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U.S. Senate Approves the Keystone Pipeline: Final Vote 62 to 37 !

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posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 07:50 PM
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Originally posted by jimmyx

" Our energy independence will be a done deal by 2020. We won't need a drop from Saudi Arabia."

not so fast....might want to read this

www.nytimes.com...


That NYT's article was written by Michael A. Levi, a "senior fellow" on the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR).

I would not trust any of the "steering" from CFR. Or the NYT for that matter.




posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 07:53 PM
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Wow Amerikan energy "independence" ???????

Until China got involved it was deader than a doornail that Canadian oil is going to China.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 08:05 PM
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Originally posted by coltcall
reply to post by TauCetixeta
 


"...In the meantime, underneath it all, Obama and Soros are oil people. The bulldozers have been clearing a path all along. Obama and Soros won't turn down the profits of the pipeline.

And you talk about the Bakken Oil Fields, the Keystone Pipeline...and what could end up being the costliest divorce on record:

The most expensive divorce in history? Oil tycoon worth $11.3 BILLION faces record-breaking settlement after his wife of 25 years files for divorce alleging he had an affair.



Speaking of George Soros, I see that his worth (as listed by Forbes) has more than DOUBLED in the last four years. In 2008, Soros was estimated to be worth over $8 billion. Now he's worth over $19 billion.
Doesn't anyone else here want to see Soros' tax paperwork?

As for the oil tycoon in Divorce Hell, it's a sad, sad story. How will he manage on less than $6 billion?
He'll be forced to downsize -- maybe give up a private jet or two.
It's one of those stories that keeps me up at night.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 08:10 PM
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reply to post by TauCetixeta
 

YES!

That's good news for the Western Canadian economy Big Time!

I guess in the final analysis the US didn't want Canada selling all the Oil to the Chinese via the Northern Gateway.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 08:14 PM
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Long live the US Senators for overwhemingly voting for the keystone Pipeline from Canada to Texas.
The voting ends 62 to 37 in favor of Texas. I am glad because we are the two countries and while i am 62 my big Daddy in Africa from Ogun State is 37. This means that we are the keystone Pipeline. and we are STEPHEN HARPER. Long live Canada



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 08:21 PM
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hmmm all i can see coming is a terrorist attack forign or domestic on this big pipe contianing highly flamable material... jus sayin... maby not even a terrorist attact... maby someone lights a smoke up neer the damn thing and bam you have a country wide explosion

BOOM haa in that case im in favor



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 08:58 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


I'm not trying to uproot you from your own beliefs, I just think that we need to be honest and look at this for what it is.

It's not American oil.

There's no guarantee it will be sold in America.

People that do not want the pipeline will lose land through imminent domain.

and

Transcanada gets to rake in the profits while the pipe runs right through the middle of our nation, just to be shipped elsewhere.

Is it just me that sees we may just be getting the short end of the stick?
edit on 23-3-2013 by sheepslayer247 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 09:13 PM
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Originally posted by TauCetixeta

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Well, this Senate IS good for something once in awhile. If those on the coasts don't want this...fine...the map doesn't show it running there. A good many in the Midwest sure want it though, and we'll all try real hard to deal with whatever downsides may come. The upsides of construction and economic benefit are far greater though.

For once, Congress does something I'm happy about! ....now will it live to see the end of the process? Hmm..


Jobs, Jobs, Jobs here in the USA.

Meanwhile, Cyprus is in chaos.
It's a good day to be an American.


American Exceptionalism wins every time.


what do you expect? not everyone can save the world or concern themselves farther than their own lives, who are you to sit there and judge? such arrogance yet what have you accomplished to feel so much better than those you judge?



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 09:17 PM
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reply to post by sheepslayer247
 


No, you aren't the only one - but you are doing a fantastic job of discussing it in a respectful and intelligent way.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 10:32 PM
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Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


I'm not trying to uproot you from your own beliefs, I just think that we need to be honest and look at this for what it is.

It's not American oil.

There's no guarantee it will be sold in America.

People that do not want the pipeline will lose land through imminent domain.

and

Transcanada gets to rake in the profits while the pipe runs right through the middle of our nation, just to be shipped elsewhere.

