Members of Congress denied access to basic information about NSA

Members of Congress denied access to basic information about NSA

www.theguardian.com

Members of Congress have been repeatedly thwarted when attempting to learn basic information about the National Security Agency (NSA) and the secret FISA court which authorizes its activities, documents provided by two House members demonstrate.

From the beginning of the NSA controversy, the agency's defenders have insisted that Congress is aware of the disclosed programs and exercises robust supervision over them. "These programs are subject to congressional oversight and congressional reauthorization and congressional debate," President Obama said the day after the first story on NSA b

(visit the link for the full news article)

As the talking heads change the story lines to anything but the NSA, the frontline to the battle is taking place in the Congress. Griffith and Grayson have sent letters and requests.. They are getting stonewalled as a few select members of the Intel Committee block them with lies and nonsense. It is time for constituents of those members to eject them at the next election. A small group of officials is controlling the rights of 300 million Americans.. What say you?

www.theguardian.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

reply to post by R_Clark


I say I would like to see every member of the house and senate voted out and replaced. Rinse and repeat until they get the message.

Has anyone noticed how the republicans and fox are seemingly silent on this issue?

I wonder why that is?... *cough* Bush and Cheney *cough*

It wasn't Obama and the democrats that created this, it was Bush and the republicans.

While fox-news and its republican backers will take any and every anonymous source to throw at Obama over Bhengazi, they seem strangely unable to even mention this.

Dont get me wrong, Obama if he had any class or morals would have stopped this. He hasn't and wont because basically he's not in charge.

All you muppets focusing on Obama, what a waste of time and breathe. You think he has the power or ability to stop this? your clearly completely ignorant of the reality in American power or just ignorant so you can keep bashing the black man.

Congress will never get the answers they want, honestly i don't think they really give a damn about what you say or the letters you send. Your opportunity to stop this was back in 2003.. you were all niave and now you have to accept it.

The only solution any of you have, is to put down your smart phone, cancel your facebook, gmail, youtube accounts... stop using email... stop using texting.. and go back to methods that worked for everyone before 1990.
But you wont.. because your addicted to the system and your all bravado and bark when it comes to criticizing.. but when it comes to action.. your hide in the corner and post on Facebook.. or ATS!

reply to post by Agit8dChop


So in other words bury our heads in the sand and forget the problem rather than try to fix it. I think I will skip that and go to plan B.

reply to post by OccamsRazor04


Hah, you've buried your heads for 10yrs.. now your up in arms over something that we all new existed but you didnt have time to talk about cause Facebook was waiting?

Your upset because the government is intertwined with communications.. instead of giving up modern day perks of smart phones and social media.. you'd rather attempt to drown a rock.

good luck forcing the NSA to stop being.. the NSA!

Personally.. I'm not planning terrorist attacks.. I'm not googling nuclear weapons designs.. I go to work, pay my taxes and live my life. I'll do this until the day I die.. and no amount of NSA involvement in the internet of phone companies is going to ruin my life.

What makes me laugh? is you all blame Obama like its actually his fault or in his control.

reply to post by R_Clark

They're not on the intelligence committee, so under Congress's own rules and the law, they aren't entitled to everything, just what the IC and the committees choose to share. Which was pretty substantial, various individual denials notwithstanding. This part of the article was cute, too:

Moreover, even when members of the Intelligence Committee learn of what they believe to be serious abuses by the NSA, they are barred by law from informing the public. Two Democratic Committee members in the Senate, Ron Wyden and Mark Udall, spent years warning Americans that they would be "stunned to learn" of the radical interpretations of secret law the Obama administration had adopted in the secret FISA court to vest themselves with extremist surveillance powers.

It's like the Guardian writer never heard of the Pentagon Papers, or Article I of the Constitution.

Yea wow look, they can even turn this to undermine the confidence of the americans in their representatives.

Its congresses fault darn it!

