Question for people that live in the USA

Originally posted by superman2012

Quite a few people that believe Iran is building towards a nuclear bomb are saying that they should not be doing so.

Quite a few people, in the US, responded in quite a few 2nd amendment threads where people from other countries, were telling them they should get rid of their guns.

I'm in the US and I believe Iran should be able to do what they want, I see how black ops attack your country in small ways, I see that it's #ed up. So I hope we see eye to eye.

I like how other countries say we have to keep our guns, sadly mine has been taken from me by local law enforcement for a crime I didn't do. If I get caught with a bullet or a shell on me I will get 5-99 years in prison. How do you like that?

Firearms =/= Nuclear weapons.

2nd.

Originally posted by PassiveObserver
Firearms =/= Nuclear weapons.

2nd.

Why can't they have a nuclear power plant? You won't allow them to have nuclear energy but everyone else can? But we got japan #ing up BIG TIME and it's cool.

reply to post by Mello


Islam. And how they are always saying they will wipe the Jews of the map, and the whole bit about their messiah the Mahdi not showing up until 1/2 the world is burning by their hands.

Among other things,

reply to post by superman2012


My observations on the contradictory nature of American culture is basically this, that we did not grow up in a culture, we grew up in a giant commercial. The majority of us are uninformed, overworked, poisoned both mentally and physically, and encouraged to practice the alienation of our peers, both as a means of acquiring power, and seeking revenge on the world for the alienation we have endured. We are immature and sold a lie, and that is all most of us know how to regurgitate.

reply to post by PassiveObserver


Iran should be respected as should the gun rights of individuals. The two the the exact same. To disregard one is to disregard the other. Nations are sovereign as are individuals. Both have a right to defense.

Apologies as I know what I am about to say has been said already..haven't read the thread yet.

And don't think I am pro-firearms or pro-nations telling other nations how to be...although the second bit I am in some sense.


A firearm will effect the lives within the border of the country...internal issue
A nuclear bomb will effect lives outside the borders of the country...international issue.

Personally I see no issue with other nations hammering us over our current stockpile of nukes..that threatens them (so long as they equally hammer other nuke holding nations equally and demand a drawdown globally and equally).

But hammering a nation on their gun policy is a bit like hammering a nation over their fast food policy...aka, its the nations issue, not a global issue.


With that said, I do appreciate outsider viewpoints about how we do things. If there is never any opinions stated from elsewhere, then how would we know where we are in the world..so I don't take offense to other nations giving our gun policy the stink eye in this day and age..even if I don't agree with it, its good to hear what the international audience has to say about our nation and how we treat its people.

Originally posted by crankySamurai
reply to post by PassiveObserver

 

Iran should be respected as should the gun rights of individuals. The two the the exact same. To disregard one is to disregard the other. Nations are sovereign as are individuals. Both have a right to defense.

A nuclear bomb is not a defense...it is a mass destruction weapon meant to obliterate offensively.

A missile shield is defensive...

Originally posted by superman2012
Serious question looking for serious answers. I know this will not dissuade some of you, but at least I tried.

Quite a few people that believe Iran is building towards a nuclear bomb are saying that they should not be doing so.

Quite a few people, in the US, responded in quite a few 2nd amendment threads where people from other countries, were telling them they should get rid of their guns.

So, my question is, why is it ok for some US citizens to tell people what to do in their country, but, if someone tells you what to do in your country, it is stupid and they should keep their nose out of your business?

Is this a case of, do as I say, not as I do? Also, why, in the face of this double standard, should we take anything you say from now on seriously?

Thanks in advance for keeping this civil.

Completely separate issues. If the Americans were telling Iranian citizens they could not be armed for protection then you would have a point...but i am going to guess you already knew that. Gosh.... at least i hope so.

