The Afterlife Revealed... Step By Step

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by RP2SticksOfDynamite
Semantics dont change the fact that dead is dead!!
Dellusion doesnt change that fact!!

Like I said .... we are energy and energy doesn't die. Only the shell dies.
Semantics doesn't change that fact.

Individual atoms, yes.
Carbon will be carbon; oxygen, hydrogen and nitrogen will still be all that. You are right, that stuff does not die, it goes into the soil and becomes something else, like a daisy, or a mouse.
Once Humpty Dumpty falls (dies), his shell is in pieces and dissipates, he does not live on as Humpty, but Humpty's atoms live on, but they are no longer Humpty.

All these NDE stories are just that, NEAR DEATH, stuff created by an un-dead brain on it's last gasps before it's really dead, or revived to tell a tale of something along the lines of an OOBE.

Believe me, I would love to believe in an afterlife, but all we have is dying dreams.
Still looking for proof.

What would be the point in an afterlife anyway?
Oh yeah, to believe in that makes death less scary and life's crap just a journey.
Death is death, and crap is just crap, and this jouney most likely just ends.

After life, not just wishful thinking? Prove it!

"With belief in reincarnation, the prejudices of races and castes fall dead, since the same spirit can be reborn rich or poor, lord or beggar, master or subordinate, free or enslaved, man or woman. Of all the arguments brought against the injustice of servitude and slavery, against the subjection of the weaker to the rule of the stronger, there is no one of them which expresses so logically the reason therefore as the law of reincarnation. If, then, reincarnation is founded upon a law of nature which is the source of universal brotherhood, it is based upon the same law as that of the equality of social rights and of freedom." -- Genesis, Allan Kadec.

source: sgny.org...

I spend a lot of time thinking about life/death consciousness and so forth. Consciousness. What is consciousness? A dead person and a living person side by side, eyes closed, arms crossed laying completely still, motionless... You examine their skin, their face, their quiet lifeless body. You search meticulously for a tell-tale-sign. You scan their corpse with your eyes seeking points of familiarity mirrored in your stare. What is it? What are you looking for? Why are you so curious?

The likeliness between them is perfect. Eyes, nose, hair. Pale white skin. No stress, no life time concerns echoing in time while resting peacefully in pillows of satin and silk, forever asleep. Yet. Something is different. Something is different. But what? Your mind races, firing in every direction as you try to put your finger on it. Something is missing, absent from it's perfect state. Your eyes dart from one to the other. Again, again and again...

Suddenly, you feel a chill come over you. Little hairs on your arms begin to stand at attention as a feather runs down your spine. You step forward and peer inquisitively into the box. "There is no soul" you mutter to yourself. A vessel void of life. Lifelike but lifeless. Like a wax doll sculptured by an artist in it's agonizing glory, waiting there like a stone. You attempt to make a connection but you can't. You try to merge your thoughts into it but it becomes useless. You begin to remember when you could, when it was just you and them together once upon a time laughing and smiling. Talking about the weather or when you would just sit and say nothing at all. Regardless, you could feel them there. But something is different now and now you know what it is.

The spark.

Originally posted by RP2SticksOfDynamite
Dont have a clue but energy is and then its no more. Who knows!

Science knows. And it says that energy doesn't die. It changes forms.
Pretty basic stuff.

Originally posted by RP2SticksOfDynamite
But still no afterlife!! Dead is dead!!!

Um ... no. The physical body dies. The energy that animates it and occupies it doesn't die. Energy doesn't die. It changes form. The energy has a life after the death of the physical body shell.

Originally posted by Toadmund
After life, not just wishful thinking? Prove it!

I've had more than a few encounters with 'the dead'. Physical. Spiritual. Solid encounters.
Not imagination. Real. It has been proven to me.
I don't 'believe' in an afterlife. I KNOW there is an afterlife. Big difference.

As for you .. I don't care what you think or don't think. I already know ....
Whatever....

reply to post by Toadmund


May I point out that this thread is not asking whether there is an afterlife, but what we think it is like, and using an author's book to do so.

The thread also isn't about discussing science and energy. I believe - and correct me if I'm wrong- sled started this thread to have a discussion about afterlife and not about it not existing.

