Extraction of the Moon (Mu???)

Hello, fellow ATSers.

I wasnt sure about the best place to post this topic as it involves space, earth, science and religion, but Im a Christian, so here it is.

I've been doing some research in the Hebrew text regarding the creation of the moon, and I have found something that many of you may find interesting.

But first, just to give you an idea of my theological views, I am a Christian dispensationalist, and I believe that the bible makes it clear that God's holy calendar for the 'mowedim' is solar only. It was originally based on a 360 day solar orbit that I believe was extended to 365.25 days as a result of the flood. It starts and ends with the veral equinox. King David appointed 2 generals to over see the military for each month, totaling 24 Generals for all 12 months of the year. A lunar year only has 355 days which will cause the holy days to slip out of season after 2 or 3 years. To fix this issue, the Jews who falsely observe a Babylon derived lunar calendar, must insert a 13th intercalary month every 2 or 3 years to keep the holy days in season. The bible never authorizes the observance of the moon for determining the new month ('Rosh Chodesh' is mistraslated as new moon). And furthure more, the bible certainly never mentions the existance of a 13th month.

With that aside, the question is raise; How was this error started? The answer is simple: Genesis 1:14-18 does not even mention the moon at all. When viewing these texts in Hebrew, it becomes apparent that the only two words for 'moon' ('yareach' and 'labana') are missing. Instead, we find the word 'ha'maor' for luminaries. So essentially, Genesis 1:14-18 says that God uses the Sun for ruling the day, and the stars to have dominion over the night. As far as i can tell, the end of Gen 1:16 "...the stars also", really belong to verse 17 as the opening of a new sentence. So Gen 1:16 and 17 should look more like this:

16 And God made the two great categories of luminaries. The greater luminary for the day, and the lesser luminary for the night. 17And the stars He set in the firmament of the heavens to shine light on the earth and to separate the day from the night.

Keep in mind, that paleo Hebrew did not use word spacing, punctuation marks, or verse numbers. Also notice that the singular word 'ha maor' for light is also used to describe the ambient light that collectively comes off of the mehorah, which actually has 7 bulbs for light.

So, since the moon is not a luminary, since its not always visible at night but sometimes is during the days, and since even Job 25:5 acknowledges that the moon only reflects light, the only logical conclusion when taking Gen 1:14-18 literally is that God was not talking about the moon in these verses. So Gen 1:14 only authorizes the use of the Sun, and the stars for day, years and holy feasts.

So, why is it that God fails to identify the moon in the creation account of Genesis? Is it possible that the moon my not have even existed until after the flood???

I will now direct your attention to

Gen 8:22 "While the earth remains, Seedtime and harvest, And cold and heat, And summer and winter, And day and night Shall not cease."
And

Psalm 104:19 "He made the moon for the seasons (Holy Days); The sun knows the place of its setting."

Notice how in Gen 8:22, God promised Noah that as long as the earth remains, there will be 4 perpetual seasons...almost as if He is introducing the precession of the equinox for the first time in history.

The, notice how Psalm 104:19 says that the moon was created for the holy days, not "marking the holy days".

I believe these two verses have a close relationship. It is my hypothesis that prior to the flood, the earth orbited the sun on an up right axis every 360 days. Each month had 30 days, as the flood waters persisted for 5 months of 30 days. Since the earth was not tilted, there would not be a precession of the equinox. So, I think a canopy of water created a uniform spring climate on the entire earth.
So why would God say the moon is for the holy days in psalm 104:19, when the lunar month is only an average of 29 days long?

I feel the answer is in the precession of the equinox. See, the Holy days must be kept in their season, and the orbit of our moon is what keeps our 23.5 degree axial tilt stable. It results in four seasons and 26,000 year wobble cycle. Therefore, the spontaneous creation of the moon would have knocked earth off of its axis, and started the precession of the equinox.

So where did the moon come from??

Well, Genesis 1 indicated that at some point, there was only one continent. I believe that according to the Electric Universe theory, our planet was created from the plasma z-pinch effect from an unstable Gas Giant. If the sun birthed the Gas Giants, and the Gas Giants birthed the terrestrial planets, then it stand to reason that the terrestrial planets may have birthes their rocky moons.

