to the topic).

originally posted by: SkepticOverlord
a reply to: hutch622

One of my all-time favorite quotes…

What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.
Salman Rushdie

But the freedom to offend does not include the freedom to sow hate… in my opinion.

Needless to say and express the apreciation for this amazing board that you and your collegues have build, giving us the possibility to express what we know and think. But please do not "sell" yourself to the political correctness. Is this very pc that is the root of all what's happening today. There is no free speech if you are afraid to express what your really think. If people weren't intimidated by the pc and were allowed to say what they really think on the matter, believe me, we would have had a different reality, the one that should really be and not the one that is being induced on us.