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NSA uses "Copyright Infringement" to silence criticism/free speech

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posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 10:52 AM
reply to post by rockn82

But I didn't miss the point - I was merely pointing to the fact of how many Logo's there are out there being used by NSA ...................AND would they have gone so ridiculously far as to try to falsely claim a CR on all of them?......I want you to know how absurd the NSA really is !!!!.......SO - if you'll pardon me - I understand the situation quite well.

edit on 21-8-2013 by YodHeVauHe because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:05 AM
Copyright infringement occurs, primarily, when you use someone else's creative works, for gain. You can't make t-shirts using someone else's logo and sell them. That's the illegal part. He can make those shirts and give them away...but he CAN NOT SELL THEM!

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:20 AM
reply to post by YodHeVauHe

Well you're going to have to forgive me for being unable to garner all that from the incredibly lengthy post you left me in response.

Which one ? Or are they all copyrighted?

[image snipped]

I understand how ridiculous it is to use copyright infringement as a justification for shuttering a product based on a parody. I thought I made that clear in the second post I made. Perhaps I lost you somewhere. Let me know if you wish for clarification on something before you go "postal". There's no reason we can't be civilized. However, if you're going to give me a sarcastic or rude reply at least be decent enough to leave it for me in more than seven words.

Now before this degrades any further, I shall take my leave. I don't wish to detract from this thread, I just wanted to share my thoughts.

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:35 AM

Originally posted by rockn82
reply to post by YodHeVauHe

Partial quote
This is not meant to be inflamatory, but I wonder if the owners would shut down ATS rather than give up all it's users' data. If push came to shove that is. The recent thread from SkepticOverlord ""Cowardly" Groklaw, Lavabit ..." would seem to say that they wouldn't but putting up a parody in the voice of the first amendment would be a wonderful way to give a collective single finger salute to those government agency bullies.

Your comments are inflammatory by their very nature -

For my own part - I have always been somewhat troubled by the rather sinister "Avatar presence" of most of the Mods and Admins here on ATS. These Avatars are ever changing by the way, but never for the better as it seems. Take for example Springer's recent incarnation as the "menacing overlord." Their visual bearing is somewhat threatening in its tone, and seems to me to be expressive of a need to control. These thoughts led me to question their motive(s) for appearing so "Blackwater(ish)" in their appearance and in their aggressive tone.

Given that - I have already given the question you have asked, and the points that you are making some considerable thought recently, and in light of my experience(s) here I think that taking ATS's so-called monetizing "business model" into account - not only would they give it up - its likely (to this observer) that they already have. Sorry to have to say that, but there are several factors that lead me to that conclusion not the least of which are the "freedom of speech" and extremely intrusive advertising issues that I have been arguing about, and pointing to in recent postings - at the risk of being banned of course. So be it.

edit on 21-8-2013 by YodHeVauHe because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 12:05 PM

Originally posted by YodHeVauHe

Originally posted by rockn82
reply to post by YodHeVauHe

See, now we are having a conversation. : )
My comments were meant to be thought provoking for the site owners. Especially since one is calling other site owners cowardly. I can definitely understand your thoughts on some people's avatars as they are 'interesting' to say the least. However, it could be that they are just attempting to play the cool card. I'm not sure how long ago I joined, but I mostly just peruse this site. Every now and then I pop in my thoughts. During this time I have seen some censorship in several areas here. Some was certainly necessary and some was certainly WTF.

But before I derail this thread with my wandering thoughts, I am going to try to take it back to the NSA and copyrights.
I wonder what would happen if they actually did throw the parody of a logo at the top of this site and buckle up for the ride. Would the site come under instant fire? Would they just let it go because of the "crazy conspiracy people" that come here. Would the owners fight to keep it or remove it? They'd certainly have my support in doing such and standing on principles.

As for a logo being copyrighted, I can understand that. If people are allowed to copy and use official logos, certainly they could put together some official looking documents with them. When considering using a parody of official logos the story changes. There is no way to confuse something as such with the real thing. Copyright also allows for this.

If I am truly mistaken then all websites that host user uploaded content are in some serious trouble because there are parody's uploaded by the thousands every day.
edit on 21-8-2013 by rockn82 because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 03:58 PM
I'm confused by a couple of things, would appreciate clarification.

1. Satire is one thing, e.g. I put the logo in a newsletter or a comedy sketch. But when something is a saleable product and its only purpose is that satire/logo, is it the same thing? In other words, if they'd been giving the shirts away, or if the shirts had 5 different agency logos, do you think it would have been an issue?