So essentially, at some point, earth became over charged electrically (possibly due to a comet, planet x, or some kind of mega solar fit) and in its attempt to seek stability, it ejected an entire continent which became the moon. This crustal displacement would have released the flood waters of the deep, and punched a hole in the water canopy.

Notice how we only see one face of the moon. Is this tidal locking, or magnetic locking? The moon does have a magnetic field, but it is over powered by earth's.

Also notice how the face we see is relatively smooth, like a rapidly frozen mantle, yet the other side has mountain ranges and craters that eerily resemble plasma scarring . Perhaps this would substanciate all those "structures on the moon claimes".

Notice how the earth and the moon share the same water, oxygen, and titanium isotopes.

Notice how the moon can comfortably fit in the deepest recesses of the Pacific basin.

Science claimes that earth is 4 billion years old, and the moon is 4.5 billion years old, but the moon is pelted with solar radiation on a daily basis. This could accelarate radioactive decay.

I believe that the earth is much older than 6 thousand years, but that the earth was restored in 6 days after being made desolate from an angelic war. It is civilization that is 6000 years old.

I have heard about the lost continent of Mu. This may or may not be relavent, but notice how similar 'Mu' is to 'Moon'. So, maybe the word month also comes from Mu.

So perhaps the moon has only been in orbit for about 4,500 years.

Let the discussion begin.

If you base your scientific views on what the bible says, it's not scientific at all. The bible doesn't say how the moon was created, so any conclusion you come to based on its creation based on the bible probably isn't right.

The moon was most likely created billions of years ago when the Earth was still molten. While it was molten, an asteroid most likely hit it and a piece broke off and formed into the moon we see today. That's what real science says. A piece breaking off and creating the flood is a bit out there honestly and has no basis in reality or physics.

What You are seeking may shake Your beliefs. What if You found out Life really didn't begin on Earth? This may shake Your belief in science or ???

With that being typed, were You able to find out why 12 months of the year and 12 hrs. for both day/night?

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Remove a piece the size of the moon, and the waters sure will go dancing in every direction, especially after a HIT...
Why do you find it "laughable" that the waters would move and create a monstrous tsunami?...

------

I think the thread is very well done, and I like the idea that is presented. As it is, it is novel to me.

Now let's look into it instead of simply complaining.

the reason the hebrews have such a cumbersome calendar is because they started out with the chaldean
as slaves in egypt, they switched to the egyptian 360 day/year, and after a while post exodus had to switch back to 365
and then adjust for the uncounted .25 days a year.

it's a rube golberg of a calendar

NowanKenubi
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

 

Remove a piece the size of the moon, and the waters sure will go dancing in every direction, especially after a HIT...
Why do you find it "laughable" that the waters would move and create a monstrous tsunami?...

------

I think the thread is very well done, and I like the idea that is presented. As it is, it is novel to me.

Now let's look into it instead of simply complaining.

I like it too. And I think it's a shame when someone puts forth a novel idea, using "what ifs" and "I think" and "maybe's," only to be slapped for thinking outside of the box by responses saying, in essence, "No. You're wrong. Because I say that Science says you are!"

NOBODY, even all the "Einsteins" past and present, knows with complete certainty how the Earth-- much less the Moon-- really materialized. It's ALL speculation, when you get down to brass tacks.

I know, I know... the Scientific Method is the path to Truth, and Scientific Theory is really acceptable as proof, and the Laws of Physics must not be broken, etc...

To all that I say, first of all Scientist themselves disagree on many things! Plus, Science has always discovered evidence that debunks it's own "known facts." Scientific knowledge is a trendy thing, as far as I can see. In fact, the definition of Science says it is the study of the things, NOT the final say on them!

science |ˈsīəns| noun
the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.


I don't mean to rant, but I really wish people would keep all of that in mind, and use more "I believe's" and "Most scientists believe..." in their arguments, instead of "No. You're wrong. Period."

We desperately need thinkers in this world. We cannot afford to squelch that. It may be the only way we overcome some of the problems this world is facing. Radical ideas from the common man that Science would never believe. You never know, you know?

reply to post by BELIEVERpriest

I believe that the bible makes it clear that God's holy calendar for the 'mowedim' is solar only.

