Why don't you believe? (@Non-Believers and Skeptics), page 35


Pages: <<  32    33    34    35    36  >>
ATS Members have flagged this thread 27 times


reply posted on 1-12-2012 @ 06:47 PM by PhoenixOD
Originally posted by stanislav
Who said that aliens visiting planet earth is a wide spread belief? Also it doesn't make it true even if 50 percent or more believed aliens were real. We have 2 billion Muslims who believe in Allah, does it make it true? No.
reply to
post by PhoenixOD





Err i think you COMPLETELY misunderstood what i said. I never said "aliens visiting planet earth is a wide spread belief" , I said LESS than 50% believe visiting aliens are real.

Therefore the accepted / popular belief is that they are NOT visiting. So anyone who does think they are visiting is a skeptic as the definition of a skeptic is someone who "doubts the authenticity of accepted beliefs".

But like ArMaP said because they might not doubt the authenticity of accepted beliefs they might not be true skeptics.


edit on 1-12-2012 by PhoenixOD because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 1-12-2012 @ 07:04 PM by steve1709
Originally posted by stanislav
I doubt there was ever a scientific poll to find out how many people believe in aliens and how many do not. People who are skeptical of alien visitation are anybody who follows basic common sense. If you can't see it , measure it, record it, hear it , feel it then at this stage is not part of the overall reality. We suppose aliens might be visiting us but it lacks any evidence. Lets learn how to separate belief and factuality.

reply to
post by PhoenixOD





There's a top doco from through the wormhole. It's called did we invent god or did god invent us. If people try to get past the reference to "god" then there is a lot to learn about belief systems. Including the alien stuff. There were some amazing "experiments" being done on both kids and adults. It might even shake the belief systems of some people. Definitely worth tracking down and watching.


reply posted on 1-12-2012 @ 07:47 PM by steve1709
reply to post by stanislav



Preaching to the chior stan

That's why I mentioned the doco. They are trying to set up reproducable (sp?) expts to explain how the brain perceives stuff, even reality. Too much great info to put here or even for me to explain without me getting tongue tied. (unfortunately, my grey matter is on its last legs. Bl00dy age, I hate gettin old) They are trying to go past the philosophy, (which I see as a good thing to do) I wish I had have grabbed the names of those setting up the expts.


reply posted on 1-12-2012 @ 08:03 PM by stanislav
Wonderful! Thank you! I will go ahead and download it, watch it and will respond accordingly.

Originally posted by steve1709
reply to
post by stanislav



Preaching to the chior stan

That's why I mentioned the doco. They are trying to set up reproducable (sp?) expts to explain how the brain perceives stuff, even reality. Too much great info to put here or even for me to explain without me getting tongue tied. (unfortunately, my grey matter is on its last legs. Bl00dy age, I hate gettin old) They are trying to go past the philosophy, (which I see as a good thing to do) I wish I had have grabbed the names of those setting up the expts.



reply posted on 1-12-2012 @ 10:16 PM by stanislav
Your initial part of your post was well written until the last part. It appears almost like a contradictory to what you previously said. Please give me name of one authentic scientist who is so convinced of their own "beliefs" that they vehemently refuse to open their mind to see new possibilities. No educated person will allow themselves to look into something they believe will not yield provable outcome. On the contrary I can find you many religious people who refuse factual reality everyday of the week. I think going to church every week is just one example of the delusion we human being are still engaging in. And even if there was a separate creator to our universe, I personally highly doubt it would look kindly upon such malarkey displayed by "his" own creation.


Originally posted by gguyx
Beliefs..get in the way of learning.

During Galileo's time, the clergy refused to even LOOK through his telescope because of the belief they derived from scripture that the earth was the center of the solar system.

Beliefs will color and distort the ability to reason. Further, because beliefs are so emotionally charged owing to their ties to people's secure world-view, the result is a double-whammy on critical thinking.

Interestingly, some of the worst offenders are scientists themselves who ought to know better but are so married to pet theories (beliefs and emotions again) that they can't help themselves. Indeed, sometimes the old generation has to die off before new ideas can unfold.

To know and not act, is to not know.



reply posted on 2-12-2012 @ 11:19 AM by ArMaP
reply to post by PhoenixOD



Sorry, I don't understand what you mean by that, could you please rephrase it?
Thanks in advance.


reply posted on 2-12-2012 @ 11:44 AM by PhoenixOD
reply to post by ArMaP



I would say that people who require solid evidence before believing in the existence of visiting aliens have been wrongly labeled as Skeptics by the people who are trying to profit off the UFO scene though books ,lectures etc.

Labeling anyone who doesnt agree with them as a 'skeptic' serves two purposes.

1 - To try to discredit their views on the subject
2 - Suggest that the belief in visiting aliens is the 'accepted' belief in the world today. As a skeptic by definition is someone who disbelieves in the accepted beliefs on any subject.




edit on 2-12-2012 by PhoenixOD because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 2-12-2012 @ 12:00 PM by longlostbrother
Originally posted by PhoenixOD
reply to
post by ArMaP



I would say that people who require solid evidence before believing in the existence of visiting aliens have been wrongly labeled as Skeptics by the people who are trying to profit off the UFO scene though books ,lectures etc.