Is it just me that sees we may just be getting the short end of the stick?
edit on 23-3-2013 by sheepslayer247 because: (no reason given)


I don't know much about the issue and would like to know more about the oil going to other countries. I tend to believe what you are saying is true though but need more info. I doubt that this govt is going to do much in the way of long term benefit for the country.

Anyone else notice the similarity between the pipleline and proposed NA highway? Just speculation but the whole thing reminds me of a conveyor belt to rape the resources from the country once the IMF gets involved down the road. We have to pay back those foreign bankers somehow, just sayin.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 11:00 PM
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Wow, I don't pay attention to the news for a couple of days and the senate goes ahead and does two great things! This and the rejection of the UN small arms treaty.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 11:07 PM
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Ok.....#1. this tar sands oil is to be EXPORTED!!!! oil consumption in the USA is down double digits!!! this will not lower the price of fuel.
#2. tar sands from canada coming into SD is creating jobs but at what cost to the environment?!!
#3 what to do about the leftover matter from tar sands refining....blog.nwf.org...
#4 over 800 spills in one year in michigan?!?! WTF!!!www.freep.com...
#5 All this tar sands oil is being shipped OUT OF THE COUNTRY!!!! how does that help the USA become energy independent!!???! IT doesn't.
#6 Michigan is constantly cleaning up tar sands oil spills. climate-connections.org...


seems to be a lot of trolls on ATS these days.



posted on Mar, 23 2013 @ 11:52 PM
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reply to post by DankKing420
 





American Oil does not stay in America


Bahahaha, America has the biggest oil demand in the world. What do you mean doesn't stay here, we can't even produce enough to fill our demand so we import oil we don't export it.



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 12:45 AM
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reply to post by Evanzsayz
 


bahahaha....oh. U.S. oil exports are up to 1.6 million barrels a day, but that has absolutely nothing to do with this thread.



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 01:21 AM
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Its a good day for America, and Alberta.

Maybe there is a bit of common sense in your Gov after all.

I think a new windlass and bosuns chair are in order.



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 01:40 AM
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I am not sure about the math, something sounds off (not saying your making things up)

The pipeline is a long one. Its capacity is large. It is going to take more than 13.5 weeks to lay this down. A lot longer.

Pipelines require maintenance, There will be crews from every state the pipeline pass's through, there is huge economic spin off for this type of work and maintenance.

We are pipeline experts here. This is not the bottom of the Gulf of Mexico. There will be many pinch off points along the way, any accident can and will be dealt with in a timely and sensitive manner.

Listen. We have a lot of oil here, 400 yrs supply at current world consumption. But we have no way to refine it and bring it to market as fast as needed. This is where your infrastructure will come into play.

This is good for all us, or at least us who have to drive/pay fuel.

Even if your this kid below, you benefit. Moms van or the bus. Win win.




Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


According to the deal struck by Transcanada and the US unions (Teamsters and AFL-CIO), they expect to create 7,000,000 job hours and 13,000 jobs.

Do the math:

7,000,000 hours divided by 13,000 = 538 hours of work per job

538 hours divided by a 40 hour work week = 13.5 weeks of work.

13.5 weeks of work for the regular Joe while the unions, politicians and Transcanada make out like thieves.

Plus, after the contract is up Transcanada can bring in their own crews because there is no guarantee the upkeep and maintenance will be done by American workers.

Add on top of that the fact that Transcanada is only required to take out a $200 million insurance policy to pay for any environmental impact it may have, but $200 million cannot recover the loss we will experience if some of the best groundwater and farmland in the country is ruined.



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 01:49 AM
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Let's do it! What could go wrong?



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 01:50 AM
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While I am adamant in my belief that we need to be switching over to renewable energy sources, this is a good thing for the US at the moment, as we need to stop depending on other nations for our oil needs. Plus, this takes away some of the major excuses the oil companies have been using to jack up prices. I still cannot believe they have gotten away with it thus far, and I am hoping that this pipeline will cause a drastic reduction in fuel prices. But, knowing American capitalism and those who dominate the system, this is doubtful. They will simply come up with some other excuse to keep the prices where they are, if not raise them even more, lol.

