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Which is preferable: Secular Education or Theocracy?

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posted on Feb, 1 2014 @ 08:52 PM
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reply to post by wildtimes
 

Dear wildtimes,

I'm glad to see you haven't lost your passion, but I'm wondering if that passion might be getting in your way while you look at this question.

1.) How does knowing where an opinion comes from help the analysis? Forgive me, but that sounds like "Bulverism." I would not expect the Common Core website to post anything derogatory about Common Core. Nor would I expect web sites from government entities or Bill Gates to criticize it. I would think it fair to say that the people who oppose it will post negatives, those who support it will post positives. But, none of that helps us determine what is true.

2.) I've looked through some of the threads on ATS using Common Core as a search term. In general, they don't seem very positive. I've also found websites criticizing Common Core, including one by a supporter who claims that Obama and Duncan have provided opponents with a lot of ammunition for the argument that Common Core is federally designed and controlled.

I don't know whether you'd like to explore these things, but I'm willing to walk along with you, if for nothing else than old time's sake.

With respect,
Charles1952




posted on Feb, 2 2014 @ 07:44 AM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


Hi, Charles!
Nope, haven't changed my position.

The reason I asked for sources is because the internet is a huge place, where people of any particular 'passion' can find goods and bads about any of these contentious subjects.

How are we supposed to discern fact from myth? By looking at enough sources that we can determine a "bent", if you will.
For example, Alex Jones...when I first joined and watched some video about Obama that was Very inflammatory against him, at first I was swayed. So, I paid more attention to AJ. Then I started to see the holes, and the whole, and that is was simply sensationalist propaganda.

I ask where people got their ideas of "Progressives" because I've seen many, many 'alternative' websites that paint them as commies/Marxists, and put "spin" on the ideas simply to cause trouble. I didn't know much about Common Core (I've been out of the education business for a while, but I do try to keep abreast of new trends & ideas. So I looked it up to see if all the right-wing bashing was substantiated, and I didn't find any.

I didn't realize how Fox News was so propagandized until I'd been here for awhile - so - in a way, I'm still sorting through all the "MSM lies" and trying to find neutral ground from which to learn. Also, if I know where the idea/opinion came from, I am better able to point out discrepancies.

You remember all those Islam threads, I'm sure. I learned the hard way that simply typing in "islam" to learn more about it is not a good thing - you get "all sides" of the story if you go at it long enough, though.

I spend a good deal of time 'assessing' the journalism quality of sites/talking heads/orgs by comparing and contrasting (learned how to do that in school - heh..you know...critical thinking skills). It drives me nuts when otherwise intelligent people fall for crap and hype and defamation-heavy sites as actual "sources" - when they are Op-Ed predominantly.

If you'd like to walk along and figure it out with me, I'd be delighted!

Fondly,
wildtimes



posted on Feb, 2 2014 @ 09:59 AM
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Here's an example of what I'm talking about regarding sources and their credibility:

Another Religious Right Tale Of Anti-Christian Victimization Gets Thoroughly Debunked

We have seen it happen time and again: some right-wing group issues a one-sided press release about a student supposedly being unfairly discriminated against in school simply for exercising their Christian faith and the entire Religious Right movement immediately flies into an outrage, spreading the story far and wide as undisputed truth. Then days or weeks later, the real story emerges once school officials are given an opportunity to investigate and explain what really happened and it inevitably reveals that the Religious Right version was completely false, by which point it is already too late because the fake version has already been accepted as gospel and just continues to spread forever. - See more at: www.rightwingwatch.org...


There is another ongoing thread by 3NL here
regarding a Louisiana Public School that has Christian icons and verses displayed in hallways and classrooms and outside of the administrative office.

The thread got heated - and ugly - until 3NL was so dismayed he 'gave up' (something I've done before, too, and recently) - in fact on the same day he and I both commented that our latest threads had dissolved into bickering and backbiting (and no, I was not completely innocent - and I admitted it in the thread).

