Supreme Court upholds DNA swabbing of people under arrest

Originally posted by VforVendettea
reply to post by Demoncreeper

 

I see this as a DNA capture, What if your DNA is patented without your consent. You are a slave to the patent holder.

Really?

Where did you dream that one up from?

An aquaintence recently was stopped for a license plate light violation and was taken to jail on a DUI charge that was five years ago. Seems the record system was incorrect and listed the charge as current or not resolved. The aquaintence was processed through the local jail and then sent to a for profit jail 80 miles from home, they get $200 a head/day guilty or innocent btw, the aquaintences family finalloy got him out after eight days of false incarceration.

He recieved no apologies or any other remorse from LE at all, basically said if our records indicate then thats our job, not our job to make records correct, big tough s#*t is what he and family got in response.

He has good job and kids to support and both were put at risk.

Now by this ruling anyone who is arrested can be swabbed for DNA innocent or guilty based upon arbitrary criteria based on a governmental definition which we all know has creep down to it.

I seem to remember reading after the fall of East Germany how very creepy it was that the Stasi kept hair samples and other items collected from hundreds of thousands of its citizens, is this where we are going?

I do clearly remember our Constitution saying " free from searches of persons, effects and property without a warrant clearly saying what is to speciffically be searched for upon evidence presented to a judge who issues the warrant" certainly not an exact quote but it does say the intent.

Even if one commits a certain crime and is convicted of that crime and DNA is taken is there not a fifth amendment violation occurring for other crimes? - never mind the fourth amendment violations going on.

This is a welcome to your police state ruling where the plebs have absolutely no recourse at all - I am somewhat aged and have read much fiction that at the time seemed far fetched but everyday it rings truer and truer.

reply to post by Demoncreeper


Maybe I do like Scalia??? I am too dizzy with disbelief to know yet, but he did dissent and say this:

Today’s judgment will, to be sure, have the beneficial effect of solving more crimes; then again, so would the taking of DNA samples from anyone who flies on an airplane (surely the Transportation Security Administration needs to know the “identity” of the flying public), applies for a driver’s license, or attends a public school. Perhaps the construction of such a genetic panopticon is wise. But I doubt that the proud men who wrote the charter of our liberties would have been so eager to open their mouths for royal inspection. I therefore dissent, and hope that today’s incursion uponthe Fourth Amendment, like an earlier one will some day be repudiated.

I can't believe we have finally sunk to this level. But we have AMERICA.............WOE UNTO US ALL.

reply to post by Demoncreeper


Wow...

Absolute crap and then some... The Supreme Court needs to rethink this decision and if not then states should make it outright illegal without a warrant.

Be heard people... Contact your government representatives.

DNA Polymerase is the process of replicating DNA in the laboratory. It is used in forensics as a method to replicate a limited amount of DNA, in order to have the ability to perform multiple comparisons, without losing diminishing the evidentiary sample.

I ask those who support this decision, what could be done with your DNA, by someone with nefarious intentions?

Scalia, Ginsberg, Sotomayor, and Kagan got this one right. I believe the others are too ignorant on DNA to understand the implications of their decision.

reply to post by Demoncreeper


I totally disagree with this ruling.

I find it odd how they mention a 21st century version of fingerprinting. I know what I am about to say has already been ruled upon. I have always felt that fingerprinting and now DNA is a violation of my 5th amendment right to not be compelled to be a witness against myself. If we want to start updating the constitution for the 21st century than anything relating to my body should be protected under the 5th amendment. After all, my fingerprints speak. My blood speaks. My DNA speaks. And so on. The method of communication is the only difference. My bodily fluids are used against me with complete disregard for my 5th amendment rights.

So, I guess I do not see how my body can be used against me. In the 21st century, with all our advanced technology, I don't understand how the 5th amendment only applies to my voice box. Logically, if judges are making rulings based in the current century we are in, it should also be applied to the amendments that will protect me from government punishment and abuse.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by VforVendettea

I see this as a DNA capture, What if your DNA is patented without your consent. You are a slave to the patent holder.