The government should have regulated the oil business and their price gouging a long time ago, but unbeknownst to many, there are quite a number of high-ranking government officials, including members of Congress, who have a whole lot of money either invested in these oil companies, or coming in as income from these companies. Just look at our last president. Does anyone actually know how much money he made on gas alone, not to mention all of the contracts Haliburton received overseas in Iraq. And these types of people, in politics I mean, usually attempt to keep their involvement with these companies hidden from the public, but many became aware after the banking crisis, which led to talk about all of these treasury secretaries and other government members getting jobs, or having had jobs, with the major financial institutions. It is all connected where money is concerned.

Another reason we need to get away from countries like Saudi Arabia is that they are no allies of the US. They finance terrorism moreso than Iraq ever did, and their value is mind-blowing, as they receive so much income from countries like the US. As far as environmental concerns, there of course are some. However, if everything is planned and executed correctly, the risk is much, much less than an offshore drilling rig, considering there is not hundreds of feet of water to contend with. A big downside is that of terrorism. Although the threat of terrorism on US soil by foreigners is minimal, big projects like this draw a lot of attention, and allow any radical group the chance to sabotage the pipeline, as well as receive much attention, considering that everyone will already be focusing on this project.

So, I would think security jobs may increase as well. But, not for the average guy. The security contracts will be given to the firms that are already in bed with the government, companies like Blackwater, who do overseas security for both the military and private contractors. Or, watch the government use this to their advantage by stationing military personnel all throughout the middle of the US, under the guise of security, but for some other nefarious purpose. That is not likely, but I figured I would mention it as a possibility, however remote. But for too long things in America have not been about benefiting the little guy, and hopefully this pipeline will be something that does benefit the majority. Of course there are going to be companies and individuals who get even richer from this project, but there is nothing that can be done about that at the moment. Their time will come someday, I am sure of it.



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 01:52 AM
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TransCanada spokesman Shawn Howard defends the forecast: "If our budgets and work plans were way off, we'd lack credibility with the markets, shippers and others," he said. "Those who dispute the numbers clearly do not have this experience, have not actually done proper studies on this project to support their claims and can only venture guesses."

But TransCanada numbers count each job on a yearly basis. If the pipeline employs 10,000 people working for two years, that's 20,000 jobs by the company's count.

The estimates also include jobs in Canada, where about a third of the $7 billion pipeline would be constructed.

The U.S. State Department, which must green light the project, forecasts just 5,000 direct U.S. jobs over a two year construction period.

LINK to CNN




Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


I'm not trying to uproot you from your own beliefs, I just think that we need to be honest and look at this for what it is.

It's not American oil.

There's no guarantee it will be sold in America.

People that do not want the pipeline will lose land through imminent domain.

and

Transcanada gets to rake in the profits while the pipe runs right through the middle of our nation, just to be shipped elsewhere.

Is it just me that sees we may just be getting the short end of the stick?
edit on 23-3-2013 by sheepslayer247 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 24 2013 @ 03:25 AM
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Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by TauCetixeta
 

YES!

That's good news for the Western Canadian economy Big Time!

I guess in the final analysis the US didn't want Canada selling all the Oil to the Chinese via the Northern Gateway.



Northern Gateway will never happen, far too many environmental concerns about crossing two moutain ranges to a port in an earthquake zone at the end of a narrow rugged fjord. BC ain't the prairies.

and really I am amazed at the complacency people have about oil spills. Do many people realize that tar sands oil is not like regular crude, let alone refined product. It corrodes pipelines much faster from inside the pipe, 16 times more corrosive than crude oil. And when it spills it is the worst type of oil grade to clean up.

The effects of any oil spill on land have long lasting effects on the environment regardless how much dirt is scooped up and trucked away to where??? The folks who clean up a spill also experience long lasting effects to their health.

Has anyone considered the experience level of state run, EPA or private contractors who respond to oil spills on land for the states involved? Are they maintained, do the have money to sustain themselves? Do they run spill drills? Are they staffed? Will they need to fly teams in from Texas or California, how long will that take as the oil spills? Cuz it won't be folks from DC who will come to clean it all up. And emergency response plans for these lines are woefully lacking.

I am stating the above not to monger fear, but to undermine the naivity I have read in this thread so far. I applaud the people of Nebraska for standing up and voicing their concerns, regardless their political views. There is a large risk to the land, to the money that the land generates (billions for some of those states) and most importantly to the people living on that land, if there is a major spill from a tar sand pipeline.

And make sure you have your oil spill liabiliy insurance, if it's offered, without it you will be in a long legal battle for compensation.






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