The ONLY solution is a third party......

Many say the two party system "sucks".

I amend that and say the two party system sucks when both parties suck. Not the system...the parties!

For years I've been against having a third party. Largely due to the Ross Perot phenomenon. Perot siphoned off enough votes to give Clinton the electoral college even though in neither election did he even reach the 50% mark of popular votes.

Events have changed my mind.

There is sufficient corruption in both parties-KNOWN by both parties-that we have a M.A.D.-like situation. (mutually assured destruction.)

If one exposes the other's "Faux Pas" , the other instantly retaliates. Tax exempt groups with their hidden donations, both sides, on and on.

Both are too corrupt to risk exposing the other's corruption.

That's where a third party comes in. It hasn't had the time to get corrupted itself enough to suffer collateral damage from that exposure. Rather, it gains from that exposure. It's vested interest is in exposing that corruption as people will flock to their banner both for it's "courage" , it's "convictions" and it won't have disaffected anyone as of yet.

With enough members, assassination, literal and character, will not be effective as a replacement is just waiting to take over the battle for themselves.

This could work...maybe.

The only drawback I can see so far, is the damage this exposure could do to the country could be worse than a default, an economic collapse. P.R. wise and trust-wise, both domestically and internationally.

I probably haven't though this out enough and have missed some points. Thoughts?

reply to post by nwtrucker


I'm so tired of hearing people say this. There is a third party, it's called the Libertarian party and it's legitimate and is true to Constitutional values. I don't know what's more disturbing, people not voting for Libertarians on election day or people that don't know there is a third party in the first place.......

Helious
reply to post by nwtrucker

 

I'm so tired of hearing people say this. There is a third party, it's called the Libertarian party and it's legitimate and is true to Constitutional values. I don't know what's more disturbing, people not voting for Libertarians on election day or people that don't know there is a third party in the first place.......

Yes, i find disturbing that too.So long OP and you dont know about Gary Johnson

reply to post by nwtrucker


The only solution is to deny the two-party system; not introduce a third player. Rebuff the notion that you can be put shoved into a square hole when you are clearly round; or triangular; or even rhombus-like.

While we will always gravitate to like-minded people and that is a protected and honored Right, it doesn't mean we need to have this nonsensical Red vs. Blue mentality. By adding Purple, it fixes nothing excepts furthers the power base of Washington and erodes the natural power of the People.

reply to post by Helious


I know, I didn't even think of them when I started the thread.

Maybe that's the Libertarian party's fault, not ours. Just what have they "exposed"? What traction have they developed over the years? Or are they just another "siphon group" that detracts from the right?

I don't wish to offend you, but, that's my gut reaction.

There's also the issue of religion and it's "distancing" itself...a huge mistake in my estimation.

The Judeo-Christian moral code was the bedrock that allowed the Constitution to flourish in the first place.

In this current environment, no constitution would survive the moral level we find ourselves now.

But that's an issue for later, IMO. First is exposure, officially, not the web, that starts the cleansing process.

Without it, we are doomed.

Helious
reply to post by nwtrucker

 

I'm so tired of hearing people say this. There is a third party, it's called the Libertarian party and it's legitimate and is true to Constitutional values. I don't know what's more disturbing, people not voting for Libertarians on election day or people that don't know there is a third party in the first place.......

The Green Party is also a legitimate third party.

buster2010
The Green Party is also a legitimate third party.

Not contending here but what makes a party "legitimate"? Federal recognition?

The vast majority of the American public doesn't know or believe anything they don't see on TV. Libertarians are not unelectable because of their platform, but because the media ignores (or at most belittles and then dismisses) them.

If the media granted (willingly, mind you--we don't need any more state regulation of information) equal exposure to the Libertarian party as it does to Democrats and Republicans, the Libertarians would win both houses of Congress and the Presidency in a landslide.

Of course the media will never do that, because they are simply another arm of the statist propaganda machine. Dreams of a third-party political reformation in a country comprised of people totally ignorant to the manipulation all around them are, unfortunately, futile. They won't/can't vote for anyone who isn't preordained as a "suitable option" by those who regulate the flow of information.

Libertarians are obviously not "suitable options" in a fascist dictatorship.

reply to post by ownbestenemy


Ok, sounds nice. What's the alternative? No parties, no groups? Nothing but local vested interests instead of national ones?

Those that believe in the goals of the Founding Fathers have every right to form a group as does every other viewpoint.

Banning parties is just another arbitrary that opens the door to a pure charisma-like person running the show.

I stand for things, I believe in things, I have a right, as you do, to spend my time with like-minded individuals. Call them parties, called the pals, buddies, whatever label you choose.

There is strength in numbers and I, for one, feel more comfortable amongst them and to live with them. Not just individuals, but Like-mind individuals.

Does that make sense?

reply to post by ownbestenemy


Broad resonance, nation-wide with vast numbers flocking to and contributing to their goals, comes to mind.

Maybe it's just a P.R. issue. A lack of proper promotion. I dunno.

I'm betting a Constitutional Party would resonate. Liberty AND responsibility!!

nwtrucker
Ok, sounds nice. What's the alternative? No parties, no groups? Nothing but local vested interests instead of national ones?

Those that believe in the goals of the Founding Fathers have every right to form a group as does every other viewpoint.

I never argued for banning them; I even highlighted it was a Natural Right protected.

Does that make sense?

Yes it does. I contend with the notion of how we have set up the system and have altered the political landscape (via the 17th Amendment) and how the People themselves, in the various States, have allowed the "two-party" system to rule their elections.

reply to post by nwtrucker


We have three main parties in Canada and it's NOT a solution. All three are corrupt to the core. What we need are laws that limit the effects of these assclowns in government, make them responsible and accountable for their actions and if they take kickbacks, play the nepotism game, launder money, commit any political or criminal act that detrimentally effects the citizenry, etc., we get to hang 'em (after as fair a trial as they'd give any of us).

