Looking for examples of alien writing.

I like to lurk here a lot, usually the conversations that you guys have are things that I'm perfectly happy to read about but I don't really have an opinion. This is not one of those conversations. Linguistic anthropology was, in college, my major. I feel I can throw a little bit of light on the subject that others might not think of.

When it comes to alien forms written communication one can look at human methods of communication and figure out roughly how an alien race is probably going to communicate with itself in written form. This does take a few things into consideration however. First, one is going to automatically accept that humans and aliens are going to communicate with each other and amongst themselves in similar manners. We have to make this assumption now, because were talking about alien writing. If we were talking about alien art or alien music or alien communications of a non-written nature we could maybe overlook these things, but specifically in writing we have to assume they're going to communicate like us. This is because to write one must be able to see, and to actually perform something known as writing one does have to have the ability to associate a picture with a sound. Or, as is seen in many Asian languages, associate a picture with a concept or idea however in concrete that may be.

Second, we have to assume that these aliens are going to be writing down something for us to read. I think it's really important to know that what we've seen so far if they are real methods of alien communication are not writing. These beings are not trying to write to us they are using pictures for a very different reason than we think they're using these pictures. If you run across a tribesman who was never ever encountered your culture you're not give you the right to each other you want guilt hop to each other, but you can do things like make drawings are little sculptures that look like things you both will understand.

So let's say I'm an alien and I run across some primitive human; and I'm going to do something like take the time to teach and say hello or my name is good or am I going to make some kind of picture of a spaceship and point to it and see if he can put two and two together? Maybe he doesn't have writing maybe his species is not capable of using that form of communication and in that case obviously not going to be pass on written texts. And I don't think they're passing on written text to us that's ridiculous; we're not going to know what they say anyway, even if we could begin to decipher the syllabary in use.

Now, at this point, some of you are probably saying way why did you say syllabary? You'd be correct that it may be an abjad as is seen in the Arabic language, but I don't think we'd see logographic language being used, and this is because most of human society in today's hyper advanced modern era do not use logograms to convey much information. Now it is true that sentences like I heart you, where an heart is a literal picture of a heart, do use logographemes. However one will usually find that when one introduces a writing system where in picture equates to sound oh also concept or idea written communication becomes hard. I'm there's actually a reason why there are no purely logographic scripts anywhere. Some people have tried to create a logo graphic script exclusively a logographic scripts to be used with languages either modern or constructed however we've noticed that it's impractical for use.

To this point I propose that if aliens do right in the same way that we do, and it would pretty much have to be the same way with that we do to be considered writing, the method they would use would resemble the Latin script in construction, Semetic languages in construction, or perhaps something like cuneiform. If aliens were to actually use a sort of logographic system they would probably use it something similar to Chinese hanzi. I personally don't think they would do something similar to the Chinese hanzi but only because Chinese hanzi are incredibly complex, and their major downside is that it's actually really hard to create new words.

Honestly the weight of the right language now, which is to say in a system that tries its best to make a picture of that produces one set sound and then string those pictures together to create a set of sounds that is now word (a system seen in almost every single modern language used by human beings), would probably be what most alien species who write to communicate would use.

Now let's think for a moment what if they don't speak what if they do communicate telepathically, something I honestly do not in any way believe is the case (because it's biologically ridiculous BTW or so very many reasons), well then at that point they are written language would function so radically different from our own methods of written language that we as a species would never be able to communicate.

continued below.

I know the above posts assumes a lot. We kind of have to assume a lot. Having never met a real alien I can't answer this for certain but as someone who has taken the time to study language both written and verbally, what I can tell you with this: internationally the go to method of writing a language down involves transliterated into the Latin script. And there's a really good reason for that, every letter in the Latin script minus a couple have a pretty standard pronunciation. It's that standard pronunciation and the fact that one can place letters randomly on a piece of paper and then read out what that word would be that makes using the Latin script, which is to say syllabary languages, much more efficient, common, and ultimately I think probably what aliens would do.

TL; DR = pictorial languages are incredibly impractical, so they probably use a syllabary.

Originally posted by Aazadan

Originally posted by rangersdad
reply to post by Aazadan

 

have you tried using a search engine? I just did and found this:

ancient alien writing

Yes actually, and the results google gave me were all unsourced outdated webpages.
www.anomalies-unlimited.com...
www.angelfire.com...

For example.

well I used Yahoo to get those results....I was looking up ancient alien writings several years ago and if you go back far enough in the search engines, you will find pics of what was on the alien ships during the attack on los angeles in the 40's or 50's...good luck...

Well some of it is in the languages already. Lakota for example. Chinese. Latin.

I forgot to mention, sanskrit, phoenician.

www.abduct.com...

www.abduct.com...

If you've been abducted some of this could wake you up, thats all I can say, and you may have an emotional response to it, so be gentle on self.