My suggestion would be to not worry about when mow`edim is supposed to be celebrated.
As a Christian, you should think that Jesus saw certain spiritual significance in holidays, and maybe because these were times when he thought that people would be in a state of mind to be receptive of his message.
But Jesus himself is the fulfillment of the spiritual expectations of the world, and not just the Jews.

reply to post by NowanKenubi


Of course an asteroid would create a tsunami, but a tsunami that covers the entire Earth? No, that's ignoring the fact that an asteroid big enough to do that would wipe all life off of Earth, including Noah and his family. Plus, Genesis attributes it to raining 40 days and 40 nights, if it was an asteroid, I'm sure god would have mentioned it in his book.

An asteroid didn't hit Earth 6,000 years ago and create the moon. It's preposterous and in no way based in reality. Sorry, but that's how I see it. No offense toward anyone is intended with me saying so.

LewisStulePhD
What You are seeking may shake Your beliefs. What if You found out Life really didn't begin on Earth? This may shake Your belief in science or ???

With that being typed, were You able to find out why 12 months of the year and 12 hrs. for both day/night?

Well, I believe the Yahweh Elohim created the Angels as creatures of light (electromagnetic radiation) in the spirit-heaven dimension, then spoke the Universe into creation for these Angels to enjoy. This would have been a perfect universe. The Angels inhabited Earth, probably Mars and the other plantets, coming and going from heaven (Jacob's latter). But Lucifer's rebellion spaked a war that desolated all or parts of this Universe (Earth included). And God restored Earth and parts of our solar system, in 6 days, to provide Man (earth-man) a place to thrive. The spiritual experiment of mankind's existence is being scrutinized by the Angels in the High Courts of Heaven, as the Human experiment will be the grounds for the final resolution of the Angelic Conflict. The ejection of the moon at the flood could simply be the aftermath of but one battle in the Kosmokrator War.

Atleast, thats what I see in the ancient text of the Bible.

God creates Angels, the Universe for Angels (Job 38:4-7).

Earth becomes desolate due to Pre-human civilization. (Jeremiah 4:23-27)

So I do believe in integlligent life beyond Humanity.

Think about this, in our present orbital path, there are only two days of the year when there are exactly 12 hours of day and 12 hours of night. Thats on the spring and fall equinoxes.

The average lunar year is 354.75 days, the average solar year is 365.25 days, the average luni-solar year is 360 years even. Why is the difference so proportional?

jmdewey60
reply to post by BELIEVERpriest

 

I believe that the bible makes it clear that God's holy calendar for the 'mowedim' is solar only.

My suggestion would be to not worry about when mow`edim is supposed to be celebrated.
As a Christian, you should think that Jesus saw certain spiritual significance in holidays, and maybe because these were times when he thought that people would be in a state of mind to bpe receptive of his message.
But Jesus himself is the fulfillment of the spiritual expectations of the world, and not just the Jews.

I have to disagree with you. God gave the Jews a prophetic calendar to track the accuracy of the true Messiah's actions. If the Jews reject the calendar, the they miss their Messiah.

Think about this, how could Jesus eat the Passover feast if He was the Lamb?

No, I think Jesus was arrested on the 10 th of Abib, and crucified on the 14 th....in accordance with setting aside the Lamb on the 10th, and sacraficing it on the 14th. The Pharisees and Sadducees had the public on a false calendar. The Book of Jubilee speaks a little about this.

So knowing the Mowedim was critical to the Hebrews.

reply to post by BELIEVERpriest

God gave the Jews a prophetic calendar to track the accuracy of the true Messiah's actions.

What is the "Jews' Messiah"?
I don't think that you could be a Christian if you think that Jesus is not the Messiah.

According to the Christian Bible, otherwise known as the New Testament, the true Jews became Christians.
If you are worshiping the false Jews, you are committing idolatry as far as I am concerned.
And if you think the modern Israelis are Hebrews, then you are mistaken.
They are predominantly Polish Ashkenazi Jews who are descended from converts to Judaism in the eighth century and are not descended from Abraham.

