Help ATS with a contribution via PayPal:
learn more

injustice in law will not be over come by lawlessness

page: 1
5
<<   2 >>

log in

join

posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:16 PM
link   
i feel the pain and anguish felt by the needless death of an internet activist who was a true genius,
i see the double standard in law where bankers get bonuses for using computers and complex programs to destroy the economy, while information activists using computers and complex programs get life behind bars.

i see the proportionality imbalance, where one intends on harm and damage to another for profit, and bonuses.
while the other intends only to liberate information for the public benefit, and no personal reward.

when one group of bankers can use computers and programs to destroy an entire economy and profit and suffer no prosecutions, yet mention computers and activists and the outcome is decades in prison.

where have we gone wrong?

some suggest the laws are overly harsh, others say laws are selectively enforced,
i see it like this,
when breaking into someone's house with a gun gets you less "minimum" time than breaking into someone computer, some thing is wrong.

because of the way the computer laws are written, nearly every one using a computer is liable for prosecution,
it only becomes a matter of time before you say or do something that brings the attention of the "prosecutors"

its outrageous that bankers can use computers to commit crimes and not be charged to the same level,

but,

you cant correct years of broadly written computer laws, and years worth of prosicutorial over reach, or selective enforcement by committing computer crimes.

the justices have very little choice in sentencing, and no choice in "who" is prosecuted,
they dont make the laws, the dont pick "who" is "targeted" for selective prosecution.

and im sure if you got some bankers infront of them and pointed out the modus operandi of the bankers was criminal AND THEY USED COMPUTERS, they would too spend decades in jail.

some say ignorance of the law is no excuse, but what happens if the law makers are ignorant to the technology and its uses and operation? what does it mean if they are just passing laws they are "given" without knowing the implication or operation of these laws in the context of the internet age?

is it the justices fault that our law makers are handed one sided 1% legislation to pass?
it is not the justices that deserve our ire
it is the bought and payed for legislators passing bills they did not write,
that they do not understand,
for the benefit of a corporate elite, who uses selective enforcement, to destroy dissent.

we need to come together to change the laws written by the private prison industrial complex,
written by the financial capital industrial complex
and the movie industrial complex

we need to rebalance the laws so the punishment fits the crime,
not threaten the pillars of justice.

i plead that you understand the pain you feel and the injustice of the system,
is being directed in the wrong place for the wrong reasons.

do not threaten the pillars of a corrupt system,
this is very bad PR and i wonder if aaron would approve?

instead find out who wrote the legislation, and write new legislation "within" the moral code of our society,
instead of leaving unjust laws on the books, change them in favour of the 99% of people that they currently target.

bury your pain for now, use it for something constructive later, change the laws to reflect the real digital universe we inhabit, not the fearful one the law makers are trying to prevent.

chaos is not what aaron would have wanted

xploder




posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:19 PM
link   
Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:29 PM
link   

Originally posted by ausername
Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.


all you get is more flames,
all you get is more chaos,

more people put in the firing line of the prosecutors.
occupy justice, for aaron and for the others being targeted,

violence only creates more violence,
dont let your pain lead you into a dark place,
we can win this by simply changing the laws,

people feel the injustice, educate them into a force for peaceful lawful change.

xploder



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:30 PM
link   
reply to post by XPLodER
 


Explanation: S&F!

The Laws of War must be adhered to or it is a War Crime!

And the West has been at was for over a decade now!

So when the laws of war are appled against injustice and those who enforce injustice ... there won't be any problems at all ok!

It is completely legitimate to take out the Commander in Chief AKA The Potus and or the entire Congress, who authorizes funds for the military, as long as one is wearing an Identifiable Uniform and one uses FMJ ammunition ... as was garanteed under the 2nd Amendment of The Constitution of the USA (not incorporated).

Personal Disclosure: Because ... It's Too Late To Apologize!




Be well Citizen!



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:34 PM
link   

Originally posted by ausername
Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.

and sometimes...that approach sees the whole city burn down to leave nothing for anyone in the end. Good or Bad.

@ OP

Great one here and I flagged ya before even reading the OP. I starred ya after that.
Very good points all around!



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:46 PM
link   
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


Explanation: Uhmmm?


Aiding and Abetting the criminals through cowardly inaction deserves no sympathy at all! :shk:


Furthermore it is not like one can't rebuild ... The USA does it every year after the Hurricane season!


Personal Disclosure: Do I make myself CLEAR!



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 01:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by OmegaLogos
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


Explanation: Uhmmm?


Aiding and Abetting the criminals through cowardly inaction deserves no sympathy at all! :shk:


Furthermore it is not like one can't rebuild ... The USA does it every year after the Hurricane season!


