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More divisive: Obama or conservative rhetoric? or Why your rants just make liberals turn a deaf ear.

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posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 12:17 AM
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In my opinion, as a liberal, the President has failed to live up to his own hype: no meaningful banking reform, signing the extension to the Patriot Act, no single-payer healthcare or at least a public option, gitmo is still open, NSA surveillance is bigger than ever, etc.

That said, I think the rhetoric is disproportionately vitriolic. It's one thing to say he's a bad president (hell, even a bad person) but there's an obsession now with controversializing every word, every appointee, every crisis, every situation. He's evil, he wants to destroy America, he wants to usher in communism, he's the anti-christ (literally), he's a dictator, a tyrant, he's a crypto-Muslim who attended Rev Wright's (Christian) church because he's also a racist black power radical who wants to blow up white folks, a closet bi-sexual who had his former lovers assassinated, a Kenyan who faked his birth certificate, he wants to grab up all the guns and enslave everyone, put their children in government camps because he's a fascist, enact Shariah law, hand over the country to the Muslim Brotherhood though he considers himself a messiah, a Chicago thug who wants to ship guns to Mexican drug cartels so nobody notices his crony capitalism while simultaneously redistributing all of the wealth of hard working Americans to those lazy hood rats and welfare queens until everyone is equally poor and beholden to the government for everything.

All of a sudden everyone has become an overnight constitutional scholar and a Libertarian, a historian, biographer of the founding fathers, purveyors of their own rabid brand of truth, justice, and the American way.

Well folks, I have some bad news for you: This is business as usual. With the exception of the ACA, what would be so different if he'd lost? Bailouts for banks? The Republicans would have done that too (and Bush did). No drone strikes? The Republicans love drones, in fact in many regards the Obama administration's foreign policy is effectively no different than Bush's. Entitlement reform? Nobody would be cutting food stamps with unemployment this high. Why? Because no matter who wins the election, that person is part of the establishment and there is a certain level of consistency that the establishment demands. Where is your fury over the conservatively stacked SCOTUS selling us down the river in the Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission verdict so that more money could be poured into corrupting our government (and our brains)?

Has it occurred to anyone that nobody is changing anyone's minds or even discussing practical solutions to real-world problems? Most of these threads are just doom porn or faux-revolutionary musings where members of the right-wing mutual admiration society pat each other on the back. The same people star and flag ANY anti-Obama post, regardless of the substance and the same few liberals (like myself) roll our eyes and feel compelled to say *SOMETHING* just because it's gotten to the point of "WTF?!" only to be called Obama worshippers, communists, libtards, libturds, unpatriotic, stupid, etc. Your attempts at "saving" America are just making the other side defensive--you are not winning over ANY converts. This is not the American Revolution, none of you are Thomas Paine, this is the end of the first year of the current President's second term. He's not going to be impeached, guns are not going to be banned, Shariah law will not be imposed and in 3 years we'll elect another establishment figure because none of us will ever have a choice to elect someone who is not a part of the establishment. If you want to get serious about changing the way this country is run, get serious about something like campaign finance reform and stop whining about how great things used to be in your idealized view of the past as seen through a prism of false nostalgia.




posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 12:30 AM
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They be long to a mutualual
Add Mor Ray Shun
society, pa dump pa dum dump.
How you managed to get through that second paragraph in one breath is a mystery to me.
Now off to the chambers of silence which is Sunday night around here.



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 12:35 AM
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People's minds are opening and there is a change in consciousness world-wide.

No one is falling for the liberal/conservative BS anymore. It is a new day, my friend.

The time of partisan politics is going the way of the dodo.

It's going to be a fun ride.


edit on 2013/11/4 by Metallicus because: sp



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 12:36 AM
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stop whining about how great things used to be in your idealized view of the past as seen through a prism of false nostalgia.

Easy for you to say. You are growing up now. Remember we had jobs back then. We could own cars, go places see things. Now everything is too expensive. I'm lucky I have enough money to eat. You're the young bucks that should be storming the white house, if you can afford the gas to get there.

What do you expect a whole generation of nostalgic, idealistic viewing, prism colored, bifocal'd old people to do now?



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 01:06 AM
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theantediluvian
In my opinion, as a liberal, the President has failed

He's evil, he wants to destroy America, he wants to usher in communism, he's the anti-christ (literally), he's a dictator, a tyrant, he's a crypto-Muslim who attended Rev Wright's (Christian) church because he's also a racist black power radical who wants to blow up white folks, a closet bi-sexual who had his former lovers assassinated, a Kenyan who faked his birth certificate, he wants to grab up all the guns and enslave everyone, put their children in government camps because he's a fascist, enact Shariah law, hand over the country to the Muslim Brotherhood though he considers himself a messiah, a Chicago thug who wants to ship guns to Mexican drug cartels so nobody notices his crony capitalism while simultaneously redistributing all of the wealth of hard working Americans to those lazy hood rats and welfare queens until everyone is equally poor and beholden to the government for everything.

you are not winning over ANY converts.

I like what you had to say there
and the quoted text deserved to be repeated.

Has it occurred to you, that conservatives fully understand the nature of diametrically opposing viewpoints ... and we don't waste time trying to convert hopelessness?

ACA??? Did you mean ObamaramaCare? Yes ... it is hated, and no it can't work ... no matter how many times the mantra, "Yes, we can!" is repeated.

Obamarama will serve at least one useful purpose in the history of America, and that is to NEVER again allow an unqualified wo/man to reach a capacity of leadership in the United States again. The pain he is going to cause the Democratic Party is well earned. Hopefully Democrats will be too embarrassed to show up at the polls during voting season ... much the same as Republicans stayed home after Bush's numerous debacles.