Originally posted by jimmiec
011100110100110001100111001010110

Well I don't Know about anyone else but when I view "011100110100110001100111001010110"
or especially a full page of it, I feel like I am looking at an alien language for sure


Good one jimmiec

"It's all Greek to me!"

reply to post by Aazadan


While we're speculating, I guess human writing might be our best example of alien writing, if you're taking an ET hypothesis to begin with. Look at early alphabets: proto-Mandarin, Sanskrit, Linear A, runes and glyphs. Marvel at how fully formed they are, and how secret some of them still are (Linear A).

Think too about how little writing we generate as modern humans, as individuals: we print our name on a form once in a while, write a shopping list. If ET came here, why would they be writing anything down? Unless they also taught us to read and write in that same language? Priests and scribes who claimed divine contact were also the ones writing in the ancient times.

Food for an always interesting thought experiment!

Originally posted by binkbonk
reply to post by Aazadan

 

I'm under the impression that they wrote with hieroglyphs. It really seems like the most efficient form of writing. A picture paints a thousand words. In a few thousand years historians will look back on our alphabet as slave text.

...that said, have you checked out Sumarian cuneiform? If not, start there.

How is it more efficient?

English and the English alphabet in my mind is the most efficient language we have on the planet. It can readily evolve at the drop of a hat to describe any concept that is required of its user (which some and many languages are completely incapable of doing) even to the point you can make up a compound word on the spot and deliver its meaning almost effortlessly between two people (and that is what a language is for, communication and information transfer, hieroglyphics are rubbish at that), and an alphabet is a small yet infinitely configurable system compared to things like hieroglyphs, given hieroglyphs are often used like an alphabet anyway its kinda moot, id rather have a set of simple strokes than complex pictures or characters.

I mean heck just look at Chinese, to me its a nightmare with every word being limited to its own mostly unique character and new concepts having to be made up from combining all sorts of immutable characters together to get a specific meaning... hell its the reason you get such comical translations from it when you translate it into a much more plastic language as English. Katakana might be slightly better than English since its characters have more broader range of sounds so you can represent spoken words with less symbols.

reply to post by BigfootNZ


This is what I stated in my post at the top of the page.

some real, some not, some ?




as in:

reply to post by Aazadan

Hi Azadan

Here are some LINKS ref: Roswell inscriptions and others from around the globe - not sure how much of it is legit, but a fun concept for study anyway

www.ancientx.com...

www.abduct.com...


www.google.com...://danielschereck.com/wp2007/images-roswell/r20070706-roswell70.jpg&imgrefurl=http://danielschereck.com/wp2007 /wp-2007newmexico-roswell.htm&h=504&w=1013&sz=114&tbnid=Jb85dN3Y0soS2M:&tbnh=60&tbnw=120&zoom=1&usg=__JkFNQKUQOjMGi4AQtJ87pQ53d2U=&docid=yyZrFtxA0xKuY M&hl=en&sa=X&ei=avwwUfiSLMmwiQKUtIHQCQ&ved=0CDsQ9QEwAw&dur=263

Then of course there is the VMS 408 (Voynich MS) Mystery Script - which is probably only a human shorthand

reply to post by obscurepanda


obscurepanda --- You can also communicate with other highly intelligent entities...with the use of sign and sound languages.

I believe that some intelligent races in our Universe [besides our own], can not only speak and write languages --- but can communicate telepathically [not necessiarly in a verbal word sense] --- but transmission of mental thought patterns to other highly intelligent biological entity's is highly probable.

reply to post by Aazadan


Maybe aliens do not use writing.....

huh, I've been waiting for this question. I have been working on building a database of Martian symbology for a while now. Before I go on, I believe that there is a bonafide unknown slab being held at the Large Hadron Collider/CERN which has engraved symbols of unknown origin. The slab is held in a secure area along with all known human languages on synthetic (eg. glass and persplex) slabs. The whole collection is inside a glass area and environmentally sealed. Someone once posted an image on ATS of the chamber where the slabs are held, but they did not know the meaning of what they were. Maybe you could find it.

Here are a few suspected characters as seen by NASA/JPL:


ESP_019641_2310
[h57xv7.5]
Type1


ESP_019641_2310
[h66xv57.9]
Type1


ESP_019641_2310
[h66xv58.5]
Type1


ESP_019641_2310
[h48.1xv48.8]
Type1


ESP_019641_2310
[h54xv12.8]
Type1


ESP_019641_2310
[h37.2xv51.2]
Type1


ESP_019641_2310
[h43.5xv29]
Type3


ESP_027343_1410
[h85.5xv1.5]
Type3

[Types: 0 – Unknown; 1 – Unknown character; 2 – Unknown structure; 3 – Known human character; 4 Symbol]

That is all I will put up at the moment.

Note that not every MRO, rover or Curiosity picture show suspected symbols or characters. Most do not. An overwhelming number of images that MAY have such things are of such poor quality or the symbol is so unclear that we cannot adequately confirm that they are actual objects of interest.