About the ops:
Sounds terrible in some aspects. The whole removal and healing of earths woes sounds like stripping some very critical elements of a personality...and what am I besides my personality that has grown through the joy and sadness of life.
I don't like the sound if that, nor a lobotomy to make me more calm. I like addition to counter stuff, not subtraction to synthetically calm stuff.
I also quite enjoy my individuality. Lots of spiritualist stuff tends to focus on this oneness. I don't want to be a borg though, collective thoughts and the like. Individuality allows for the contrast of connection and joy inherent in sharing oneself with another chosen person. snapping me up to the grid and making me one with everyone first off removes perspective, and therefore creativity, but also makes the personal perspectives so insignificant to be nearly irrelevant.

To me, at quick glance, the place in the ops after the heaven thing sounds like various degrees of hell..well, maybe not hell, but certainly not something I would want. I worked hard for my nonsense thoughts, emo disposition, etc.
Perhaps something is lost in translation though.


As far as the debate going on about afterlife v none:
Well, hell, I don't know, and neither does anyone else here. It doesn't make much sense, but then again, I have had proper "ghost" experiences, so I am not going to dismiss the possibility just for the sake of skepticism.
Not saying I know what a "ghost" is, just identifying the experience. I of course have hopeful considerations that have grown from said experiences, but I don't take anything for granted. Simple to just live life as best you can, the true wealth in life (regardless of afterlife or not) is if you focus on putting smiles on others faces, and what ever comes, comes.
Just, if there is something after, I would think losing my personality and self identification would be rather sad and would indeed make the whole experience of life simply pointless.

Originally posted by RP2SticksOfDynamite

Originally posted by Zanti Misfit
reply to post by RP2SticksOfDynamite

 

" Energy has a lifespan!! "


Ah , EXACTLY what is the Calculation For determining the Lifespan of Energy oh Unenlightened One ?

edit on 17-8-2013 by Zanti Misfit because: (no reason given)

Dont have a clue but energy is and then its no more. Who knows!
If unenlightened then rather that than stupid and delluded!! If u get my drift!

edit on 17-8-2013 by RP2SticksOfDynamite because: (no reason given)

You realize that if energy has a end date, then there would also have to be a beginning date
-rubs temples-
You didn't think this one through, did you.

Originally posted by Meaningless
No. When we die our life ends, that's it. Just like before we were born,

Maybe, but you speak in absolutes. How do you know? What religion is this that has absolute knowledge of something outside of the scope of measurement? How is this claim any different than those whom "know" that we all turn into soul frogs when we die and go to lilypad heaven?
Absolutes are a sign of religion over reason.

Having absolutely no real evidence other than what people tell us, it's safe to assume the afterlife is a lie created to scam us of our lives. Of course there will always be believers who say otherwise. Lying rewards more than telling the truth. But who really cares what I have to say? You can't argue with those who already made their mind up, some just can't or else they wouldn't have a job, this I understand. And what do they say? Respect people's beliefs? even if they're being lead to a pointless death....

ok, I look at such stories as people discussing the fashion of aliens.
What your saying is that there are no aliens, therefore no fashion.
Very broad statements overall.

I see you also commented on how death isn't necessary.
Do you have vampirism or something? Is there an alternative? A meteor could smack earth tomorrow and fry everything on the planet...or you could be diagnosed with something quite nasty...you could be reading this post while eating a hot dog and choke right then and there.

I assume your discussing the lotto sci-fi tech future stuff and cryogenic freezing. Maybe that will work, maybe not. Become a peopsicle and see if we can science our way back to a thaw...sure, sounds awesome. but it is a hail mary pass to the endzone, don't be fooled into thinking otherwise. the complexities is a lot more than simply stitching up freezer burned brains. I won't go into the true complexities of it all, but it is far more than what the people over at nanodot are saying it is. Good to have hope though, but ground yourself in a bit of reality, else you will be rather disappointed when your like 70 and still seemingly no progress has come of their dreams.

Anyhow. so yeah..keep the absolutes down..or start a church would be my advice. You don't know. you doubt, but you don't know.

reply to post by Meaningless


The most beautiful thing about reading your replies is that you have no more or less proof than the OP. But you are so certain in your belief, regardless.

