Was Jesus Christ just a man? Aetheists vs. Christians, Battle Royale

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Not sure what I am witnessing here, Cryptic is going into an area uncomfortable to the natives and is being attacked. Its perspective is to me UNIQUE in its innocence/explaination of "what is happening here?". Dont shoot the messenger it has more in the mail bag than meets the eye.

edit on 25-5-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)

Attacked? I can't really even tell what territory he's going into, much less find a reason I should try to stop him from going there, so why would I "attack"? I simply gave my perspective on his perspectives - as nearly as I could decipher them, anyhow. it's highly possible that I missed something, but not that I "attacked".

I understand there are folks around who believe in reptilians and the like, and don't begrudge them that. No particular reason I should jump on the bandwagon, though, because honestly most of the reptilians I've ever run into, I've eaten. Likewise, I seriously can't figure out what game of monopoly I'm playing, My little corner of the American Dream really has no one to invite over for a game.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Not sure what I am witnessing here, Cryptic is going into an area uncomfortable to the natives and is being attacked. Its perspective is to me UNIQUE in its innocence/explaination of "what is happening here?". Dont shoot the messenger it has more in the mail bag than meets the eye

Attacked? I can't really even tell what territory he's going into, much less find a reason I should try to stop him from going there, so why would I "attack"? I simply gave my perspective on his perspectives - as nearly as I could decipher them, anyhow. it's highly possible that I missed something, but not that I "attacked".
I understand there are folks around who believe in reptilians and the like, and don't begrudge them that. No particular reason I should jump on the bandwagon, though, because honestly most of the reptilians I've ever run into, I've eaten. Likewise, I seriously can't figure out what game of monopoly I'm playing, My little corner of the American Dream really has no one to invite over for a game.

No idea either; just dont want to thwart whatever is expressed? If it is something, ferrit it out. I see Cryptic as a neophyte, WRONG playing me probably NOT. I should start a thread, "does anyone know the Crypic" (just kidding). Cannot figure this one out is all, Obviously Reptilian, whether Croc or Alligator not sure. King lizard in the flesh? Oh you should imbibe/partake of the responses to some of my posts. "WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT" "SPEAK SPANGLISHOSITY", "MAKE SENSE FOR ONCE" "Were you born of human" (those are my closest friends and family making the entreaties BTW). I play the GAME best with myself as well, when I speak a little part of my dream is realized (chip away at the conundrum of ignorance or silence).

Whether he was man or son of God does not really matter. What matters is that the book(new testament) that was written because of him, is a great blue print of how to live a honest respectful life.

reply to post by nenothtu

By the way, if you truly believe that "The truth is all we have to live for", I truly feel sad for you. I have a wife, a son, sisters, and a great many other things to live for besides some "horrifying truth".

Sorry, I guess I might have been vague on that. As a species moving through time, history shows that we are collectors of knowledge. When we come up against something discovered to be false, we throw it away. Why would we embrace a lie simply because it feels good?

reply to post by nenothtu

If that is the case, why do my beliefs matter? you can neither see nor pinch what I believe. You cannot even prove I exist. This could be a horrible nightmare your having.

Why do you one day tell your kids that there's no Santa? That money doesn't grow on trees? That getting pregnant at 14 is wrong? You tell them these things because you want them to grow up and be responsible adults. Why? To make the world a better place. To have them become a part of the solution and not a part of the problem. We are a tribe. Everyone's beliefs matter. And, if those beliefs are wrong, if they become hurtful beliefs (even if you're not the one doing the hurting) then those beliefs must go. Those beliefs are a problem to the solution.

Kim Jung Un,
nuclear disasters,
Middle East desperately trying to get their hands on nuclear technology,
terrorists killing and believing they're getting virgins in heaven for it

I could go on and on, but I'll end here by saying how right you are. I AM having a horrible nightmare!

reply to post by nenothtu


well your separated from most of that crap. And interesting, jaguars? My point is that what ever people are doing right now won't survive.

We look at all the ancient ruins and we look around at our fragile plastic world and to think we will have enough of ourselves left over is not imaginable.

As long as you understand who is who and what is going on. There will be a time when that knowledge will be useful to you.

Lots of accidents will happen to people reguardless if they know the truth or not. Id rather the end round up be a lot bigger than just a few thousand.

But 7-8 billion people? Donno if everyone is gunna get with the program.

i sort of pushed record and this came out.

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by nenothtu

 

You know jiggerj, I like you. I wouldn't mind getting a six pack or a pound of coffee and sitting up all night discussing stuff with you. I might not want want you to preach my funeral , but that doesn't mean I dislike you or anything. Just thought I ought to get that out there, lest anyone take the wrong notions. You're someone I could go fishing with and sit on the riverbank philosophizing all day long with, waiting for a fish to bite.

