Pope Frances Preforms an Exorcism?

I noticed this today when I was going round the news site that speculation is rife throughout the media that this video below shows Pope Francis preforming an exorcism




According to the Telegraph

Smiling broadly, the Pope initially shook the man's hand, but the South American pontiff's expression changed dramatically after a priest from the Legionaries of Christ, a conservative order, leaned in close and spoke a few words to him.

With a more serious expression on his face, Francis placed both hands on the man's head for 15 seconds.

the story goes on to say that

"Exorcists who have seen the footage have no doubt – this was a prayer for liberation from Evil, an actual exorcism," said TV2000, which is owned by the Italian Bishops Conference.

and that

"The Pope is also the Bishop of Rome, and like any bishop he is also an exorcist," Father Gabriele Amorth, the Catholic Church's best known exorcist and the head of the International Association of Exorcists, told La Repubblica newspaper.

"It was a real exorcism," he said. "If the Vatican has denied this, it shows that they understand nothing", said Father Amorth who claimed that the Mexican was "possessed by four demons".

Seems to be quite interesting the Vatican line on this seems to be that the pope “did not intend to perform an exorcism”.

Anyway I figured that this would be a fitting topic for a ATS thread so let me know what you think of this guys, seems to be quite a few prominent exorcists who are saying this was the real deal but then again it could just be the Pope saying a prayer, I really dont know.

more links:

www.independent.co.uk...
abcnews.go.com...
metro.co.uk...
www.mirror.co.uk...

Pope Francis is a great guy. This is shown by his willingness to do an exorcism, unplanned, for free, on the spot. Look at his demeanor, too. He is totally adaptable and cares about those around him.

Posted pretty much exactly 24 hours ago

Link

Originally posted by n00bUK
Posted pretty much exactly 24 hours ago

Link

I feel a rant coming on, my thread has 4 or 5 sources, quotes from the press, the video, and a little bit of my own thaughts.

the link you showd me has just a link and the title of the articel

yet mine will probably be the one to get shut down.

those "one line" threads are my pet hate on ATS right now.

reply to post by darkbake


Thats because he knows the scam well.

"before i go anyone want to get married today? no gays obviously"

Well if you believe in religion and the power the Pope supposedly has then you would have to assume that he is given the ability to perform these without the elaborate preparation that usually accompany an exorcism.

It certainly appears he did something to this young man that was more than just a meet and greet.

Exorcisms are rites with defined processes.

This was the Pope blessing some guy, giving him a little more attention (perhaps due to whatever the priest said to him when he came up) and an understandable reaction from the fellow being blessed.

Not an exorcism.

Originally posted by adjensen
Exorcisms are rites with defined processes.

This was the Pope blessing some guy, giving him a little more attention (perhaps due to whatever the priest said to him when he came up) and an understandable reaction from the fellow being blessed.

Not an exorcism.

You are correct.....exorcisms are defined processes and the Pope is no closer to God than any other believer.

That was my error. If a normal priest must go through the preparations than so would the Pope. I doubt this was an exorcism.

I am not going to say “this was definitely a exorcism”

But to the members who are saying “nah he’s just saying a prayer” and go on to point out the finder points of exorcism I have to ask this

Why are there experts including very senior exorcists who are saying that this is “the real deal”.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
I am not going to say “this was definitely a exorcism”

But to the members who are saying “nah he’s just saying a prayer” and go on to point out the finder points of exorcism I have to ask this

Why are there experts including very senior exorcists who are saying that this is “the real deal”.

I've studied exorcisms a little, in no way an expert, but they do always seem to be complicated ordeals, I doubt that anyone could perform drive-by exorcisms such as the Pope did here.

He has no special power that any other priest doesn't have.

reply to post by Hopechest

He has no special power that any other priest doesn't have.

Another way of looking at it would be that, if the "possessed" person is a devout Catholic who believes he is possessed but is actually experiencing some kind of mental illness or anguish then the perceived authority of the Pope could cause him to react that way.