Personal Disclosure: Do I make myself CLEAR!


you course of action puts more young geniuses in harms way,
and more pain will be felt when the same laws are used to destroy them,

a cycle like that can only be stopped by education and political action.

no more persecution, no more death.
change the 30 year old laws to reflect the digital reality,
not the "ghost" stories of the political elite

chaos is never good for us citizens

xploder



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 02:14 PM
link   

Originally posted by OmegaLogos
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


Explanation: Uhmmm?


Aiding and Abetting the criminals through cowardly inaction deserves no sympathy at all! :shk:


Furthermore it is not like one can't rebuild ... The USA does it every year after the Hurricane season!


Personal Disclosure: Do I make myself CLEAR!

I think you make yourself very clear, indeed.

You'd rather destroy the nation (or see it destroy itself) on the assumption and hope it can be rebuilt from the ashes remaining ..rather than make every possible effort before it comes to that as the absolute last resort.

I can't look my son in the eyes, years from now and in a ruined parody of what used to be as we know it today and tell him I had anything to do with wanting to see that outcome. I do think in those terms. Many do not.

I don't see the destruction of this nation and it's institutions as an option, tactic or even idea to be seriously considered.

It's the LAST choice and option because to reach it, we've failed. We've ALL failed and every attempt in every direction has failed. If the nation is brought down to that level, I seriously doubt we see a functioning one in any sense worthy of that description again in our lifetimes. That is the absolute last anyone should hope to see happen.
edit on 27-1-2013 by Wrabbit2000 because: minor correction.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 02:32 PM
link   
I have trouble looking at the whole "change the system from within" mentality. How can you actually go about trying to even START changing the system when the whole deck is stacked against you? What are our options? Banding together, filling out a petition and mailing it to our congressman all so he can put it into his recycle bin?

If you accept the fact that our politicians are corrupt then why do you think that they will listen to your pleas to change the system? So now we are left with the option to vote these guys out of office. Well that rationale always falls apart because people always proclaim that its not their guy who is the problem its everyone else. Also what about districts where the congressman runs unopposed every year? Even if they do have opponents, the MSM misrepresents the candidates until the populous has the "vote for lesser of two evils" mentality which is just about the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

Ok so now we can try to do a peaceful protest, but oh wait that was already attempted with OWS which was belittled by the MSM and outright subverted by the government.

So now my question to you is, how long can you continue to work within the system to change it before you realize that it is hopeless and you need to try more forceful approaches? The elite don't want change and they will fight tooth and nail to maintain the status quo and they have FAR more resources and know the game FAR better than you or I could hope to know it. Eventually you have to say enough is enough, the system doesn't work for us anymore its time to overthrow it and institute a new system.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 02:38 PM
link   
reply to post by XPLodER
 


Explanation: Uhmmm? :shk:

Isn't war the USA's current course of action?


I am only reflecting that! I didn't start these wars.

TPTB have already targeted us all!

Tweeters 'could be military targets' (by Corruption Exposed posted on 13-12-2012 @ 03:30 PM) [ATS]

Congress Wants to See Obama's "License to Kill" (by Jean Paul Zodeaux posted on 31-7-2012 @ 04:11 PM) [ATS]

Edited to add and link this prophetic ATS thread ...

Ron Paul to Obama : Don't murder US citizens! (by Vitchilo posted on 23-12-2011 @ 02:13 AM) [ATS]

What is good for the goose is good for the gander!

Personal Disclosure: And since I advocated that combatants use and apply the laws of war, act legally, and follow through on their OATHS ... where is the chaos and fear?

Besides ... people and political parties come and go ... policy and principles are FOREVER!

What are citizens willing to kill and die for ... if not the moral high ground where the tree of liberty is planted and rooted, then their lives are meaningless and they are monsters worthy of destruction.

My post ARE INDEED educational and war is indeed a politcial action ok!

edit on 27-1-2013 by OmegaLogos because: Edited to add the edit and link.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:21 PM
link   
reply to post by Krazysh0t
 


your actions however envisioned by you are seen as antithetical to real people in their day to day lives,
you may see the truth in the fact that change in the face of corruption is impossable,
but untill the average citizen sees the truth on their own terms nothing will change,

that is why i say education and lawful petitions are the ONLY way to go,
because your actions are easily used for disinformation to prevent education

OWS did not fail, it did exactly what it was ment to do,
it made people ask questions, questions that lead to education.

you are trying to fight an injustice on its own terms and on its own home terf.

you will fail unless a majority of people understand WHY.

at the moment no one under stands the simple truth,

years of bad laws can only be defeated with years of good laws,
not by breaking bad laws

xploder



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:27 PM
link   
reply to post by OmegaLogos
 


i have read what you have presented,
and am shocked that free speech can now mean a death threat, from governments,
but does this not show you the power of free speech?