Anyway think about it.....they certainly have no fear of the people if they have none in our representatives. They don't answer to anyone.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
All you muppets focusing on Obama, what a waste of time and breathe. You think he has the power or ability to stop this? your clearly completely ignorant of the reality in American power or just ignorant so you can keep bashing the black man.

Clearly this post is focused on Congress and not "the black man".
What the hell are you talking about? Muppets?
How does this have to do anything with the race of our POTUS?
Man....and your anti-Bush rhetoric shows your true colors.

Congress will never get the answers they want, honestly i don't think they really give a damn about what you say or the letters you send. Your opportunity to stop this was back in 2003.. you were all niave and now you have to accept it.

The only solution any of you have, is to put down your smart phone, cancel your facebook, gmail, youtube accounts... stop using email... stop using texting.. and go back to methods that worked for everyone before 1990.
But you wont.. because your addicted to the system and your all bravado and bark when it comes to criticizing.. but when it comes to action.. your hide in the corner and post on Facebook.. or ATS!

So you posting on ATS isn't any different?
How do you know who wrote letters to their congressman and who hasn't?
I'm not saying it's not a screwed up system.
But to scream "its a Bush and Cheneys fault" seems a little niave.
How about screaming "it's everyone who voted for this fundings fault."
Or even "its everyone who voted to allow/create the FiSAs fault."


Don't you think?

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

Hah, you've buried your heads for 10yrs.. now your up in arms over something that we all new existed but you didnt have time to talk about cause Facebook was waiting?

You don't know me. Don't post as if you do. I don't have a Facebook account.

Your upset because the government is intertwined with communications.. instead of giving up modern day perks of smart phones and social media.. you'd rather attempt to drown a rock.

No, I am upset that the American people keep electing people that could not care less about them.

good luck forcing the NSA to stop being.. the NSA!

It requires zero luck. It requires a government that is For the People, By the People.

Personally.. I'm not planning terrorist attacks.. I'm not googling nuclear weapons designs.. I go to work, pay my taxes and live my life. I'll do this until the day I die.. and no amount of NSA involvement in the internet of phone companies is going to ruin my life.

What makes me laugh? is you all blame Obama like its actually his fault or in his control.

I believe I stated we need to kick out the House and Senate, and elect all new people. What does that have to do with Obama?

I am glad we cleared up the fact you are ignorant and your post is empty words and in no way, shape, or form, is a reply to what I have stated in this post.

Thanks.

Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli
reply to post by R_Clark

 

They're not on the intelligence committee, so under Congress's own rules and the law, they aren't entitled to everything, just what the IC and the committees choose to share. Which was pretty substantial, various individual denials notwithstanding. This part of the article was cute, too:

Moreover, even when members of the Intelligence Committee learn of what they believe to be serious abuses by the NSA, they are barred by law from informing the public. Two Democratic Committee members in the Senate, Ron Wyden and Mark Udall, spent years warning Americans that they would be "stunned to learn" of the radical interpretations of secret law the Obama administration had adopted in the secret FISA court to vest themselves with extremist surveillance powers.

It's like the Guardian writer never heard of the Pentagon Papers, or Article I of the Constitution.

This is the clear picture of the secret government. Government within the government. We elect representatives knowing that when they get their they cant tell us everything or anything. Representatives that are prevented by "law" from communicating with the people that sent them there.

The United States of America is a myth of legend and yesteryear. What we have is a country full of bamboozled fools who are under the control of a shadow government, owned by men with vast wealth.

This country has been under a coup since 1913 and it's not changing anytime soon with the passiveness and ignorance of the American people aiding these pervert lap dogs of the elites.

So who are the rotten apples that need to go from congress. We need to start a campaign against these people to get them removed.

Spread the word on Twitter, Facebook, create websites designed to discredit these traitors. The most important thing is to keep updating these media sites. Letting the people know about these traitors.

We have to make it simple tho to keep the public informed. I mean really simple. This congress person is evil, paint them up with big nasty words or humorous pictures etc..to draw the public in. Once they are drawn in there can be links to all their misdeeds. Otherwise people will not even care and the campaign will fail.