I think that you drank the Dispensationalist Kool-Aid, with all this misplaced zionism.
Normal Christians call the Old Testament by that name for a reason.
It is obsolete and defunct, and serves no purpose even to people rightly descended from the Hebrews.

reply to post by jmdewey60


You misunderstood my post. I mean that the Jews rejected Jesus, the true messiah, because they practiced the wrong calendar. Jesus was arrested and crucified on time. The Jews missed the event because of the Lunar calendar. And you falsely assume that I am a Zionist. I am totally neutral in regards to modern Israel. Today's Israel is not fulfillment of prophecy.

reply to post by BELIEVERpriest


Brilliant!

Can you show us any links to back up claims, like the moons mass fitting in the pacific, or the science behind it?

Great read tho, fantastic

9 for the known planets + Planet X or Greek for 10 + 1 for the Sun + 1 for the Moon = 12.

9 + 1 + 1 + 1 = 12 Was it the Sumerians that taught us to count or some other entity prior to that?

Continued good luck in Your search, | hope You find what it is You seek.

namaste

reply to post by BELIEVERpriest

Today's Israel is not fulfillment of prophecy.

I agree there, but you didn't answer my question, or I didn't say it right.
Who is it exactly then that you mean by "The Jews"?

reply to post by jmdewey60


By the Jews, I mean the Hebrew race in general. That means both Saphardic and Ashkenazi split-offs. Im aware of the Khazarian theory. As far as I can tell, the some Hebrews did migrate to the Caucus mountains, and did mix with the Khazars. Then, some made their way back to Palestine and usurped the land with the help of the League of Nations. I assume that the Ashkenazis are a mix of pretenders and authentic Hebrews. I dont think anyone is in any possition to say that they are or are not Hebrews across the board, one way or another. Some are, and some arent. Its not for me to reckon.

Hebrews or not, I dont advocate Zionism, as it is a man made effort to counterfeit prophecy. The best thing to do as a nation about the Israeli Catch-22 is to stop feeding tax dollars to the bullies and let them reap what the sow. Either way God is capable of disciplining and delivering His people. Christians should stay out of it.

Beavers
reply to post by BELIEVERpriest

 

Brilliant!

Can you show us any links to back up claims, like the moons mass fitting in the pacific, or the science behind it?

Great read tho, fantastic

The moon coming from earth is a popular theory. Its just that modern cosmology says that it happened billions of years ago. Im arguing that it may have happened as recently as 4,465 years ago, if my calculations are correct.

Here is a link about various moon theories.

www.pbs.org...

This link talks about the formation of planets via z-pinch. Its based on Plasma Cosmology.

liamscheff.com...

My theory is a hybrid of the two.

reply to post by BELIEVERpriest


After doing more searching last night, I found this:

I have to be honest, some may take this as a refutation of my theory, but I think my theory can co-exist with these passages as these simply generalize God's creative power.

Psalm 148:5 using a stem of the word 'bara' (to create or to elect into existance) along with the word for decree, to illustrate that God decreed (or predestined) the creation of the Heavens, Earth, Sun, Moon, Stars, and all life under them, before actually taking action. I think this is an acknowledgment of God's creating power and not a chronological account of the creation process. Gen 1 gives us more detail.

Psalm 136:9 This verse uses a stem of 'asah', which means to accomplish or manufacture after a pre-ordained standard. Contrasting this verse from Gen 1:14-18, it tells us that the moon was indeed made for the night, however, I feel it was a latter upgrade to the existing sky. 'Asah' is used in Psalm 104:19 to say the moon was accomplished for the seasons.

Gen 1:14-16 offers a pre-lunar sky, Gen 8:22 introduces the 4 seasons, Psalm 104:19 connects the seasons with the moon, psalm 136 gives a post flood view of the sky, and psalm 148 packages it neatly as a divine decree of a divine plan that predates all existance.

This is my latest installment.

Mom is similar to Moon...has the M and the O

Perhaps instead of Mu because there is that U that Mom is instead the moon? Oh...wait Mother Earth gave birth to Moon

Mom moon....

reply to post by BELIEVERpriest


I owe ATS a sincere apology. After analyzing the uses of the Hebrew accusitive cases, "a'yth", "we'yth", "o'then", it becomes more obviouse that the moon was in existance before man, gen 1:16 and 17 are parsed correctly, and thoght the moon reflects, it can be considered a luminary.

So, sorry, but my theory is indeed invalid.