When examining images for objects of interest several key factors must be taken into consideration. These are compression of the image; obfuscation; artifacts; distortion caused by processing such as zooming. Some other issues we are aware of include interference; signal delay; and motion. Natural things such as dust and gas also damage visibility.

op you assume these entities are aliens from outerspace.. and they are physical beings like humans..

they dont write, they use humans to be their channel for writing (medium/autowriting). in their realm they use some kind of method called loosh by robert monroe , i auggest you read robert monroe's books available free pdf on the net and gain understanding on non physical communication between beings.

as for the pieces of alien writing seen by witnesses , they are just for show, to further deceive the witness,its all there just like their gauges, instruments and console seen in the interior of UFOs by witnesses..

Wow, quite a few good responses, thanks. The big issue though is figuring out the clear fakes from the ones that are more questionable, and then figuring out which of those are actually real, and then last what is possibly alien vs a lost human language. Lots of work there.

Originally posted by Autograf
reply to post by Aazadan

 

Think too about how little writing we generate as modern humans, as individuals: we print our name on a form once in a while, write a shopping list. If ET came here, why would they be writing anything down? Unless they also taught us to read and write in that same language? Priests and scribes who claimed divine contact were also the ones writing in the ancient times.

You can write without it being handwriting. To use your example of a form, someone wrote that. Someone also wrote the program (including the plain english in it) that auto generates the form. To top it off, you wrote that post. Human development has followed the pattern that the more developed we become the more we write. That's because short of a borg-like hive mind the most efficient form of mass communicating an idea over time is writing.

Originally posted by Erno86
I believe that some intelligent races in our Universe [besides our own], can not only speak and write languages --- but can communicate telepathically [not necessiarly in a verbal word sense] --- but transmission of mental thought patterns to other highly intelligent biological entity's is highly probable.

I'm not ruling out telepathy but telepathy is a more efficient form of the spoken word. The written word still has a place that the spoken word never will. Primarily that without being edited it doesn't change over time and evolve with the language. What's written now and left alone won't change over 500 years. An idea being transmitted through a language that evolves with new/changing context is altered significantly over 500 years.

Originally posted by binkbonk
reply to post by Aazadan

 

I'm under the impression that they wrote with hieroglyphs. It really seems like the most efficient form of writing. A picture paints a thousand words. In a few thousand years historians will look back on our alphabet as slave text.

...that said, have you checked out Sumarian cuneiform? If not, start there.

edit on 26-2-2013 by binkbonk because: (no reason given)

from that point i see the Asian languages as better (even though difficult to learn). It' much better when few more lines can describe a whole word rather than having to type many letters.

To figure out how they write and how they communicate I think we have to put ourselves in the "alien's" mind.

Naturally, the method of communication depends on their technology and their purpose. If they have advanced quantum entanglement communication tech then humans are really behind the eight ball, so-to-speak. To decipher such communication will obviously require our own technological advance. The intrinsic form used in such communication could take any form we can imagine, and probably that we have not yet imagined.

However, when it comes to "writing", which is more to the point of the OP, then we can direct our thoughts to their purpose in communicating. For example, if they are writing formulae and equations that we have not yet discovered, they may well write in forms that we do not understand. On the other hand, if they are trying to establish a dialogue with us then they will probably use writing that we recognize, if not as characters (Roman alpha-numeric, for example) then as symbols or hieroglyphs which we can begin to digest and even make some theoretical understanding.

So for example, whilst humans may not understand binary code at face value, we can understand the meaning of two humanoid forms holding hands. Our intuition can lead us astray in deducing actual meaning, but the essential deduction that two 'people' are friends or that two 'people' are together in some way is basic.



My opinion is that there are two on-going levels of exploratory alien communication with humans.

First we have the direct use of characters and symbols to communicate a message. Understanding what we see and making sense of it may seem a monumental task, but a methodical analysis of those characters and symbols sets the groundwork for better understanding. That will come about as specific characters and symbols repeat.

Secondly, we have the suspected communication via means we do not understand of massive amounts of data that we have hardly an iota of conceptualization. Any alien species or civilization will not give us the Rosetta Stone to decode such data or even to discover it - we have to advance our own tech to the point that WE discover it. Some research is aimed at finding a connection between the characters and symbols thus-far seen and this higher level of communication.

Some theories suggest that our own radio signals from Opportunity, Curiosity and MRO have been 'hijacked' or piggybacked by aliens and their own comms embedded with ours. Our lack of tech makes us blind to their communications, like a cat must be mystified by things such as transparent glass, television images, and radio communication. Though I may be grossly under-estimating the cat, which I do adore...

Understanding what and why aliens would be writing can give us a better understanding as to how they would be communicating. For instance, saying "hello" on Mars would probably use a different technology than communicating their 'Rules of Contact' which may entail billions of times the data.

Pretty cool thread, I want to see some legitimate alien writing as well.

The way to think about that is like this. If our civilization was trying to be a message or any civilization in the future to decipher how would we do it? Personally I think they would leave a message in binary code ones and zeros. Because there is nothing like that it makes me believe that we have never been visited but even if we have they definitely did not leave a message.

You might try the Voynich manuscript, it was apparently written in the middle ages and scholars have never been able to decipher it. It is either a load of rubbish or some unknown language, I am not saying it is Alien but if it cant be deciphered from known languages then who knows where it is from.
Maybe it is not of this world.