A Question For Athiests... Who Benefits From This?

Who benefits from THESE practices?

So one person in the history of religion showed some humility and the proves something? There is absolutely no doubt that religion is used a lot as a means to manipulate people, our politics is absolute proof of that.

Originally posted by Bone75
Your belief is that there is no God and

Nope, wrong right from the start..

Atheism does not believe in no god, rather, they do not believe in a god. There is a significant difference..one requires belief (a belief in no deities) and one doesn't...simply no belief..meaning there could be, but has yet to see any evidence to push forth a belief.
There may be sharks on a ocean planet 12 light years from here..or not...but there is no evidence, so why believe they are there sort of thing.

And the rest is your perspective. the bible (mostly a lot of what Christ supposedly said) is good basic wisdom..you can also find wisdom in some Deepak Chopra books, and Oprah. If it makes you a better person to those around you, then fantastic..if you use it as a weapon and makes you feel superior to the person next to you, then your doing it wrong..and if you try to take what makes you personally feel better mentally and force it on others in society through legislation, then we got issues. quite simple really.

reply to post by Bone75


Who benefits from being an atheist, who benefits from being a thiest; NIETHER it is the agnostic that ultimately benefits as seeing the two in a stalemate situation conquers/climbs the fence dividing them and thereby SITS ON IT unmoving and enjoying the 360 view. By attrition? NO will win the war of belief system diolog through entropy (never even having to be fought). Heck, they dont even have to formulate a battleplan BIBLE.

Originally posted by Murgatroid

Jesus explained, “Sesame! In order for someone to be saved, they must believe and receive me sincerely deep into their hearts, but most importantly it is crucial to have a sincere heart and mind. Many who have received me end up in hell, because during the prayer of confession they simply recited the prayer without sincerity!”

Jesus also said, “Many profess they have accepted and proclaimed me into their hearts, and with their mouths believe that they are saved, since they’ve believed in me for a long time, but, it is not the length of time that determines your salvation. It is the process of bearing fruits in your character that leads you closer to attaining salvation.

Many believe blindly the incorrect teaching that simply reciting with their mouths will guarantee their salvation -- and are under an illusion that they will go to heaven. Salvation should be realized through fear and trembling and each individual must grow in sincere faith.” Jesus is heartbroken and frustrated that so many souls end up in hell because they believed erroneously.

This is so true.
I've been "saved" about 5 times, and I'd say there's still a very good chance that I would go straight to hell if I were to drop dead right now. No one can force their self to believe anything, and for the longest time I despised God and cursed Jesus because of this. I mean how can you tell me that I'm going to spend eternity in hell for not believeing in something that every inch of my being WANTS to believe in? I did a pretty good job of pretending to be a Christian until I realized that if Jesus is who he says he is, then he knows I'm full of crap and full of doubt.

So I turned to science and history in search of a more plausible explaination of why we're here and guess what... I'm this /---/ close to TRULY believing the Man is who he says he is.

Originally posted by Bone75
I challenge anyone here to try doing something charitable without anyone seeing you and without telling anyone.

That reminds me of a mega church Pastor named Yong Park was taken to Heaven and Hell during an NDE and was shown why some saints are richly rewarded in Heaven, while others have no reward...

"...why some saints have magnificent Mansions in Heavens, while others live in small Community homes.

He was shown why, after serving the Lord his whole life, his house was still small and unfinished. He also witnessed how gruesome Hell was, and why so many Christians wound up there.

I have built homes for the widows to live in. This all cost huge amounts of money. So
how could this be? Why is my home in a land development? I am so upset!”

The angel replied sternly, “You do not deserve to live in such a beautiful nice home in Heaven
because you have been honored by people countless times. Every time you had built or done
something good, you were praised by people. You were even honored by the secular news.
Therefore, all your works are in vain.” (Matt 6:1) " Heaven & Hell 1000 to 1

Oops. Now, not not.

Originally posted by Bone75
I did a pretty good job of pretending to be a Christian until I realized that if Jesus is who he says he is, then he knows I'm full of crap and full of doubt.