Besides the average american citizen has no influence on what Iran does.

reply to post by superman2012


I should qualify my reply. I'm not ok with ANYONE having nukes. I hate nukes, nuclear power, and any other form of technology that has the capability to end all life on this planet. However, if we're gonna be the ignorant monkeys trying to harness the lightning I think everyone should have the same opportunity. Checks and balances and all. The only psychos to ever drop one was us, the United States. The more people have them the more checks and balances.

Double Post

Originally posted by superman2012
Serious question looking for serious answers. I know this will not dissuade some of you, but at least I tried.

Quite a few people that believe Iran is building towards a nuclear bomb are saying that they should not be doing so.

Quite a few people, in the US, responded in quite a few 2nd amendment threads where people from other countries, were telling them they should get rid of their guns.

So, my question is, why is it ok for some US citizens to tell people what to do in their country, but, if someone tells you what to do in your country, it is stupid and they should keep their nose out of your business?

Is this a case of, do as I say, not as I do? Also, why, in the face of this double standard, should we take anything you say from now on seriously?

Thanks in advance for keeping this civil.

When Americans start beheading Iranian tourists and posting ransom videos, then come and ask me about why there's a difference between one country and another.

Wow, the OP really wants to push those buttons. Comparing some school shootings, to a country like Iran being allowed to build nuclear weapons are on completely opposite ends of the spectrum if you ask me. One is a domestic problem regarding a countries constitution and the other is a possible world wide global nuclear threat.

To answer your question.....Go ahead and let Iran build nuclear weapons. The US will not interfere. But those same people better not ask or expect the USA to intervene when Iran starts bombing the hell out of all of their neighbors causing mass genocide in the name of Allah.

TL/DR all the replies, just putting in my take as an American.

I don't care if there is "intel" suggesting anything about Iran. I'm smart enough to know that the "intel" is about as good as the "intel" we had about Iraq. That intel is bull excrement. It is being shown to everyone as "proof" by those who have the most to gain by going to war with Iran... of course they have nothing to lose as it'll not be their economy or their children spent in that war.

As far as guns in America, I don't care what others think about private gun ownership. I'm smart enough to realize that arms in the hands of the general populace can lead to ne'er do wells ne'er doing well, but those same guns keep a tyrannical gov't at bay. It is better to know that a few might act up with the guns than be a slave to a gov't run by the few.

Derek

Originally posted by superman2012
Serious question looking for serious answers. I know this will not dissuade some of you, but at least I tried.

Quite a few people that believe Iran is building towards a nuclear bomb are saying that they should not be doing so.

Quite a few people, in the US, responded in quite a few 2nd amendment threads where people from other countries, were telling them they should get rid of their guns.

So, my question is, why is it ok for some US citizens to tell people what to do in their country, but, if someone tells you what to do in your country, it is stupid and they should keep their nose out of your business?

Is this a case of, do as I say, not as I do? Also, why, in the face of this double standard, should we take anything you say from now on seriously?

Thanks in advance for keeping this civil.

These are actually two very different issues. Gun ownership is a right in the United States for a very important reason. The reason is so that, if the government becomes corrupt, and a danger to freedom, that the people would have a way to take care of that issue. People would be able to defend themselves if the government was so far gone as to attack its own citizens. The Declaration of Independence even addresses this: "...But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security...".

No one is saying that the people of Iran should not be able to arm themselves in that fashion.

In the case of Iran, the issue is nuclear weapons. Nuclear weapons were developed in the United States during WWII, and used, only twice, when no other option seemed likely to end the conflict with Japan. Even after they were used, some Japanese didn't want to stop fighting. That use of those bombs was a very difficult decision, and one that was made only after long and careful consideration. Since that time, no country has been willing to use such weapons against another. Five nations signed a non-proliferation treaty, in an effort to discourage further development. More than one nation has created such weapons since that time, basically ignoring that law. In the case of Iran, you have a very unstable country, headed by people that hold a strong animosity towards most of the rest of the world. Such weapons, in the hands of such a nation, threaten the entire planet. This isn't a case of the United States telling another country what they can't do, but of the entire free world being involved in the effort to keep such weapons out of the hands of fanatics. When you have a nation that would destroy themselves, along with the rest of us, in the name of their cause, that nation should not have such weapons.