I've got 1/2" rope and big-ass trees with nice strong branches in the front and backyards ;-) In the cities they'll just have to make do with lamp posts.

Cheers - Dave

nwtrucker
reply to post by Helious

 

I know, I didn't even think of them when I started the thread.

Maybe that's the Libertarian party's fault, not ours. Just what have they "exposed"? What traction have they developed over the years? Or are they just another "siphon group" that detracts from the right?

I don't wish to offend you, but, that's my gut reaction.

There's also the issue of religion and it's "distancing" itself...a huge mistake in my estimation.

The Judeo-Christian moral code was the bedrock that allowed the Constitution to flourish in the first place.

In this current environment, no constitution would survive the moral level we find ourselves now.

But that's an issue for later, IMO. First is exposure, officially, not the web, that starts the cleansing process.

Without it, we are doomed.

Now first, you're on about a whole bunch of topics there that don't quite fit together. Let me speak to the point I can discern from your post.

It's not the libertarians fault more people don't know about them. They are there, at election time, have been for better than a decade, even on national TV and presidential debates. They are not selling some new amazing product that promises to fix the ails of the entire planet, they are simply offering to restore our Republic back to what is was founded to do.

I don't think you personally or for that matter a large portion of the American public realizes how far we have actually strayed from our founding documents, mired in presidential mandate and glazed over in congressional lobbying. All America or it's people really needs is a little common sense when addressing political ideology and understand that creating any law should be in benefit for the people by the people.

That is the way forward, that is the way to undo the harm that has been caused, laws should reflect only on benefitting those that they serve, as should politicians. The Constitution is the only justification for American government, it only makes sense that they hold it the most dear because without it, they have no legitimacy at all over 320 million Americans.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

Take exception to the bold print. It's why we have a government in the first place.

Ok, i have an authentic idea.

Lets start a party called the Lets Make Descions That Benefit America party, we can make it an acronym LMDTBA.

It will catch on really quick because we have a war being waged on us and we cant even see it.

onequestion
Ok, i have an authentic idea.

Lets start a party called the Lets Make Descions That Benefit America party, we can make it an acronym LMDTBA.

It will catch on really quick because we have a war being waged on us and we cant even see it.

So, yeah, there is a party who does exactly that! It's called the Libertarian party!

reply to post by Helious


I don't see anything in your post I disagree with.

Yet, what really gets my juices flowing is the idea of exposure and justice for those that have betrayed our trust in them.

A head on a pike...MANY heads on many pikes. LOL.

That's what floats my boat right now. Push that, and if no others do, I will enlist. (swore I'd never do that again..LOL).

With 17 trillion in debt, continual trillion plus deficits per year and a monstrous looming mandatory spending in the horizon I think it is a bit late for a third party.

Just wondering how long before the this illusion of a viable economy lasts.

(and you all had a chance in voting / supporting Ron Paul)

nwtrucker
reply to post by Helious

 

I don't see anything in your post I disagree with.

Yet, what really gets my juices flowing is the idea of exposure and justice for those that have betrayed our trust in them.

A head on a pike...MANY heads on many pikes. LOL.

That's what floats my boat right now. Push that, and if no others do, I will enlist. (swore I'd never do that again..LOL).

Thank you for the reply. I appreciate that you can understand what I am saying and it really isn't partisan as far as left or right is concerned. The law of the land, to which, the country was founded, the ideal that no matter how hard the federal government tries to subdue true law, to snuff out, to obscure, will ultimately be denied because we understand and appreciate our foundation and history. Americans are sleepy, not dead. As it was with the rise of the Nazi party, Americans will be late to the fray but ultimately will not be absent.

What is of importance to individuals who maintain views that are separate from the current "regimes" to keep in mind is that there is still, as of today, a time and a place to voice or empowerment those ideals. No good will come from irrational speech or action before that time has been naturally achieved. Those that wish a return to natural values and a republic worthy of Americans must realize that the rule of law is still in effect and that change can still be achieved by traditional methods.

I say this because some Anarchists in America would have you believe that full out revolt is the only way we can attain a step back and reign in the unjust laws but I will state that without any question, an assault of words, of values and of logic to win the hearts the awareness and the minds of Americans is far more effective than any hail of bullets could ever be.

reply to post by Helious


Just imagine how good our country would be right now if Gary Johnson had been elected. I am libertarian.

The problem the Libertarian Party has, is that it is misunderstood.

The people who think libertarians are anti-religion, and pro illicit drug use for everyone. No thanks to complete ashats like bill maher, who at times insinuates he is libertarian.

They are ALL corrupt! It's a wash folks, we tried, they failed, we failed, the whole system is infected with self interest! You can't get high enough in politics to even look toward the Oval Office without having been bought and paid for. What about the people above the POTUS, the one's pulling the strings because he/she "owes" them?!

The ONLY solution is a REVOLUTION, and no, not a Ron Paul Revolution either! The 2nd American Revolution, except this time we are seeking Independence from our corrupt system. Who knows, if We The People actually rise up and revolt we may just find that we are supported by outside sources like we were the first time around!

Why are we beating a dead horse?! It's getting us nowhere... fast, faster and faster with every election within the failing system! We are lied to, robbed, cheated, bamboozled and hoodwinked at every turn and all we do is whine and cry, finger point and pass blame! IT IS OUR OWN DAMN FAULT! Now we need to rise up, open our eyes and hit the RESET button. It's time to admit this experiment in governing was an Epic Fail, learn from the mistakes and take our a$$es back to the drawing board!