If your Country instituted a Draft/Conscription would you go or dodge it?

Originally posted by Flint2011
reply to post by crazyewok

 

This thread is not about those wars or whether they are justified. War in itself is not justified yet it can be debated as well. It comes down to the person. You posted a what if scenario and I responded as such. Now you are just trying to bait and trap and it won't work. Read my post. I have indeed read yours. You forbid to accept mine but you debate me because it doesn't fit your views. I put forth my stance on the matter. It's straight forward. Nothing to debate about so if you continue to feel the need to allude that I am a blind follower then so be it.

Have a great day and best wishes in your endeavors just the same.

I was not trying to bait. It is just part of your reason does not make sense.

The situation i laid out in the original was not a war based on defence but one purely for political reasons like vietnam or iraq that have nothing to do with protection.


Nowyou stated one of the reasons you would turn up for a draft is to protect you country and freedom and liberty ect but in a war based on my premise youd be. It makes no sense.

If you had said i will go as i like to kill or support aggresive foreign policy then fair enough. I would not agree but eould be based on a solid reason.

I was 18 in 1968, I went for my physical in the fall of 1969. That was the year of the first lottery - my number was 305 a lot of my friends were not so lucky - the draft was bad we all knew people like G.W. who went to the national guard or the coast guard. It made life unfair and unpredictable.

That said I think that there should be a constitutional amendment. This amendment should state that if there is a war or a police action of a certain rigidly defined threshold - there will be a draft and taxes must be raised to cover the cost of the war.

These last wars have been fought with most of the american public not having any skin in the game. The whole picture of going to war changes when it directly costs the citizens money and puts their loved ones sons and daughters in jeopardy. Look what we accomplished in WW2 the country was all in for that and it only lasted 4 years in many many different theaters paid for with blood and treasure.

The Viet Nam war was as stupid as Iraq and Afghanistan -- how many protests - movies - songs - books news has really protested these wars. Virtually nothing.

Nope. Definitely wouldn't fight in any war. I would absolutely take jail or execution over fighting in a war zone. Some people may feel that life is worth living under any and all circumstances. I don't.

Originally posted by Chrisfishenstein
reply to post by crazyewok

 

I would ask the person on the phone who the imminent threat to the USA is right now?

If they said we had someone invading, I would go......If not, go stick it up your rear!!!

Yea that is pretty much my opinion right there.. Fight for this land but not for the ones who run it.

Gs

Ha ha ha I would do a version of what Ripcontrol said but before reporting in I would get hammered the night before because oh crap it’s back to the grinder.

Just for disclosure purposes I am few years past the established draft limit but hey if they wanted me back that bad I wouldn’t have a problem going. The fit must be about to hit the shan if its at that point.

Originally posted by Grimpachi
Ha ha ha I would do a version of what Ripcontrol said but before reporting in I would get hammered the night before because oh crap it’s back to the grinder.

Just for disclosure purposes I am few years past the established draft limit but hey if they wanted me back that bad I wouldn’t have a problem going. The fit must be about to hit the shan if its at that point.

Sorta horrifyin' innit?

When I was in my earlier 40s, say about 5 years ago, there was this neat letter with a pretty, colorful flyer with fun pictures on it that a few of us got. It showed some old Army fart with a bunch of younger Army farts, in various fun action poses. And the gist was "Pass your knowledge on to a younger generation - be a mentor to new recruits with a particular MOS contract", and what it implied was that you'd be teaching sort of pre-school explosives, radio and firearms work as extra-curricular activities to these guys in sort of a RIP program starring old farts as instructors.

They even came by the house and tried to sell it to me. I heard flutes playing, eagles were flying, and by the end there was this dramatic orchestral performance of "God Bless the USA" with a holographic flag flapping in the living room. Then I read the agreement.

In the fine print, it said "however, in order to be a mentor, you have to pick up a standard NG contract with 20th in your old MOS, we double dog pinky SWEAR we won't mobilize you though" which for me sort of spoiled the moment, and resulted in me telling this nice captain "How about no, does no work for you, sir? Would you like some tea?" I don't know anyone who bit and I think it died a quick death.

About that same time, I ran into this AF guy who dropped by a classroom I was in and did the spiel(I generally take a college course or two per year to no particular end). After he bombed out with the kiddies, he hits ME up.

"You look like you're in shape...were you former service? Yes? We can drop you in at O3 with an abbreviated basic then!"
"Dude, I'm 43"
"We don't CARE, as long as you can pass the physical!"
"Man, we must be in some pretty deep #"

reply to post by crazyewok

I am a 50 year old out of shape woman I would definately dodge it...You will probably see my arse in the deternment camps or whatever...

They even came by the house and tried to sell it to me. I heard flutes playing, eagles were flying, and by the end there was this dramatic orchestral performance of "God Bless the USA" with a holographic flag flapping in the living room. Then I read the agreement.

reply to post by Bedlam



I loved this part of your story it really made me laugh....spewed a little beer threw my nose even...your AWESOME!!!!! Star for you....

reply to post by Bedlam


I think they basically offered my pop the same thing back in the 80s when we lived in NC. He had been part of Kennedy’s original push for Special Forces and actually got out of Vietnam and ETSed before anyone even knew where it was. They offered him 05 or 06 and I think he may have took it because even though I was a kid back then he would bring back M16s and explosives from Brag and showed me the ropes in a way. He recently passed away but when I went through his records I found a DD256 officer discharge. He never spoke about it so I don’t know.