2. If official sources based on taxpayer money cannot hold copyright on their art such as logos, what is to keep me from making a shirt, jacket,or ID card "implying" that I am an employee of those agencies?

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 03:59 PM
reply to post by WonderBoi

These are people owned, not copyrighted. But even if there is some exception to that, used in satire or parady, there is no copyright violation taking place. So whether you make Tshirts for sale, not giving them away because you're not a trillionaire who can donate 10 dollars per person or more, you can sell them. Or if you're a comedian making money from your stage performance, for example.

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 04:04 PM
reply to post by RedCairo

There are laws against impersonating an official. We arent talking about folks whose only recourse is suing for damages. They can imprison you. A whole different animal.
edit on 21-8-2013 by bigfatfurrytexan because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 04:42 PM
reply to post by Springer

And you know what, we are screwed; all of us and there is nothing we can do. Nothing. Look at the apathy country wide and not the member base and their views. That is the stark reality of the situation.

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 04:56 PM
Does anyone have a picture of the shirt? The reason I ask is ebay has boocoo NSA shirts so why are they not being pulled?

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 05:09 PM
Thanks for posting this.

Our govenment is disgusting on so many levels.

I am continually amazed and amused at what the people who work in government do, such as this sort of thing and much, much worse, and get away with it without consequence, without discipline, and keep their jobs, paychecks, and government benefits. There are so many who should be fired and stripped of all benefits for misconduct, and made to pay damages to their victims, and who should have been dismissed long ago, and should be serving lengthy prison terms.

The arrogance is unbelievable.

They do this sort of thing in the belief that they are immune to the consequences of their misconduct. So far, experience validates and encourages their arrangance.

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 05:34 PM
reply to post by Springer

Cant say i am not surprised my freind they have already targeted some sites.

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 06:35 PM
I'll simplify the issue: All right to free speech aside, the NSA is presumably funded by taxpayer money.

As a citizen, and presumably a taxpayer, he should be able to use that logo all he wants, as long as it's not used in a way that constitutes fraud (Impersonating LEO, etc). Perhaps the NSA owes him a refund on all the taxes he's ever paid in compensation for what he'll lose due to their actions.

Nice way to trample the dissidents, though. Very clever. Use laws designed to protect peoples' rights, in order to deny them. Very clever. Almost poetic, in a sick way.

And I can understand not wanting trouble, but shame on this company for not standing up for this guy in any way-- especially if technically what he did was legal.
edit on 21-8-2013 by iwilliam because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 07:47 PM
the T-shirt with the logo is NOT infringement, using the logo "under the color of law" is illegal.

see how easy that is.

If it WAS the NSA that requested the shirts be removed, they ( Huge surprised face) LIED (technically , committed perjury)

However, the logo it's self can be used by anyone to print on T-shirts and sell them.

This is NOT an isolated case, the government as a whole has treated the net as a second class medium for years

The difference between a place like ATS and the government, on free speech, is that this site is "owned" by private entities (the three amigo's) the government is "representing" us (the Public) in the US. The three amigo's (or their representatives) can tell us to shut up at any time, it's their house.

The Government may not tell me to shut up on ATS,(or other public venue's) for two reasons, one, again, they "represent" us, to do so they must "hear" us. and two, because this is private "property".

the Current situation in the Government is akin to grabbing sand, the tighter your hand squeezes, the more grains fall out, you are left with little to nothing.

cradling the sand in your open (free) hand, you lose little, and gain everything.........

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 10:43 PM
It is not hard to fix this problem.

2 easy steps

1. stop listening to the bullies
2. stop paying them

Bonus third step

3. Detain them and try them in a court of law that is not beholden to their interests.

(pro tip : demand the judge sign into the constitution to be liable by it this is standard practice which does not take place unless you demand it because of this fact courts can get away with crimes unless you declare the court to be constitutionally governed )

If you look at public records the American government foreclosed and sold out to a private corporation.
as did the Australian and British governments around the 1930s

Pointing out the obfuscation : In the constitution of Australia it is titled "The Government of the Commonwealth" they went bankrupt sold out to a corporation that changed their name to "The Government of Australia"

"The Republic of the United States"
"The Confederacy of America"
"The Perpetual Union"

Those are the names of the nations government

NOT "The American Government" that is just a corporation called that.