you are falling into a trap,
one where you believe we are powerless,
unless we fight,

once educated these bad laws will be repealed.

you seek to incite people to an action designed to fail.

these actions lead to more bad laws, not less

TPTB want you to feel helpless to the point of reaction,
they want you to act in anger because they know how to react to anger.

they are helpless if they face peaceful lawful righteous indignation

xploder
edit on 27-1-2013 by XPLodER because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:28 PM
link   

Originally posted by XPLodER
reply to post by Krazysh0t
 


your actions however envisioned by you are seen as antithetical to real people in their day to day lives,
you may see the truth in the fact that change in the face of corruption is impossable,
but untill the average citizen sees the truth on their own terms nothing will change,

that is why i say education and lawful petitions are the ONLY way to go,
because your actions are easily used for disinformation to prevent education

OWS did not fail, it did exactly what it was ment to do,
it made people ask questions, questions that lead to education.

you are trying to fight an injustice on its own terms and on its own home terf.

you will fail unless a majority of people understand WHY.

at the moment no one under stands the simple truth,

years of bad laws can only be defeated with years of good laws,
not by breaking bad laws

xploder


Instead of replacing bad laws with good laws, why not just get rid of the bad laws?

All suspected crimes already fall under existing laws. We just don't have anyone with the stones to prosecute.

SnF



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:32 PM
link   
reply to post by beezzer
 



Instead of replacing bad laws with good laws, why not just get rid of the bad laws?

All suspected crimes already fall under existing laws. We just don't have anyone with the stones to prosecute.

SnF


with a movement of people pushing for just laws, and a following of what good laws look like,
the bad ones will become self evident

xploder



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:43 PM
link   
reply to post by XPLodER
 


You bring up some very good points. I must star your post for this. People do need to be educated. The government is good at marginalizing small groups of dissidents, but if a larger portion of people are aware they would have a much harder time getting a lid on things. I too believe this is the case. This is why I haven't gotten behind any groups like Anonymous or any local rebel rousing militias yet. I am waiting for more people to become involved.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:55 PM
link   
reply to post by XPLodER
 


Explanation: And what did Aarons 'soft actions' do for him!

HE IS NOW DEAD! THAT"S WHAT BEING SOFT LEADS TO!

Go Hard! or Go HOME TO MOMMY!

Personal Disclosure: The time for public education is over! Sandy Hook showed that only homeschooling will be safe from now on.

And since 9/11 and an illegal war in Iraq and a 10yr+ war in Afghanistan [note ww2 only lasted 6yrs] that went from turfing out the taliban to protecting the opium drug trade, plus the hypocrisy over Iranian non existent nukes when NK clearly has nukes, plus the USA involvemnet in the Arab Spring Uprising that has lead to the scandelous Benghazigate and then with DOJ's Fast and Furious FARCICAL and illegal cross border BS ... well people have 10+ yrs to 'get educated'!


Whats the Patriot Act for ... oh yeah .. subduing REAL PATRIOTS!

Tis the season for WAR OK!
:

Anonymous Hacks Gov Site, posts video- Claims to have armed "cyber" nuclear warheads (by TrueAmerican posted on 26-1-2013 @ 02:50 AM) [ATS]

And I am not the only one who can see it!


Wake up and smell the bodies of innocent islamic babies burning in cemetaries due to Hellfire missile strikes ok .. or shall I keep droning on and on and on!



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 03:56 PM
link   
reply to post by Krazysh0t
 
You make some excellent points and they are ones I see raised here on a near daily basis in terms of one side saying to tear down the system and another advocating that we work within it.

I think my leanings on this are as clear as can ever be made but I'd like to address your points as to why. After all, I'm committed at this point to years of my life just being educated to where I can move to the active side of trying to change anything. To say I strongly believe in it is redundant to an extreme.



I'd start by noting the most obvious and most damning of the evidence against the argument that the system doesn't work. That is simply this. We need to try before determining it's not functional. In this most recent 2012 election this site was full of posts and people decrying any suggesting of even voting, let alone doing anything more. That's certainly not the way to attempt working with something before declaring it a lost cause. It can be put into numbers though and the numbers are startling.

(Source)

The National Presidential General Elections turnout range between 50-60% and usually to the lower side of it.

National off-year elections run a pathetic 30-40% on average. These numbers hold fairly steady going back a good distance in time for elections looked at. (50% of Congress is elected in these)

If we don't even show up, we can't stand with the right to demand it change to our will and then condemn the system when it won't do just that. We all need to at least show up.

A couple quotes come to mind on this as well.... The names should be familiar enough.