The irony of the "intellectuals". Do you really believe you came up with any ideas on your own? Ever? Everything you know is built on the knowledge given you by others. You may connect a few dots here and there....but those dots were connect countless times by countless other people over the ages.

You sound like a young person that has begun thinking about matters of spirit. However, you have a ways to go. Because you still haven't realized that your belief in nothingness is still a belief, and supported by no more facts than the wackiest of religions.

Atheism is simply "The Religion Of Nothingness".

Myself, like most everyone at one time or another, have been bitten by the 'post-life' bug. Death is one of the most glaring, imposing, and personally intimate experiences that effects all currently understood life.

I was raised in a somewhat religious family and, like many who are raised this way, I began to question things around my teen/late-teenage years. Also similar to many of those who approached this issue with an open mind, I began to have strong feelings that to die means death - an absolute end to individual consciousness and material existence.

Since then, I have continued to contemplate the idea of what it means to be born, to be alive, and to die. Aided by an unlikely series of events, I began to realize that I had taken a serious mis-step in my personal translation of death during my late teen years.

Experiencing a few new things made the idea of non-existence after physical death seem more and more questionable. I won't bore you with details of my experiences, but I would like you to know that I am not referring to an NDE, there was no extremely traumatic emotional event, no visions or meeting with spiritual beings or ghosts, nor was I touched by an angel or task charged by Gd thmself.

I began questioning my view after experiencing something that almost everyone will experience, to some degree, at one time or another; Sleep Paralysis.

When I was younger, I experienced SP, but never really had an extended SP experience - they had all been short, but terrifying experiences, lasting just 10-15 seconds.

One morning, around 3.45a, I awoke in need of a trip to the bathroom. I sat up on my bed for a moment, then I stood and walked to my door. I reached to turn the door-knob, but, in my sleep daze, I missed the knob. I reached for it again, again I missed the knob. When I looked down to make sure I wouldn't miss it a third time, I was in complete shock, as I saw my hand go straight through the door-knob!

I was terrified and instantly thought I was dead, I must have died in my sleep. I turned to go sit back down on my bed, when the terrifying confusion instantly morphed into absolute horror. There was no doubt that I had died in my sleep, because I could plainly see myself still lying in bed.

(If you've never seen your own body in this manner, you should know that you look absolutely, positively, nothing like you think you look, or how you appear when looking at yourself in a mirror. Even though you appear to be very much different than what you've always thought, you know, with 0% doubt, that you are looking at your own body).

I was so scared by the realization that I had died in bed that, with a fantastic jolt, I slammed back into my physical body and awoke immediately. As I opened my eyes, I realized that I was completely paralyzed from head to toe - with the exception of my eyes. It took a few moments to regain mobility, but the emotion of absolute terror and fear lingered for 30-45mins. Although unintentional, this was the first OBE (Out-of-Body Eperience) I'm conscious of.

Over the months and years since then, I've been able to reproduce the OBEs and have developed a technique for myself that allows me to induce them, with roughly a 70/30 (yes/no) rate of successful induction.

During one such experience, I entered OBE and instantly saw a light in the center of my ceiling, so intense that I couldn't look at it directly. Though it was only a light, I had the overwhelming impression that it was some sort of portal - I can't be certain whether it was some sort of portal or not.

These experiences are as real as it is for you to read these words on your screen. The quality of image reproduction is staggering and, if not for the incredibly intense feeling of pure love, the 2 realms would be quite indistinguishable from one another.

Don't take me the wrong way. I am not saying, "These OBE's are so vivid and emotionally empowering that they are indisputable proof of a life after death".

What I am saying is, "Because things like this do exist and in the manner they exist, then there must be a possibility that other, even more incredible, experiences may be possible - including, in some form, life after death".

I will never understand how people on either side of the debate can claim they know the answer to the riddle.

At the lowest level, there is absolutely no way either side can provide proof for their belief. You can not prove, beyond all doubt, that life completely ceases at death. You can not prove, beyond all doubt, a continuation of life, after death as we know it.

Rising from the most base point of comparison - above and beyond monitoring brain waves, there is actually more evidence that life continues after death, in some manner, than there is for complete end of existence for all forms of life upon death.

Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by sled735

What about hell? I mean where are they going to store all the very evil souls, those that can't be redeemed no matter what

There is one belief I read about that says the evil people will be ushered back into the earthly life almost immediately following death. They will have to keep returning for a do-over until they "see the light" over and over and over until the earth is no more.
At that point, if they are still evil, they are cast into the void of nothingness to float alone until they see the error of their evil ways.
When this happens an angel will go rescue them from the darkness. If they never "see the light", then they stay in the void forever and ever.
I don't know how true that is. That was something that was told to a medium by her spirit guide. I thought I would use that example, since it was the one that came to my mind.

And also is it possible to just live one life without reincarnating?

It is said that spirit guides have to live at least one lifetime on earth before they can be a spirit guide.
So, the answer would be yes, it is possible. But, these guides probably came from a much higher advanced planet, or they wouldn't have the wisdom to guide us with only having lived one lifetime.

You can choose to not come back to earth after living one life, but your learning/advancing process will take much longer to achieve in the spirit world.

I have a belief where some souls reincarnate, others to go paradise or hell. And I believe the possibility that some only live once hence why we have a growing population and the fact that some people have no past lives.

You are entitled to your beliefs. This may change over time as your soul grows in enlightenment.

It is my opinion that the reason for the population explosion is due to souls putting off coming back to earth to "right some wrongs", or take that one last lesson.
But the earth is about to be no more, at least not as we know it now. So, all these souls are having to come back all at the same time to get that last lifetime done while they still can.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

I also quite enjoy my individuality. Lots of spiritualist stuff tends to focus on this oneness. I don't want to be a borg though, collective thoughts and the like. Individuality allows for the contrast of connection and joy inherent in sharing oneself with another chosen person. snapping me up to the grid and making me one with everyone first off removes perspective, and therefore creativity, but also makes the personal perspectives so insignificant to be nearly irrelevant.

Just, if there is something after, I would think losing my personality and self identification would be rather sad and would indeed make the whole experience of life simply pointless.

You never lose your own identity, nor your personality. You always remain "you".

Originally posted by sled735

The Afterlife Revealed... Step By Step

Let us begin...
After many years of reading and researching the different beliefs concerning the afterlife, I had somewhat of a vision come to me…
I saw a tree with many branches. Then a "voice" told me that we all start from the same place, which would be the root, and travel along the different paths (branches) to reach the same goal, the Source/God/Whatever you choose to call it.
No one path is the right or wrong path, only a different path. The different paths are needed to learn different lessons during our lifetimes on earth.

That part sounds pretty accurate to me.

reply to post by esteay812


Fascinating response, Esteay.


Thanks for sharing.

I really believe that we go to that heavenly place when we die. But if you told me this is the first version of scrooge I would believe that too.

But great thread to read.. I hope it will be this way

Originally posted by Meaningless
reply to post by Rainbowresidue

 

It's easy for anyone to say they saw a spirit or enough evidence to suggest an afterlife but that does not mean there is one.

I only hope for you to see the lies before your only life ends....

what makes you so sure that they are lies?

Originally posted by RP2SticksOfDynamite

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by RP2SticksOfDynamite
Semantics dont change the fact that dead is dead!!
Dellusion doesnt change that fact!!

Like I said .... we are energy and energy doesn't die. Only the shell dies.
Semantics doesn't change that fact.

Energy has a lifespan!!

Uhm...elaborate?

reply to post by sled735


This sounds fantastic, I'll have to check it out.

I'm in for quite an interesting afterlife; It's all coming back of late. Earthbound but not purgatory or hellish by any means. I just love this planet.

Bertie Jupe was my name, I wrote lil' Liza Jane :]

I appreciate the interest you all have shown in this thread, but let's please remain on topic.

I am interested in hearing the views of what is discussed in Billy's journey.
Does anything there ring true for you?
Do you recognize any one part that could explain an experience you have had?
Do you have any thoughts as to which faith certain parts of his journey would apply to?

I have read many posts in the paranormal forum, my own thread included, where people have seen beings with a blue light aura. This could be one of the higher spirits that Billy saw after he noticed the gigantic orb that had no beginning or end.
The electric stick figures could explain what a member on my paranormal thread saw walking in her garden.

Does anyone else see anything that could explain a mystery for them?