One THE most profound posts I have read in a long time...

Left me speechless in fact.

Reminds me of a movie I watched a few days ago that TOTALLY blew my mind.

I have watched it twice now and wept through most of it both times.

If you’re seriously looking for some deep answers to real questions, watch this:

Your belief is that there is no God and religion was simply made up to control the masses via brainwashing.

It is not brainwashing. Animals and humans are born without any belief in a supernatural deity, thus religious people are the ones that are brainwashed.

Please get your facts straight before posting such threads.

Originally posted by DaTroof
Forgiveness and charity and any other moral values can and should be taught by the parents, not by the threat of eternal damnation. Just my opinion.

That is why parents follow the same principle.

The encourage and they punish their children.

Your belief is that there is no God and religion was simply made up to control the masses via brainwashing. So I'd like to share a few teachings from Christ that totally contradict your assumption.

The ones who think religion is for mass control , are the same people who are stuck into a mass control governmental system.

They admit it here and there.

But they think that religion is like their govt , and Imperialist dictator ship , which is stopping scientific development.

And at last , you see that they have nothing to do with the govt , too. They just complaint to the wall.

But what do they say ?

They are stuck in their past stance against religion , the bigotry is covering their eyes.

They hardly come back to religion.

Who has the courage to accept these facts , raise your hands.

The religion itself benefits from that, it is another factor in the
idealized view they place on the world, ritual has always been
a part of religion, from prayer to fasting its all just their ritual
or if you prefer their "Spells", incantations, the only reason
religious folks such as christians believe they are not just doing
rituals is that they believe their rituals are condoned by god and
therefore ok to practice, its not different than witchcraft.

The idea is that you force many people to practice these rituals
until they seem so common place they are taken as normal,
as evidence to this simply look at all the prayer not being allowed
in schools BS going around, it became so normal for people
to perform religious rituals in school that it now somehow offends
people when they are not allowed to force everyone to participate
in their strange custom.....

Originally posted by extraterrestrialentity

Your belief is that there is no God and religion was simply made up to control the masses via brainwashing.

It is not brainwashing. Animals and humans are born without any belief in a supernatural deity, thus religious people are the ones that are brainwashed.

Please get your facts straight before posting such threads.

And I suppose your parrot told you this?

Originally posted by Bone75

Originally posted by extraterrestrialentity

Your belief is that there is no God and religion was simply made up to control the masses via brainwashing.

It is not brainwashing. Animals and humans are born without any belief in a supernatural deity, thus religious people are the ones that are brainwashed.

Please get your facts straight before posting such threads.

And I suppose your parrot told you this?

Did you know multiplication when you were 5 months old? No. Did you know how to speak in English when you were just born? No. Such things must be taught; you were "taught" "god".

Did you actually think newborns were born with beliefs?

Originally posted by extraterrestrialentity

Originally posted by Bone75

Originally posted by extraterrestrialentity

Your belief is that there is no God and religion was simply made up to control the masses via brainwashing.

It is not brainwashing. Animals and humans are born without any belief in a supernatural deity, thus religious people are the ones that are brainwashed.

Please get your facts straight before posting such threads.

And I suppose your parrot told you this?

Did you know multiplication when you were 5 months old? No. Did you know how to speak in English when you were just born? No. Such things must be taught; you were "taught" "god".

Did you actually think newborns were born with beliefs?

At what point in a bird's life does his parents teach him to build a nest? When does a spider learn to weave a web? Are they not born with this knowledge?

Have you ever talked to someone who's never been exposed to religion in one form or another? If not, then what are you basing your assumption on?

reply to post by Bone75

At what point in a bird's life does his parents teach him to build a nest? When does a spider learn to weave a web? Are they not born with this knowledge?

What a lame comparison! A bird's or a spider's instinct doesn't equal a belief in God nor is it evidence of a nest building or web weaving religion.

A baby, from the moment they're born, knows how to suck, breath and poop. That isn't proof of a knowledge of God or a belief in "God".