Then a member posted the true court documents and it was revealed that the "hype" was just that - hype.

Too often people read an alarming headline and immediately think "Okay, that's it! I've had it!" without even looking at alternative stories of the event/incident.

THIS is why I ask "where did you hear that?" Was it Glenn Beck? I can show you what a liar and trouble-maker he is. Was it Fox News & Co.? Recently there was an article I saw entitled:

My Fox News Nightmare: How I Tortured Myself with The Propaganda of Ignorance

I'm a card-carrying member of the ACLU, so here's what happened when I watched 3 hours of Fox every day for a month...

(There are only three kinds of people in Bill O’Reilly’s world: good hardworking Americans, pinheads—people who are not actually malevolent but who are too stupid to understand the way the world really works—and evildoers.)

I know these things about O’Reilly because, for the entire month of October, I watched Fox News for approximately three hours every day, while at the same time strictly abstaining from any other sources of information about current events. The reason I engaged in this self-induced Fox News torture was that it had become clear that the right-wing media in general, and Fox News in particular, were constructing an alternate reality than the one I live in. Fox is, of course, a great driver of public opinion.


I have tried to talk to one of my siblings about it: I suggest, "Just try it, for one week, and ignore your usual outlets. TRY to watch MSNBC, or CNN even - rather than listening to Limbaugh and Beck and watching Fox." My dear, smart sib wouldn't even consider it.

My mother has siblings who behave the same way - frothingly, rabidly, totally enamored and incensed by the nonsense they hear - just today I got a forwarded rant about Obama being a Kenyan Muslim from the former mentioned sib of mine, originating with a sib of my mom's. It's disturbing. These are good, educated, smart people - and they are falling for CRAP, and it upsets me.

That's why, folks, I want to know where you get your information. Please remember that very FEW news outlets are actually 'neutral' - if any at all. I balance my sources between NPR, CNN, local coverage (my city's newspaper does a good job at neutrality - McClatchy-based news) and reading sites like "The Blaze" to hold up against "Alternet", "Rightwingwatch", "Salon", "Consortium News" and other. Yes, I lean liberal and Progressive, but I am NOT a commie Nazi.



I believe too few people do this. And it's critically important.

edit on 2/2/14 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)


Oh yeah, and also, "I'm a french model."

edit on 2/2/14 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 2 2014 @ 10:33 AM
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reply to post by wildtimes
 


To be fair, if a person leaning more to the right did the same experiment with CNN or MSNBC, they would say the same kind of things. That CNN was painting their own version of reality, that doesn't mesh with the real world etc etc. All the major "news" channels cater to either the left or the right.

They are all propaganda outlets, every single one of them. Most people just stick with one of them that they agree more with, and that's that. If you are a liberal, then fox is bashed. If you are a conservative then MSNBC is bashed. Not enough time to devote to verifying the accuracy of news, too many TV shows and sports to watch to bother with crap like the real world goings-on.

Sorry, I just get frustrated as hell. In order to attempt to find out what the hell is going on in the world, I have to subject myself to lots of polar mindcontroll propaganda, and hope that none of it rubs off on me.
edit on Sun, 02 Feb 2014 10:47:50 -0600 by TKDRL because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 2 2014 @ 06:34 PM
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I found this interesting. It was a poll that asked people which television network they trusted most when it came to news.

35% of those polled trust Fox News more than any other television news outlet. PBS earned second with 14%. ABC had 11%, CNN with 9%, CBS with 6%. And, at the very bottom was NBC, MSNBC, and Comedy Central, all at three percent.

They've run the poll for five years. Fox News has won every year.

www.breitbart.com...



posted on Feb, 2 2014 @ 06:54 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


I find it far more interesting that people would say that they actually TRUST a news source especially one that is on TV.


If they asked me my answer would be none of the above they all lie and manipulate.


All of them.



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