We have to be like the MSM and make it an enormous issue.

Example: Congressman = Traitor to the constitution/ Evil Gun Hater trying to keep poor people poor. Do not vote. (Click here for details etc...)

reply to post by supremecommander


We have to ask.....can we really expect easily accessed communications systems like the net and cell phones not to be monitored?

I believe if we went back to the transatlantic cable that every pieces of information coming over that thing was monitored. When it is so easy to talk outside the borders of your own country on the net for example it does represent a security risk. Morse code over the airwaves must have been a nightmare for the security people.

Originally posted by Skorpy
So who are the rotten apples that need to go from congress. We need to start a campaign against these people to get them removed.

Spread the word on Twitter, Facebook, create websites designed to discredit these traitors. The most important thing is to keep updating these media sites. Letting the people know about these traitors.

We have to make it simple tho to keep the public informed. I mean really simple. This congress person is evil, paint them up with big nasty words or humorous pictures etc..to draw the public in. Once they are drawn in there can be links to all their misdeeds. Otherwise people will not even care and the campaign will fail.

We have to be like the MSM and make it an enormous issue.

Example: Congressman = Traitor to the constitution/ Evil Gun Hater trying to keep poor people poor. Do not vote. (Click here for details etc...)

I admire your opinion....but it is naive.

The problem is the two party paradigm that we currently live under..."oh incumbent X(Dem or Repub) is a corrupt lapdog of the corporations who votes against the self interests of his constituents....let's vote in Politician Y(Dem or Repub) and hope that he or she isn't a wolf in sheep's clothing". Rinse wash repeat...and people wonder why
nothing changes.

What Americans need to do first is to stop giving this paradigm votes of confidence to continue...stop voting for Democrats and Republicans on any and every level...they are corrupt.

Next, we need to realize that the government no longer serves the people, but a select few. Until that FACT is realized by the greater whole, American will continue to trot happily along into a state of despair and outright oppression.

Originally posted by Logarock
reply to post by supremecommander

 

We have to ask.....can we really expect easily accessed communications systems like the net and cell phones not to be monitored?

I believe if we went back to the transatlantic cable that every pieces of information coming over that thing was monitored. When it is so easy to talk outside the borders of your own country on the net for example it does represent a security risk. Morse code over the airwaves must have been a nightmare for the security people.

No. But we can expect the rule of law, one where US citizens should not have data collected against them to be used or perverted at a moment's notice.

reply to post by Skorpy


Reminds me of the "freak show" in the movie independence day. "You didn't really think we were spending 600$ on a toilet seat did you?"

The fact is the average congressman is so far out of the loop of what's going on in the communications and security world. What can we expect them to do in the face of a communication industry that has a life of its own, is so large and so well moneyed and ran by modern day techno "gods"?

Unfortunately the media has everyone brainwashed to not think anything of this all because it's "for our own good..". Kind of sad.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

Hah, you've buried your heads for 10yrs.. now your up in arms over something that we all new existed but you didnt have time to talk about cause Facebook was waiting?


Personally.. I'm not planning terrorist attacks.. I'm not googling nuclear weapons designs.. I go to work, pay my taxes and live my life. I'll do this until the day I die.. and no amount of NSA involvement in the internet of phone companies is going to ruin my life.

What makes me laugh? is you all blame Obama like its actually his fault or in his control.

Ok...so you say we have all buried our heads in the sand yet you then state that is EXACTLY what you have done...go to work, pay my taxes, live my life until I die.....isn't that the very definition of burying your head in the sand?

And then you say what makes you laugh is blaming Obama? Well his is to blame. While it may have been started by someone else prior to Obama, he is the one in charge now and is perpetuating the decent down. What would you do...go picket outside of Bush and Cheney's houses because they have so much power to change anything now? Please...get your head out of the sand....

reply to post by R_Clark


Those who think that Congress is still in charge are so naive. Not even the president has access to certain programs.

There is a government within the government. The individuals of this hidden government are not public figures, but financially extremely powerful.