Before going into much more, I want to address one particular point you made:

Would you prefer to remain ignorant all of your life when it comes to the idea of war, or would you rather know the truth?

In all honesty, I would prefer to remain ignorant of that particular facet of the human experience, and I would prefer that everyone remained ignorant of it. It leaves invisible wounds that never heal. They just scab over, and as time goes by you pay less attention to them, but they're always there and will jump back out at you at the damndest times, demanding to be noticed seemingly out of the blue. I would rather everyone remained ignorant of that. Sometimes in ignorance there really IS bliss, but once the ignorance of it is dispelled, you can never go back and unsee the seen. More on that in a bit, perhaps.

Sorry, I guess I might have been vague on that. As a species moving through time, history shows that we are collectors of knowledge. When we come up against something discovered to be false, we throw it away. Why would we embrace a lie simply because it feels good?

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by nenothtu

 

If that is the case, why do my beliefs matter? you can neither see nor pinch what I believe. You cannot even prove I exist. This could be a horrible nightmare your having.

Why do you one day tell your kids that there's no Santa?

I didn't. I was actually a bit put out by his mother telling him there WAS one, but once that belief had been implanted, I refused to disabuse him of that belief. That would have just been cruel, and he probably wouldn't have accepted it anyhow - he would have just gotten mad. I thought it better to let him find out on his own as time went along, because we learn no lesson as well as the ones we teach ourselves.

That money doesn't grow on trees?

Oddly, that never became an issue when my kids were growing up, so I can't really answer that.

That getting pregnant at 14 is wrong?

That's a little different. It's not "wrong" as an absolute, it's "wrong" because of the repercussions. If he were responsible enough at 14 to raise a child, it wouldn't be wrong at all, but very few 14 year olds are. They don't need educated in right and wrong so much as they need educated in the repercussions it will have for THEM, society be damned.

You tell them these things because you want them to grow up and be responsible adults. Why? To make the world a better place. To have them become a part of the solution and not a part of the problem. We are a tribe. Everyone's beliefs matter. And, if those beliefs are wrong, if they become hurtful beliefs (even if you're not the one doing the hurting) then those beliefs must go. Those beliefs are a problem to the solution.

Beliefs are not the problem, people are. it's what they do with those beliefs, how they twist them up for an all too human agenda, where the problems start creeping in.There are no hurtful beliefs, because mere belief is too insubstantial to break skin. There are only hurtful people.

Kim Jung Un,
nuclear disasters,
Middle East desperately trying to get their hands on nuclear technology,
terrorists killing and believing they're getting virgins in heaven for it

I could go on and on, but I'll end here by saying how right you are. I AM having a horrible nightmare!

Little Kimmie is a non-issue to me. He's a tempest in a teapot, of no danger or concern at all to anyone outside North Korea. It's outside PEOPLE'S reactions to his antics that are more worrisome to me.

Nuclear disasters are not a product of belief or religion, they are a function of science. They come from "truth" and "fact", and so might not have been the best example of what you are trying to get across here. In the end, though, they are ultimately the product of people as well, rather than science.

I don't care about the Middle East gaining nuclear technology. I've argued that point endlessly in the "OMG Iran's gonna get a NUKE!" threads. I think they SHOULD have it - it would either force them to be more responsible or erase them and solve the problem. One of those self-regulating systems like the lions eating the gazelles example you used earlier.

If you think terrorists are 'sploding themselves to get virgins in Jannah, then you haven't been talking to enough terrorists, and have bought the belief system that the MSM wants you to buy. I've spoken to Palestinian terrorists in particular, and virgins in paradise are not even on their list of motivations. Their gripes, usually, devolve to their own families. Someone they love has been killed by the other team, so they're going to "even it up" - which just keeps the cycle going, since the other guy thinks pretty much the same, and neither targets specific family members for retribution - they just kill the first thing they can get in range of, and consider that even... until the next escalation of the cycle from the other side.

The higher-ups are motivated by political considerations, border issues. Where the border should be, and what it should include. Each side seems to want it all, but politically.

The "virgins in Jennah" thing is just something the MSM and the powers that be on this side have seized on, twisted up, and fed to the masses here. Sure, it IS in the Qur'an (my wife says it's not "virgins" either, it's "houri", meaning "purified mates", not even humans, but a separate creation), but a clear reading of the passage, and the context OF the passage, make it clear that blowing up strangers will never get you there. As a matter of fact blowing up just yourself is enough to blow you straight into the hot hinges of Hell, much less blowing up yourself AND innocent strangers. That is specified VERY clearly in the Qur'an.

Terrorism, "Islamic" or not, is not a religious matter.

Originally posted by CrypticSouthpaw
reply to post by nenothtu

 

well your separated from most of that crap. And interesting, jaguars? My point is that what ever people are doing right now won't survive.