I would think that any reasonable person could see the difference between citizens arming themselves, and nations building nuclear weapons that could destroy other countries, especially if one such nation in question is hostile to freedom.

Originally posted by Enzo954
Wow, the OP really wants to push those buttons. Comparing some school shootings, to a country like Iran being allowed to build nuclear weapons are on completely opposite ends of the spectrum if you ask me. One is a domestic problem regarding a countries constitution and the other is a possible world wide global nuclear threat.

To answer your question.....Go ahead and let Iran build nuclear weapons. The US will not interfere. But those same people better not ask or expect the USA to intervene when Iran starts bombing the hell out of all of their neighbors causing mass genocide in the name of Allah.

Not even close. That isn't what I was asking but you took it to mean what you wanted it to mean. It's ok. I have clarified it about 7 or 8 times on this thread so far.

Originally posted by randomname
you're right. americans if any should applause the iranians for building a nuclear weapon, as they are exercising their right to bear arms.

it's that hypocrisy that the rest of the world sees that makes america look like its full of horse dung.

worse, it makes america appear insincere, not trust worthy, unfriendly and arrogant. and not respected.

these are not good qualities for any americans reading this.

as long as their is peace, trust and respect between countries and peoples, they can have 50,000 nukes and it won't matter, because they'll be collecting dust in a silo.

edit on 9-1-2013 by randomname because: (no reason given)

Maybe we should give EVERY country a nuclear weapon, lets even out the playing field... I don't see what could possibly go wrong with every country having a nuclear weapon, I'm sure everyone will play nice

When you're #1 in military you're allowed to dictate who can and can't do certain things... If someone wants to dethrone USA from that spot and dictate to the rest of the world what they can and can't do then fine... But until then, it seems that the US is running ####

People like to act like if their country had all the power in the world they would play nice with it and everyone would be living in some utopic-type world.

Originally posted by superman2012
Serious question looking for serious answers. I know this will not dissuade some of you, but at least I tried.

Quite a few people that believe Iran is building towards a nuclear bomb are saying that they should not be doing so.

Quite a few people, in the US, responded in quite a few 2nd amendment threads where people from other countries, were telling them they should get rid of their guns.

So, my question is, why is it ok for some US citizens to tell people what to do in their country, but, if someone tells you what to do in your country, it is stupid and they should keep their nose out of your business?

Is this a case of, do as I say, not as I do? Also, why, in the face of this double standard, should we take anything you say from now on seriously?

Thanks in advance for keeping this civil.

It's not. Let 'em build some nukes, they'll never use them anyway. There's a reason nobody's used one, other than testing, since 1945. As for "do as I say, not as I do", if you look, you'll notice that it's the American government telling other countries what to do. I've never had an opinion on the subject, neither have most of the other citizens. I've never posted in a thread about the UK (or any other country) telling them what they "should do". Most of us haven't. However, in every thread on US gun control you see lot's of people from other countries talking down to us because we're such "cowboys" or "barbarians" to want to continue to own guns. So, it appears to go either way. The US should totally keep it's nose out of the business of others. But, I find it odd that the same ones who will talk bad about us are the same ones expecting us to give them aid when they need it.

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

I would think that any reasonable person could see the difference between citizens arming themselves, and nations building nuclear weapons that could destroy other countries, especially if one such nation in question is hostile to freedom.

I think any reasonable person could read a thread and realize it was about American hypocrisy and not about comparing hand guns to nuclear weapons. Taking the analogy literally was not what was intended. Again, this was clarified many times in this thread.

reply to post by Malcher


Read the whole thread, or at least understand what I have been talking about before responding please.