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
Really?

Where did you dream that one up from?

I saw this little gem after I posted. To give my answer to the Gauls question. Perhaps you should look into farmers who get sued when patented DNA in the form of plants grows on their property without their knowledge or consent? It has happened. The farmers get screwed because nature takes its course and deposits pollen/seeds onto their property the way it was intended to.

So, I don't see how the statement V made is impossible to happen. It may take 100's of years but, with the current legal framework for patents, a patent on the genetic DNA of an individual is plausible. I would rather ponder the implications of this phenomena as opposed to dismissing it as an absurdity.

I highly doubt DNA gathering has Anything to do with crime prevention,

More like HARVESTING though. Why?

CO University, CU Bulder, just two examples, GENETICS and CRIMINAL Studies, with behavior mod Milgrams type of Mengele doctrines, think...

Aurora shooting, now connect the dots,

Dept of Human SS Services, has on their health page, a list of Blood studies, look it up, it's there, very immaculate studies, it's under the health and elderly, they are keeping track, very similar to how Nazis did...

Immediate Protocol in jails under MENGELE docs is injections of psychotropics, extreme ones, if arrested refuses, then the next step, the doctored Kool aid, which Interestingly in the womens pod, from what I hear, puts majority of them n heavy sedated sleep for weeks on end, of course then there's e staph infection deaths, but anyway, from the little research I've done, it follows a similar pattern of "CONTROLED lab experiments that social psychologists do to observe reactions from various stimuli, which would account for the methodologies used in jails to torment, etc., aka to see reactions and of course record by inmate number, etc....

THOSE studies go back to the think tanks working with the Mengele GENETICS breeding and manipulation of DNA for criminal and so called deviance behavior modification...

Tie That into Other neurology mind control/brain experiments, implants, etc that yes the dr frankensteins are working on (again the Aurora shooter worked IN either The program or knew something of, etc and of course the matrix of Mengele of CO and District Mental Court, the ONLY one IN the same a ha district the shooting happened, gagged the info and protected the University scum) but anyway...

Reason I found this, was by accident...one day was looking up genetics and food and it came up, CU and the genetics programming beh mod criminal...I thought it a tad weird Especially since CO is also the state with DIA and mega numbers of Butchered children in Foster care AND also the same state of the sacrificial murder of Jo Benets Ramsey, phonetic RAMSES,

A d let's not forget the Greek style Podium that ole Obama stood under at Mile High Occult Unjverse of good ole CO...mining lala land built on the genocidal blood of Indians, oh yes, look at the history of Occult CO and the whole big parade of Nero Rome aka Arch Diocese, some interesting Nazi kind of weird going on there...

Tightly controlled, very much so. So, they taking of DNA

Is for some kind of manipulation, of what I don't know, but it sure isn't good.

As I once heard on the BBC radio.
"Take a mini hoover to your local library or on a bus. Hoover up some dust. Spread at the scene of your crime."

They want DNA for OTHER purposes!

I don't think entrapment using DNA is what to worry about, Remeber these scum HAVE NO CONSCIOUS OR ETHICS

Whatsoever, you're dealing with a Totally different breed of species here, so, with that in mind,

In the Matrix Pyramid, the jail arrested etc, poor, elderly, are simply FERTILIZER for these types, nothing more, they are simply Using them as LAB RATS,

Just like they do the homeless and ORPHANS...especially children because if they can own and control Children you see they can form mega militaries of human bots that will obey with NO WILL OF THEIR OWN

A d THAT'S what these scum parasites are after...saves them energy or something, not sure on that aspect but as far as an ends goes,

Whatever they are Using us LAB RATS for, is for higher ends such as military uses, maybe Soace program, new breeding of a human species more evil than their last batch...

Who knows, all I know, is that they whoever they are, behind the engineers, be it a spiritual force or some organic parasitic hostile creature we can't see or simply evil deluded power whores, though there is way to much to discount the paranormal part of all this...