Labeling anyone who doesnt agree with them as a 'skeptic' serves two purposes.

1 - To try to discredit their views on the subject
2 - Suggest that the belief in visiting aliens is the 'accepted' belief in the world today. As a skeptic by definition is someone who disbelieves in the accepted beliefs on any subject.




edit on 2-12-2012 by PhoenixOD because: (no reason given)


No.

ATS is not mainstream.

A sceptic on ATS disbelieves the accepted conspiracy beliefs, but in fact it's pretty mainstream to not believe a lot of what's accepted as true on ATS.

But, really, sceptic is used as a more generic term e.g. "a person who mistrusts people, ideas, etc., in general"
www.thefreedictionary.com...

And it's in that sense that most people are using it here...

Calling someone a sceptic isn't REALLY an attempt to discredit people, when it comes to UFO and the mainstream media... more likely would be an attempt to discredit someone by claiming they DID believe in UFOs, as that's seen as less acceptible in the mainstream... at least among the serious...


reply posted on 2-12-2012 @ 12:11 PM by PhoenixOD
reply to post by longlostbrother



Yes like i said people who dont believe in visiting aliens are 'wrongly' labeled because it not the 'accepted' belief that we are being visited.

The definition on the link you provided is : "a person who habitually doubts the authenticity of accepted beliefs"

another : "a person who questions the validity or authenticity of something purporting to be factual. "

Its a word that is used wrongly just like when people talk about UFO's. A UFO is something that cant be identified but its implied that it means flying saucers. So when we hear about authorities looking into UFO's which could just mean they are trying to protect their airspace from foreign powers by investigating anything in the air they cant identify, people who make a living off books and lectures concerning an alien agenda turn it around and try to imply they are investigating flying saucers and visiting space ships. The misused of these words is largely down to people trying to promote their alien agenda for profit.


edit on 2-12-2012 by PhoenixOD because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 2-12-2012 @ 12:12 PM by ArMaP
reply to post by PhoenixOD



Thanks, I understand it now.

I think most believers use the word "sceptic" as if it mean "disbeliever", while, according to me, it means someone who doubts our understanding of things is as good as possible and thinks that we can always get closer to the truth, even if we never get to the whole truth, so we question everything.

When dealing with common things, what is questioned is the accepted view of something, but in topics like alien visitation, where there isn't a real accepted and official view, the only thing we can question is what the witnesses report, so we are seen as an "enemy of the cause" instead of being seen as someone external to any "cause" that just wants to get better knowledge.


reply posted on 2-12-2012 @ 12:21 PM by longlostbrother
Originally posted by PhoenixOD
reply to
post by longlostbrother



Yes like i said people who dont believe in visiting aliens are 'wrongly' labeled because it not the 'accepted' belief that we are being visited.

The definition on the link you provided is : "a person who habitually doubts the authenticity of accepted beliefs"

another : "a person who questions the validity or authenticity of something purporting to be factual. "

Its a word that is used wrongly just like when people talk about UFO's. A UFO is something that cant be identified but its implied that it means flying saucers. So when we hear about authorities looking into UFO's which could just mean they are trying to protect their airspace from foreign powers by investigating anything in the air they cant identify, people who make a living off books and lectures concerning an alien agenda turn it around and try to imply they are investigating flying saucers and visiting space ships. The misused of these words is largely down to people trying to promote their alien agenda for profit.


edit on 2-12-2012 by PhoenixOD because: (no reason given)


That's ONE of the definitions at that link.

Words can have more than one similar meaning... it gets hard discussing a word like sceptic on a place like ATS.

As for UFO.. the term, while it does literally stand for "unidentified flying object" was coined by a UFO-ologist and was meant to describe alien crafts from pretty much day one.

en.wikipedia.org...

Sceptics of the UFO alien connection have attempted to reclaim the term to it's more literal meaning, but... well... good luck to them...

I know what you mean re: sceptic, but it's only in the fringe that sceptic is a term of derision... and really caring what the fringe think is not gonna get you anywhere...
Pages: <<  32    33    34    35    36  >>    ^^TOP^^



UFO Filmed From Avebury Crop Circle, UK With Multiple Witnesses
  Posted 19 days ago with 89 member flags
The Men In Black(OPs) The Aviary & UFOs
  Posted 12 days ago with 83 member flags
Did a RAF Tornado crash during a UFO intercept mission in 1997?
  Posted 14 days ago with 39 member flags
What is this comming out of our star?
  Posted 9 days ago with 33 member flags
Huge Unknown Objects orbiting the Sun for months...?
  Posted 8 days ago with 29 member flags
The CIA and the UFO Mythos
  Posted 16 days ago with 26 member flags
UFO Reporting for the 21st Century!
  Posted 12 days ago with 26 member flags