No, no jaguars - I'm not THAT far south! Just a whole lot of green and some other critters, from frogs up to bears. I don't know what kind of cat that was, just that it was as big as my hound, who weighs around 80 pounds, and it was solid black. It was running through my yard for shelter from a storm, so I didn't bother it.

We look at all the ancient ruins and we look around at our fragile plastic world and to think we will have enough of ourselves left over is not imaginable.

Every society, every civilization, thinks it will last forever. So far, NONE have made it, and there is no particular reason to think this one will, either.

As long as you understand who is who and what is going on. There will be a time when that knowledge will be useful to you.

Well, I think I do, but I won't really KNOW that until the time comes, I suppose. It's a bet, like everything else in this world, and sometimes you win the bet, sometimes you lose. You just bet the best way you can, and then play.

Lots of accidents will happen to people reguardless if they know the truth or not. Id rather the end round up be a lot bigger than just a few thousand.

But 7-8 billion people? Donno if everyone is gunna get with the program.

It is what it is, and will be what it will be. Can't worry about numbers or quotas, you can only worry about you.

i sort of pushed record and this came out.

I broke my own rule and watched the video, but didn't get much of anything out of it. Sounded like something out of Stargate SG-1 to me. I think there may have been words in it, but can't be sure of that, let alone what they were saying.

reply to post by nenothtu


hahahhahaa the lyrics were halfway into the song. I wrote that thing myself yesterday. Its kinda like like a musical Poem.

Sort of like rap but a little bit alternative.

Im not the best MC put it that way i havn't made to much music yet. BUT i will get better LOL.
And thats awesome it sounds like stargate hahahahaa



Youl get more out of this lol. BTW Yahweh likes to chose the form of a large black panther.

What you could of seen was an alien.
Because its above top secret.

reply to post by Spawn2001


You should check out The Urantia Book. It is very different from other religions. Actually it is not a religion, more of a guide book. There are no churches or clergy. Only a non-profit foundation that prints the book. Religion is personal, between you and God, so everyone's is different. The Urantia Book simply helps you develop your own ideas on God and creation and your place in it.

Originally posted by UB2120
reply to post by Spawn2001

 

You should check out The Urantia Book. It is very different from other religions. Actually it is not a religion, more of a guide book. There are no churches or clergy. Only a non-profit foundation that prints the book. Religion is personal, between you and God, so everyone's is different. The Urantia Book simply helps you develop your own ideas on God and creation and your place in it.

Very well written and completely open to dissemination. It is a mysterious wonderful book written by Archangles (Angels), the wisdom within it is profound, the truths (if one is to actuate/relegate and connect some dots) are beautiful; its persective upon the origin of all specie, the history of earth and the biblical times is something I cannot ignore.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


Yes, the book is very profound and I wish more people would give it a shot. I see so much bitterness toward religion due to the unbending attitude of the world's religion. The fanatical crystallization of the "word" has made those once mighty books barren expanses of words with little meaning to today's people. If people only knew the joy they are depriving themselves from. And that is the realization of the possibility of making for yourselves the greatest discovery possible for the human soul to make — the supernal experience of finding God for yourself, in yourself, and of yourself, and of doing all this as a fact in your own personal experience. .

reply to post by UB2120


Thank you, I checked that out over the Internet briefly. I have no religious background , I didn't go to church. Reading scripture almost feels like another language. I have always looked at religion from the outside, sorta like I just didnt get it. I am an agnostic and keep my mind open. I have never read the Bible, maybe some day.

Originally posted by Spawn2001
reply to post by UB2120

 

Thank you, I checked that out over the Internet briefly. I have no religious background , I didn't go to church. Reading scripture almost feels like another language. I have always looked at religion from the outside, sorta like I just didnt get it. I am an agnostic and keep my mind open. I have never read the Bible, maybe some day.

Do yourself a favor... Start with Matthew and stop at the end of John when and IF you do actually attempt to read it

reply to post by Akragon

I think he's talking about the Urantia Book (not the Bible Gospels - but yeah, he mentions maybe reading it also)...I read UB 20-some years ago, and it really is an astounding piece of 'dictation.' Have you checked it out?
I should give it another go. It's a HUGE tome....
and includes ET ideas, levels of other dimensions, etc (to the best of my recollection).

reply to post by Spawn2001


In my youth I felt that I was outside looking in as far as religion was concerned. It made no sense to me why I would need to assault my own sense of justice/fairness to "believe" in the Bible. I am not trying to put down the Bible in any way though. It served its purpose in my opinion and that was to keep the flame kindled through the Dark Ages to modern times. Science is slowly helping us shed superstition. We desire to attain harmony between Science, Philosophy and Religion. They are related and can also be called Truth, Beauty and Goodness.