Have you ever talked to someone who's never been exposed to religion in one form or another? If not, then what are you basing your assumption on?

Yep.
I remember being indoctrinated and schooled in "God this and God that". I wasn't given the option of having a position of critical thought as a young child. I was taught about God and how the Bible stories were truth.

My daughter however, was not. I kept her away from my preachy, hell fire and brimstone, original sin guilt, you need Jesus for salvation, family until she was old enough to question. And, when she came home from family visits, she had questions. "God" was such a foreign concept to her!

Although I still believe in some kind of "god/source", her arguments, even at a very young age, against the concept of my family's fairy tales Bible truth, and my revised version of god, were more compelling than their's or mine.

She is still an atheist, naturally, to this day. Arguing with her about God is akin to talking to Richard Dawkins or Christopher Hitchens. She's that brutally honest. She always was.

In my experience, any belief in gods is always a programmed belief.

Originally posted by Bone75
Your belief is that there is no God and religion was simply made up to control the masses via brainwashing.

Your OP is based on a false premise in the first place.

For your argument to be true, I would have to hold the simplified belief that all religions were made to control and brain wash the masses. I do not hold this belief, and the truth is much more complex than that.

Danke.

reply to post by Bone75


If all written and remembered knowledge of religious teachings AND all knowledge of science were to disappear overnight, which discipline would find its way back to today's knowledge the quickest?

I'll answer that for you: Science.
Nobody would ever replicate the religions the way they stand. It's highly possible that some would reach for some deity, but without - say - the sermon on the mount, or the crucifixion, all the current basis of Christianity would disappear forever. You'd be left with something closer to a cargo cult.

Not understanding is the very basis of theism. Everyone falls to the 'wise' who "know" the real meanings (apparently) of Bronze Age fables. Science seems to avoid this by constantly updating understanding.

Morality is not a monopoly of religion and faith. It's a very basic human trait. I don't try to be 'good' person because of any religion, and I certainly have no knowledge of a god. I definitely was not born with any.
Sure there are some lovely things written in the bible and other religious manuscripts, but limiting yourself to them denies you common sense, logic, and an open mind.
I would dearly love to 'feel' the presence of a deity, or to see real evidence of one. To date neither has happened. What has happened, though, is I have been happily amazed by what science has shown to me.
Life is miraculous enough already without making up stories to explain it.

I've no doubt this will come over as offensive to you, but it is relevant to the discussion, so without further ado, I throw this at you OP..

Righteousness
6 “Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.


So, by coming on here and preaching to all us non-believers, what do you hope to achieve?

According to your own religion, you will get no reward.

Originally posted by Bone75

Originally posted by midicon
reply to post by Bone75

 

They may serve as a reminder of our own motives and character.

And in so doing lead to introspection, growth and wisdom.

Thank you. Winner, winner, chicken dinner!

It wasn't until I actually tried to be charitable the way Jesus describes that I finally figured this out myself. It's one thing to strive to be a good person, but doing it his way will teach you more about yourself then you ever thought was there.

I challenge anyone here to try doing something charitable without anyone seeing you and without telling anyone. Try putting a bag of toys on a poor kids porch in the middle of the night without bringing a witness, and without telling a soul. It's not as easy as most think.

edit on 4-5-2013 by Bone75 because: (no reason given)

I see you have declared a winner. I do happen to agree with midicons sentiments and am compelled to ask if you see this as a reminder to Yourself of your motivations and not as a reminder to others.

Does this thread not stand in opposition of the very thing you are trying to understand. By declaring a winner are there not also losers? Are stars and flags not rewards ?

I am sure that there are many here that commit secret acts of kindness known only to themselves and it seems to me that the key then is not to turn it into a public challenge, but instead to let people know that Love is real and available to anyone.

Penny

Originally posted by Bone75
The account is from one of the only 2 authors in the Bible that actually walked with Christ... Matthew.

Extremely unlikely. It is far more likely Robin Hood walked the earth with his merry men.