Man we had some great fireworks on New Year’s and the fourth back then. Not to mention clearing stumps from neighbors yards.

Anyway my upbringing helped me down the path of EOD when I joined so if they asked me to be a role model for the youngsters now lord help them all. I think I would do it though I still love those fireworks.

Motto- If you see me running you better not be too far behind.

Good question.
For me, it would be a big "UP YOURS!!"
I take a bullet for only 3 people, My Father, My Mother, My Wife.

Like most here, only, and a BIG only, if 2 points were met.
1: Foreign troops on our soil.
2: A politician and/or politician's son/daughter were right there beside me...
In all other cases, war is just a politicians tool to get others to do his/her dirty work, and a tool to make $$$.

Everything can be achieved without war and mass death being involved.

Cheers.

I probably wouldn't, but what would I be fighting for, exactly? Freedom? Corporations? Helping another nation? I don't get it. Would I be paid? Because it would be mercenary work.

reply to post by Grimpachi


And they call scouts crazy,we don't screw around with whackballs bombs. Man if they called me back I live in Denver.I'd take the guys to a few clubs to loosen them up then we would all go down town and get arrested ,probably for fighting,cause we like it. Then of course someone would pee on the intake NCO.

reply to post by cavtrooper7


I was that guy once I don’t remember much from that night.

I would dodge. Thankfully I have a medical issue that would keep me off the frontlines, although I wouldn't mind nursing or something if I had to.

Well, if conscription was introduced where I live I would be sure the world was falling to pieces.

I am probably too long in the tooth to serve is a military role, but would be happy to sit in tribunals sorting out the legitimate conscientious objectors from the out-right cowards.

Regards

I don't want to kill anybody or aid anybody in the murder of another, not under any circumstances. Forget this fiction of country. The most good I can do, if it comes down to it, is willingly let somebody kill me (or attempt to flee!). Hopefully if I die at the hands of somebody else, they will learn something from it and perhaps I can get a word in beforehand. If it comes down to me dying, or somebody else, I would rather it be me because I have seen enough suffering. If they want to kill me, they have not seen enough suffering. So it stands to reason that if one of us must die, at the very least somebody ought to gain something - in a spiritual sense - from it.

But that said, I can bring more good to the world with a longer life, so the clear choice is to attempt to live longer by escaping. If I can't escape, my death will be an act of love.

On the other hand, if my life was not bringing more comfort and vitality than it was pain, it would be my obligation to die as soon as possible, if I am beyond hope of reversing that trend. But I certainly wouldn't do it by throwing myself and my bullets at another.

I'm a meat-eater from time to time up to this point, perhaps hundreds of animals have died due to my living. So rationally, I do deserve to die. I cannot justify that life has been lost on account of me, though I am thankful. I don't feel just yet that I am beyond hope - I do think that I will stop eating meat entirely at some undetermined time in the future.

It's a tough question! That is, it's tough to justify whether we deserve to live. But if I cannot even decide which is the case for myself, then I /definitely/ can't decide it for somebody else, can I? (The question of whether I would accept being drafted, that's an easy one; if I suspect that I'll end up killing people then I should certainly end my life. Don't you wish the powers that be would off themselves? Is fighting in a war really so different?)

EDIT: Wrabbit2000, whose opinion I hold in fairly high esteem, says "If one can't get their butts to change the system in peace, they can eat the cost in war.......with a rifle or with a mop on a cell block. Either way works for me." Well if it would appease, I suppose I could stay in a cell. But, it seems rather a waste just to teach me a lesson.

I would sign up.....what do they want this old man to do......

I could maybe whittle a few grenades

reply to post by crazyewok


I'd hate to see an invasion. I wouldn't join our military nor the invading. I would bug out to the woods and play Red Dawn on them (invading army) I think our military men and women are being put in predicaments around the world that make them want to commit suicide due to that amount of immoral things they are ordered to do. F that crap I will be my own free soldier.

There would have to be a position in which I could serve that in no way, shape, or form, materially or otherwise, contributed to the killing of other human beings. If that were the case, then I would, assuming I could ensure that that would be the only position I'd ever serve in. Otherwise, absolutely not.

Granted, I have health issues that would exempt me anyway. But if I didn't, that would be my rationale. I'm a pacifist, but I'm not religious, so being a contentious objector would be problematic. I'd serve in a purely life saving capacity if possible. I can do wound care. That's about the only skill I have.

Peace.

Well, was gonna stay out of this one, but seeing as their is apparently people with no clue as to who they would be fighting for i will enlighten them. I for one would never accept to take up arms for a Corporation. For that is what we are, im talking about us British, Americans, Australians and Canadians as they so far are the countries i have spoken to people from about this.. Some words they use might differ between countries (ie National Insurance Number / Social Security Number) but the end result is the same for all countries. You will not be fighting for your country you will be fighting for your corporation. www.youtube.com...