Read your constitutions: Obama has already bipassed congress which is unconstitutional and an impeachable offense

this is not conspiracy just fact.

he is another fun fact try to celebrate "Constitution Day" in public.
I garuntee you are tortured if captured by the police if they know what you are celebrating.
edit on 21-8-2013 by Gestas because: Knowledge

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:00 PM

Originally posted by NowanKenubi
reply to post by bobs_uruncle

Canadian bank notes have a copyright on them... lol

I can't believe this news, tho... What next?
edit on 20-8-2013 by NowanKenubi because: (no reason given)

Well, you could read up on invoicing the CRA for tax compliance and audits...LOL

Cheers - Dave

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:05 PM
I would have never believed America was so embroiled in fascism.

Until the people beg for it more

Security is 100% worse than freedom.
I would prefer and ideal walk around a lake rather than having my head stomped on by a jack boot for walking on the grass and drinking bottled water.

Obama ran on hope and change

Hitler ran on Hope and change


Burning of the reichstag

War on muslims

war on jews

Hitler was LOVED by Germans he was the best thing sliced bread to those living at the time.

The Nuremberg laws where imposed meaning all sorts of whacky shenanigans could get you arrested like owning a cat.

America presently has a burgeoning amount of laws that can get you arrested from anything from having hair to walking on the sidewalk to "stealing oxygen"

Air costs money those trees do hard labor.

Lawyers around the world cannot make sense of these laws but the NSA can why is that ?

Anyone else see a correlation ?


edit on 21-8-2013 by Gestas because: History repeats itself

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:09 PM
reply to post by Gestas

You are not so far from the truth, but will the truth comes out when the government has to explain why government logos and anything link to them use by citizens is a "Copyright Infringement", even in mockery cases.

That will expose what our government has been for decades a "corporate run and owned dictatorship" been this the truth then they are by all means protected by the law and in the rights to prohibit the use of government related property for public use.

After all didn't not The Supreme Court of the United States of America in 2010 took upon itself to recognize man made conglomerates as People, then our corporate owned government is now and has been a private owned government.

Anyway I am nothing but a conspirator in a conspiracy board forum ranting about what seems to be a conspiracy.

posted on Aug, 21 2013 @ 11:27 PM
Indeed if I run a corporation designed around bombing children

The corporation suffers not me who gave the orders and pulled this triggers.

This is just a way so that Obama cannot be impeached.

Presently the supreme court declares what Treason is they are not consitutionally governed and do not have to sign into the federal court if you demand it in-fact you will more than likely be detained for being in contempt of court and put in the hole for 30 days.

Just look at Bradley Manning's case he was found not guilty of the worst offenses and they took down his sentence to 35 years so it was not effectively a death sentence so people would not start fighting the power as it where.

You watch Obama take a third term "because the selections are supremely limited or the other candidates would damage the nation such as Romney or a terrorist attack takes place and they stall just like george bush did taking an extra amount of time when he should have NOT been governing which was around the same time all the money went missing and economic problems started and all crazy # happened that really changed the world all around the same time frame it need not be the exact same time because that would be too obvious they arn't just flailing in the dark here like alot of people like to think Politicians ARE NOT STUPID they are just going by a plan you don't know about.

Just like in warfare and war-gaming gambits pay off big-time but there's the opposite of a gambit a safe play.

so it cannot just be a coincidence the odds of that being a coincidence are so infinitesimally ludicrously high
that we might as well just call it totally impossible and it is actually political corruption.

The word does not exist for no reason.
Here let me educate:


Dishonest or fraudulent conduct by those in power, typically involving bribery.
The action of making someone or something morally depraved or the state of being so.

The use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims.

By definition Terrorists cannot be Insurgents or Freedom fighters in their own nation.
By definition it is a Government entity carrying out Terrorism.


Putting Ron Paul in the running was just meant to make us look else where like oh he lost.

Well the numbers say that's not possible that he lost he in-fact won.

So how come Ron Paul is not your president right now? oh they changed the laws when he won that's right.

Everything that is presently happening in America has already happened in the world it is nothing new.

edit on 21-8-2013 by Gestas because: Be strong brothers and sisters do not give in.

edit on 21-8-2013 by Gestas because: Wake up already damnit

posted on Aug, 22 2013 @ 01:46 AM
Just to update everyone:

So that means Bradley Manning and Edward Snowden are not criminals right? RIGHT ?

Yes it does.
edit on 22-8-2013 by Gestas because: (no reason given)

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