They HATE humans, are extremely hostile, and will annihilate humanity once they are done with us. The DNA is just more of their tampering and creating their demon hordes...

I will make a prediction.

Bet that in the next few weeks, we will have Someone Killed, by LEOs who will paint the ''crazy'' as a 'spiracy nutjob to gain support because the Crazy went ballistic when they came at him/her with a Swab for Da DNA.

What is the Big Deal,

SUBMIT
OPEN WIDE
BACK IN LINE
sheep.

Originally posted by 1337s0lja
The media is using the term "serious crimes". What is considered a serious crime in this country? Getting pulled over with pot in your car? Running a red light? Running from the police? Drunk in public? Domestic dispute? Driver license expired? Not a lot of transparency here but everyone keeps on voting and keeps on falling for the same old trick.

Not to mention the fact that people are only taking into consideration things that are considered serious crimes now and not what might be considered a serious crime in ten years. Or 20-30 years. Things change. The laws change. If they changed the law and made it a "serious crime" to criticize the government in 10 years, you could be arrested for it. And the public would go along with it because...

1. In the end, they really have no choice anyway.

2. It wouldn't take more than a few terrible events (real or staged) and a few months/years of media manipulation to turn people completely off to free speech.

Who knows? In a few years, it might be considered to be a crime to speak out. There isn't much that seems impossible anymore.

This also arises a lot of ethical concerns as technology improves because your DNA is NOT a fingerprint. Soon they will be able to determine many many things just by running DNA through a computer. DNA... the makeup of the individual. Well lets see shall we, I get in a fight at a bar because I am defending a female from getting slapped by a drunkard. The police swab me and they run my DNA through a machine. The DNA tests come back and determine that I have a greater chance than most of becoming addicted to drugs or becoming a murderer. From there they send me to classes and therapy when all along all I was doing is defending a girl from getting slapped. Just a situation, but I AM PISSED. Welcome to the New World Order people. Slow progressive legislation is a bitch.

The scary part is that this isn't as crazy as it might sound.

Originally posted by WTFover
DNA Polymerase is the process of replicating DNA in the laboratory. It is used in forensics as a method to replicate a limited amount of DNA, in order to have the ability to perform multiple comparisons, without losing diminishing the evidentiary sample.

I ask those who support this decision, what could be done with your DNA, by someone with nefarious intentions?

Not only that. Working with DNA is still relatively new. Like all things people do, we will get exponentially better at it as time goes on. What will be possible in 30 years? What are these people sentencing the next generation of people to? It's really disgusting to see this happening when we know exactly what some of the pitfalls are and can only guess about what we don't know yet.

Now the jailers are going to be raping the uncooperative arrestees in the mouth, yanking it open with as many hands as they can fit to swab with a few fists no doubt. You've all seen the jail shows where they regularly beat people who don't follow orders quickly enough, imagine the stuff that doesn't get filmed or broadcasted. It will be incorporated into the routine.

I wouldn't be surprised if some jurisdictions will replicate your DNA if there is any marketable attributes in your chain and of course you will never be notified or paid - it will go into their coffers.

Police will decide to make arrest in more cases because their will be incentives to add to the database and perhaps a bigger incentive for hits, so those who wouldn't have been arrested in the past for a similar scenario will be more likely to be arrested in the future.

Unlike fingerprints, a vile of any of your bodily fluid can be introduced to any scene and since it is DNA everyone will believe you were there and therefore you must be guilty. Good luck with counting paint bumps on the wall.

I don't know what's worse, the fact that our government thinks that this is ok or the fact that the American people don't even care anymore.

With every right infringed upon us we just lay our heads in the sand and *hope* they don't take anymore of our rights away.

This isn't going to suffice anymore. People need to start fighting back against this tyranny.

I love hearing when people say "If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to worry about". I wonder if the found fathers were thinking that when they wrote the 4th amendment into the bill of rights....