Humans, as a species, have grown since the Biblical days and so must our religion now grow. We must have the courage to expand our ideas and ideals. Once people grasp the fact that there is not a single way to worship God, that God is no respecter of persons or religions and that he accepts all homage the world will be a better place. God loves the primitive bushman who barely has a religion just as much as the most religious person on Earth.

Here is a quote from the Urantia Book: "Some day a reformation in the Christian church may strike deep enough to get back to the unadulterated religious teachings of Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith. You may preach a religion about Jesus, but, perforce, you must live the religion of Jesus."

Many walk the first mile (preaching), but too few are willing to walk that second mile (to live the religion of Jesus).

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by Akragon

 

I think he's talking about the Urantia Book (not the Bible Gospels - but yeah, he mentions maybe reading it also)...I read UB 20-some years ago, and it really is an astounding piece of 'dictation.' Have you checked it out?
I should give it another go. It's a HUGE tome....
and includes ET ideas, levels of other dimensions, etc (to the best of my recollection).

edit on 29-5-2013 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)

The size of the Urantia Book is a turn off to today's people who are used to quick fixes. There is no shortcut in life, it must be lived day to day. Same with religious experience, everyone must work through this on their own, day to day.

The UB does talk about ET's in that it describes a Universe teeming with life. Trillions of inhabited planets peopled with "mortal" beings. Beings that can know and love God.

Dimensions, I think that is a generic term when discussing what the UB talks about. I look at it more like phases, similar to the light spectrum. Spirit beings exist in a phase outside our visible spectrum of light.

You must spiritually develop, just like we physically develop, to be able to communicate with spirit beings. The UB mentions that we gain nothing from death other than the fact of survival. So we begin, spiritually, just were we left off here on Earth.

reply to post by UB2120

Yes!!!
That.
Thanks for joining and bringing these ideas to light here.

Originally posted by UB2120
reply to post by Spawn2001

Here is a quote from the Urantia Book: "Some day a reformation in the Christian church may strike deep enough to get back to the unadulterated religious teachings of Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith. You may preach a religion about Jesus, but, perforce, you must live the religion of Jesus." Many walk the first mile (preaching), but too few are willing to walk that second mile (to live the religion of Jesus).

This may have applied a while ago or before the end times.

But we are reaching the final hour. The desperate hope to leave beacons of hope in the future have already happened.

We are seeing the fruits of their labour. You just have to find it. Such as that book has influenced many free thinkers.

The point about mentioning aliens is because we will be reunited with God because of the growing sin on this planet.

No i'm not a bible thumper. I am also a becon of hope for people. And what people need to believe in is themselves. Not Jesus. No one needs the teachings of Jesus to tell them how to be a good person. Another person is quite capable of that themselves and often do it. Who speaks the words and touches peoples hearts? Often a man or woman who has wisdom and understand of words or living experiences they grown with during life in their age.

You have to think you. Not Jesus. That was the work of babylonian priests who changed all that stuff.
It throws people off because it does not answer the important questions at all. it just gives you a moral code. And there is plenty of teachers on this planet, Strangers. who teach moral codes.

And moral codes are not everything. The universe is not created from threads of moral codes. We set moral codes. Its a fabrication. So anything Jesus would say in that sense only applies to our personal experiences (if) they happen. If you lived in a box and never traveled out, what what the words of Jesus be?

Just an interesting story. Wondering if heaven is on the other side of the box and Jesus is the guy who knocks it down. Other than that. It seems pretty useless to the guy who has no knowledge of whats outside the box.

His primary objective would be getting out. But waiting to get out won't come itself.
sorry.
Hes trapped in the box till and if he ever finds his way out.

Now forget the person in the box. because hes only an example to show you just how meaningless basing your sole purpose of your life on simply fabricated moral codes.

What really matters is understanding what the universe is. Hows its made why we are here and what do we do from now on? How do we reach god or the next level? What is the next level?

Moral codes and loving thy man only go so far.

You need the other half the teachings. The stuff that will actually save you rather than... maintaining seeds in the population to sprout for the future. We are the future. The future is now. And the seeds have sprouted.

We already know whats right and wrong we don't need to be told it everyday. What we need to know is what can we do to make things better? And if we can't do it without resistance? What must we do to surpass this resistance? What is resisting us from evolving? Why would there be resistance? Is there proof of this resistance? Will others become aware of the resistances that are halting our spiritual and mental advancements and lingering in the thought of * dimensions* and other nonsense.

This is the ultimate verse, of which, we all collaberate in its creation. With karma, or we burn in the wind and fire in Darma.

Our purpose is creation. I doubt many people here will take me seriously because of my age. and how adamant i am. But i am only so because i am not lieing about my alien experience. If i was i could of added onto the story further by now. Not only that just start posted a bunch of random nonsense like seeing them repeadily everynight or something.... i try to be an honest person because i live an unbelievable life.

edit on 30-5-2013 by CrypticSouthpaw because: (no reason given)