If the Pope himself does not believe that he personally has any special powers with regard to excorcism them that could have been a quick test to determine if the man is actually possessed or just believes that he is. In this case the test result could indicate that the man is not actually possessed, but simply believes that he is. The way that he seems to move on the the next blessing in a business-as-usual way makes me think that this may be the case.

Originally posted by Slugworth
reply to post by Hopechest

 

He has no special power that any other priest doesn't have.

Another way of looking at it would be that, if the "possessed" person is a devout Catholic who believes he is possessed but is actually experiencing some kind of mental illness or anguish then the perceived authority of the Pope could cause him to react that way.

If the Pope himself does not believe that he personally has any special powers with regard to excorcism them that could have been a quick test to determine if the man is actually possessed or just believes that he is. In this case the test result could indicate that the man is not actually possessed, but simply believes that he is. The way that he seems to move on the the next blessing in a business-as-usual way makes me think that this may be the case.

Certainly possible.

Perhaps the man standing next to the Pope said that the person believes he is possessed so the Pope simply took the moment to gauge the situation and hence the reaction from the young man.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
Why are there experts including very senior exorcists who are saying that this is “the real deal”.

From the "Mirror" article linked to in your OP:

An exorcism expert told Italian newspaper La Repubblica: “It was a prayer of liberation from evil or even a real exorcism.”

Okay, anonymous "exorcism expert" claims it might be an exorcism.

But The Vatican insisted that the Argentine Pope was saying a prayer and denied he carried out an exorcism.

A spokesman said: “He didn’t intend to perform any exorcism but, as he often does for the sick or suffering, he simply intended to pray for someone.”

The Vatican "insists" that it wasn't an exorcism.

Given that the rite consists of more than just laying on of hands and a short blessing, I'm going with the Vatican over a supposed "expert" who doesn't seem to know that an exorcism is more than that.

I posted on the other thread first, but this thread is SO MUCH better formed and laid out in a much more professional manner. If this site was user driven - I'd rather see this thread stay up and the other one taken down. Perhaps when multiple threads pop up - the flag system can be utilized and moderation actually look at the threads to determine which thread is more unworthy and deserving of deletion.

Now that being said - I agree that this is not an exorcism. However, it may have been a deliverance prayer - simply to illicit the reaction that marks the young man as possibly possessed. If this was the case, perhaps his name moved up on the list for a sanctioned exorcism. The list is long and they sanction very, very few people. It's a miracle to simply have those who believe they are suffering from demonic infestation - get approved for the exorcism rites.

This is assuming the child does not have a medical condition where he is afflicted with palsy or seizures. The child just may be reacting to stimuli.

Cirque

reply to post by Biigs


Well I wonder what his personal stance on gay marriage is. Okay, he doesn't like it you are correct. But here are his views on Fundamentalism:

FUNDAMENTALISM: Francis says it warps and weakens the faithful. "The teacher who is so arrogant as to make decisions for the disciple is not a good priest, he's a good dictator, an eraser of the religious personalities of others ... this kind of religiosity, so rigid, wraps itself in doctrines that pretend to provide justifications, but in reality they deny liberty and don't allow people to grow."

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


I find it interesting that grown people still believe in demons in this day and age.
One step forward and two steps back.
Thats the Cahtolics for you.
From one who did the little bride thing when she was 8.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


I saw this on the "Today Show" just this morning.
Its real folks.

Originally posted by adjensen
Exorcisms are rites with defined processes.

This was the Pope blessing some guy, giving him a little more attention (perhaps due to whatever the priest said to him when he came up) and an understandable reaction from the fellow being blessed.

Not an exorcism.

My thoughts were that it looked more like a healing than an exorcism. All that was missing was the man falling to the floor afterward.

reply to post by Hopechest


He has as much power as he believes he has. Didnt Jesus say this ? But yes as historically Exorcisms are a much more lengthy process and usually involve some kind of pea soup too. (LOL)

reply to post by adjensen


The Lords Prayer is a simple bequest for liberation from evil isnt it? Doesnt take too much time to recite that one.
Deliver us from evil
Amen