Originally posted by S3rvoV3ritas
I don't know what's worse, the fact that our government thinks that this is ok or the fact that the American people don't even care anymore.

With every right infringed upon us we just lay our heads in the sand and *hope* they don't take anymore of our rights away.

This isn't going to suffice anymore. People need to start fighting back against this tyranny.

I love hearing when people say "If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to worry about". I wonder if the found fathers were thinking that when they wrote the 4th amendment into the bill of rights....

I hope people who vote Republican will keep in mind ALL the Liberal Justices
and Scalia voted AGAINST THIS.

Liberals are interested in protecting people's liberty and privacy.
They take a lot of flack for it but It's what they stand for.
Republicans are all about protecting a Corporation's liberty and privacy.

When you lean Conservative, and you are a person, not an Industry Giant, you are just asking for your rights to be taken away. The only thing a Conservative Judge or any other Neo-Con is interested in protecting is their own money and Corporate Interests, for which they are rewarded handsomely.

I wouldn't care if they swabbed me.

It's only going to be used if you eventually commit a serious felony or violent crime like rape or murder.

This info if only used for identifying possible serious felons who have committed a serious crime against another person is good. It will help get unsolved crimes solved and dangerous people off the streets.

As long as they make a rule that the information collected can only be used to prosecute serious felonies of the highest class and violent crimes, who cares what information the gov't collects as long as it promotes public safety.

If they use the info for anything other than public safety of identifying serious felons, let me know, I will march on Washington DC. Until then, they collected fingerprints when I joined to serve the Coast Guard. Not a major problem for me. Why, because I don't go around committing violent crimes. No one has ever used my fingerprints to punish me for my various speeding tickets.

Originally posted by Miracula
I wouldn't care if they swabbed me.

It's only going to be used if you eventually commit a serious felony or violent crime like rape or murder.

This info if only used for identifying possible serious felons who have committed a serious crime against another person is good. It will help get unsolved crimes solved and dangerous people off the streets.

As long as they make a rule that the information collected can only be used to prosecute serious felonies of the highest class and violent crimes, who cares what information the gov't collects as long as it promotes public safety.

If they use the info for anything other than public safety of identifying serious felons, let me know, I will march on Washington DC. Until then, they collected fingerprints when I joined to serve the Coast Guard. Not a major problem for me. Why, because I don't go around committing violent crimes. No one has ever used my fingerprints to punish me for my various speeding tickets.

edit on 4-6-2013 by Miracula because: (no reason given)

edit on 4-6-2013 by Miracula because: (no reason given)

edit on 4-6-2013 by Miracula because: (no reason given)

Really torn over this.

on one hand, if it will make it easier to catch perps...great! OTOH....there's too much of a chance for abuse and possible framing of individuals for crimes they did not commit.

reply to post by Demoncreeper


Taking DNA just recently linked/aided in the capture of a rapist who was arrested for something else.This is a good thing. If your not out committing crime in the first place you shouldn't worry about it.

Sine post 9-11, a person arguing with his neighbor could be arrested for 'terroristic threats'. Photograph the police and get arrested. Refuse to leave a public place during a rally and get arrested.

Everyone so sure that the ease of which a law can be broken by someone isn't changing.

Originally posted by My_Reality

I have always felt that fingerprinting and now DNA is a violation of my 5th amendment right to not be compelled to be a witness against myself.

What about a police lineup? That would, at first glance, seem a clear violation of Fifth Amendment rights. In a lineup you are required to present your body visage as evidence to be use against you. But the Supreme Court in Schmerber v. California, 384 U.S. 757 (1966) and United States v. Wade, 388 U.S. 218 (1967) essentially ruled that the Fifth Amendment applies only to self-incriminating evidence that is testimonial or communicative. Forced participation in a police lineup (or involuntary blood draws) is an identifying physical characteristic outside Fifth Amendment protection.

Bottom line: DNA swabbing is just another erosion of our supposed guaranteed constitutional rights.