“If liberty and equality, as is thought by some are chiefly to be found in democracy, they will be best attained when all persons alike share in the government to the utmost.”
-- Aristotle


"Anti-democracy...is a virus that exists, and pro-democracy is the antibody to that virus, and I think we have to become vigilant, and we have to stay on top of the issues of democracy and freedom."
-- Harry Belafonte


Democracy is an objective. Democratization is a process. Democratization serves the cause of peace because it offers the possibility of justice and of progressive change without force.
-- Boutros Boutros-Ghali


We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.
-- John F. Kennedy


Many folks like to quote Jefferson and his famous 'Tree of Liberty' observation. Well, that may be valid in the extremes of outcome. he made a couple others though..

My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government.
-Thomas Jefferson


and...


It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world.
-Thomas Jefferson


and...one with particular meaning today.


Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.
-Thomas Jefferson


Democracy is a participatory system and the Representative Republic which we adhere to in the United States, even more so than other forms.

How many people here could give, without reading up, a 5 minute effective summary of how the Caucus and Primary systems function in your local area? Those are the "grass roots" start of all that follows. That IS where your candidates are chosen. I saw when attending my local one for 2012...such dismal numbers as to leave no doubt in my mind why our system doesn't work.

We have to care, as a nation, before we can see the nation care about us.

After all, we FORM the nation and if we don't form the Government that runs it, it's by our own choosing or more to the point, the apathy leading to the complete lack of choosing either way.

When we've reached a point of clear majority participation, it's fair to declare failure. Until then, how could we even joke about people standing to fight in any real sense....when simply rising to vote is too much trouble despite only asking time from our busy schedules a single day every 2-4 years. Even then, only a small part of that one day.

I'll agree the system has failed when we've given it anything like a fair shot to work a first time. It's not even important what side someone's politics are. Participation by all is required and right now, we have meager participation by the most political. We get what we work for. Work has been lacking.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 04:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by ausername
Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.


No i'm fairly certain you fight fire with water and cut off the oxygen supply.

edit on 27-1-2013 by yourmaker because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 04:18 PM
link   
reply to post by yourmaker
 


Explanation: Get a clue ok!

Controlled Burn [wiki]


Controlled or prescribed burning, also known as hazard reduction burning or swailing is a technique sometimes used in forest management, farming, prairie restoration or greenhouse gas abatement. Fire is a natural part of both forest and grassland ecology and controlled fire can be a tool for foresters. Hazard reduction or controlled burning is conducted during the cooler months to reduce fuel buildup and decrease the likelihood of serious hotter fires. Controlled burning stimulates the germination of some desirable forest trees, thus renewing the forest. Some cones, such as sequoia and serotinous require heat from fire to open cones to disperse seeds.



Back burning:
Back burning is a way of reducing the amount of flammable material during a bushfire by starting small fires along a man made or natural firebreak in front of a main fire front. It is called back burning because the small fires are designed to 'burn back towards the main fire front'. The basic reason for back burning is so that there is little material that can burn when the main fire reaches the burnt area. The firebreaks that may be used to start a line of fires along could be a river, road or a bulldozed clearing etc.




Personal Disclosure: You were saying? Never mind .. I just denied any ignorance!


Edited to add ...




Do unto others as they have done unto you
But what in the hell is this world coming to?
Blow the universe into nothingness
Nuclear warfare shall lay us to rest

[chorus:]

Fight fire with fire
Ending is near
Fight fire with fire
Bursting with fear
We all shall die

Time is like a fuse, short and burning fast
Armageddon is here, like said in the past

[chorus:]

Soon to fill our lungs the hot winds of death
The gods are laughing, so take your last breath

[chorus:]



edit on 27-1-2013 by OmegaLogos because: Edited to add the Edit.



posted on Jan, 27 2013 @ 04:18 PM
link   
reply to post by OmegaLogos
 


you simply dont get it do you,

aaron has not died in vain,
he was not soft, he was passionate enough to risk jail to free knowledge,
he knew the real strength comes from information and knowledge passed on freely to anyone who wanted to learn.

that education BECOMES empowerment.
he was a peaceful man, a beautiful soul, who believed every one should have the use and value of publicly funded knowledge.

he is more righteous and more strong than those that resort to arms or violence.

it shouldn't take the death of a genius to remind us that higher knowledge and education IS the only answer to violence and hate.

and hate no matter how righteous it feels, dosnt educate anyone.

break the cycle, of hate
it is in the hearts and minds, of the masses that this victory will be found
it is the people that matter, not the instrument of hate, not in the method of retaliation

i say aaron is stronger than those who resort to hate and anger.

xploder





new topics

top topics



 
5
<<   2 >>

log in

join