Maybe ... just maybe ... people like you and I will get a candidate who actually cares about us instead of the party, special interests, or their own bank account. Not a lot of "hope" there, my friend, but there's gonna be a "change" come 2014. Bet on it!!



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 01:10 AM
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Double post
edit on 4112013 by Snarl because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 01:17 AM
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Metallicus
People's minds are opening and there is a charge in consciousness world-wide.

No one is falling for the liberal BS or the conservative crap anymore. It is a new day, my friend.

The time of partisan politics is going the way of the dodo.

It's going to be a fun ride.



I appreciate your optimism, but I unfortunately don't share it. Consider that Presidential campaigns run in the BILLIONS now. It's never been easier to pump money into politics and that money isn't being spent in support of candidates who aren't part of the establishment.



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 10:01 AM
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intrptr

stop whining about how great things used to be in your idealized view of the past as seen through a prism of false nostalgia.

Easy for you to say. You are growing up now. Remember we had jobs back then. We could own cars, go places see things. Now everything is too expensive. I'm lucky I have enough money to eat. You're the young bucks that should be storming the white house, if you can afford the gas to get there.

What do you expect a whole generation of nostalgic, idealistic viewing, prism colored, bifocal'd old people to do now?


There's a lot more agreement among people than ideologues would have us believe. Jobs are the number one issue in this country. "Entitlement" expenditures like food stamps are astronomical because people aren't working and many of those who have jobs are working for peanuts. For instance, the average age for fast food workers is 29! The average fast food worker makes something like $8.50/hr and that's not enough for most people to live on let alone support a family. Our largest private employer is Wal-mart, a company that imports shipload after shipload of junk, produced in Chinese factories and employs over a million people in jobs that are mostly poor paying. Our middle class is and has been in steady decline for a long time, our once expansive manufacturing base has been decimated and through it all, the wealthiest people just get richer.

It used to be that wealth in this country came from starting and growing a successful business that employed Americans to make a product or provide a service but that's all changed over the last 30+ years. That's a big reason why supply-side economics doesn't work--the money that is trickling down, is trickling down somewhere else. We need jobs and we need good paying jobs and without those, we're dying on the vine.



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 12:21 PM
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reply to post by theantediluvian
 

Well said. I agree we struggle while they bask in the rewards of our efforts. Too bad people need money. If they didn't this house of paper notes would serve only as their funeral pyre.

I wonder what its going to take to revert back to barter for goods and services? If done at the local level, there are no taxes to send up The Hill and no corporations to steal all the fruits of labor.

Small interdependent farming communities living off the land and providing for the local populace.



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 12:24 PM
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Truth is truth. Obama is destroying this country. Is it because he's so stupid or is he doing it on purpose? It can only be one or the other. Either way ... Obamacare will KILL and it's Obama's fault ... and that's the truth of the matter.



posted on Nov, 4 2013 @ 02:19 PM
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FlyersFan
Truth is truth. Obama is destroying this country. Is it because he's so stupid or is he doing it on purpose? It can only be one or the other. Either way ... Obamacare will KILL and it's Obama's fault ... and that's the truth of the matter.


This is exactly the type of irrational doomsayer hyperbole that I'm referring too. Would you care to expand on what in particular, "destroying this country" means to you? I'll assume by what you've said that you believe "Obamacare" will lead to an increased mortality rate (and apparently a massive increase).

If the ACA actually fails, it will go something like this:

- The ratio of sick people to healthy people purchasing plans through the exchange will result in a risk pool that forces insurers to cut costs or raise premiums. Until 2018, unless the law is changed, the rate of increase is fixed and there are provisions to offset the costs.

- After 2018, with too many sick people in the risk pools for exchange plans, the costs of premiums will eventually exceed the costs of non-exchange plans to the extent that a feedback loop ensues, resulting in healthier people who require less coverage opting for cheaper non-exchange plans, further exacerbating the disparity in exchange and non-exchange plans' risk pools.

Here's an article from Forbes that does a good job of explaining this possibility.

This isn't something that could happen overnight, it would be years in the making with ample opportunity to reform, replace, or repeal the ACA. I'm not even arguing that the ACA will succeed, but the result in either case doesn't even approach destruction of our country. I think that in many cases, the truth isn't sordid enough to be the fix that some people's self-righteous indignation addictions require.



posted on Nov, 5 2013 @ 06:50 AM
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theantediluvian
This is exactly the type of irrational doomsayer hyperbole that I'm referring too. Would you care to expand on what in particular, "destroying this country" means to you?

Truth is truth. What is irrational is anyone who defends what Obama has done to this country. If you can't see the deadly mess Obama has made of the health care system in this country, then there is no use trying to have a rational conversation with you.

Pre-Obamacare, 85% of this country had healthcare that they wanted and that worked for them. Now, tens of millions will lose it and/or have to pay up to double for a reduced health care that THEY CAN"T AFFORD. Hospitals are dropping Obamacare. Doctors are dropping Obamacare. Insurance companies are dropping entire states. PEOPLE WILL DIE and the country WILL GO BROKE with Obamacare. It's deadly and UNSUSTAINABLE. Those are the facts.

He fundamentally changed this country .. just as he said he would. Before Obama ... it was working. Now it is not. It's just that simple. The train we are all on is going supersonic toward a cliff and no one is putting on the breaks. We are the laughing stock of the world.

Stage 4 Cancer Sufferer Unhappy with Obamacare
This is what happens when the government gets involved.
And this is just one story of many that are out there.
edit on 11/5/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)




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