If Jesus was born of a Virgin - then he should be she ~!

reply to post by windword


Acts 5:33 When they heard this, they were furious and plotted to kill them. 34 Then one in the council stood up, a Pharisee named Gamaliel, a teacher of the law held in respect by all the people, and commanded them to put the apostles outside for a little while. 35 And he said to them: “Men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what you intend to do regarding these men. 36 For some time ago Theudas rose up, claiming to be somebody. A number of men, about four hundred, joined him. He was slain, and all who obeyed him were scattered and came to nothing. 37 After this man, Judas of Galilee rose up in the days of the census, and drew away many people after him. He also perished, and all who obeyed him were dispersed. 38 And now I say to you, keep away from these men and let them alone; for if this plan or this work is of men, it will come to nothing; 39 but if it is of God, you cannot overthrow it—lest you even be found to fight against God.”

40 And they agreed with him, and when they had called for the apostles and beaten them, they commanded that they should not speak in the name of Jesus, and let them go. 41 So they departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer shame for His name. 42 And daily in the temple, and in every house, they did not cease teaching and preaching Jesus as the Christ.

reply to post by godlover25


42 And daily in the temple, and in every house, they did not cease teaching and preaching [THEIR PARTICULAR VERSION OF) Jesus as the Christ.

And then the Catholic Church changed everything.

reply to post by windword


council of Nicaea, I believe in Turkey ... is where the book was censored ... the whole story is forbidden ... and only the elite have copies of the original texts (is my current understanding). they decided "HE' was the "son"of God ... not the daughter of God.... hummm.... it seems to me someone mixed Egyptian and Christianity...
or maybe they are one of the same... but christians reject the links to Egyptian religeons.... ????

My honest feeling is that the whole "virgin birth" thing is a myth. Jesus was real, but him being born of a virgin, and being celibate his whole life, I just don't buy it.

Problem solved. He got his Y chromosome from his human (or some say, alien) daddy. He was as close to perfect as a human could get, but he was still human, and came into this world the way we all do...not from "sin", but from basic biology.

I think the virgin birth thing came about because they had that whole idea about inheriting the "sins of the father", and if Jesus was to be portrayted as without sin, he couldn't have a human father, now could he?

Perhaps it is also likely that, since Jesus referred to God as "the Father", they had to eliminate the human father, so as not to confuse people.

reply to post by FissionSurplus


I remember a story a few years back where a female virgin was going to be inpregnated without sex.... I need to follow up on that story... because she was going to be the first known since Mary to have a birth while being virgin.

reply to post by 1BornPatriot


You're not going to stop spewing your ill conceived and false notions are you?

Oh well, I tried.

Have fun trying to fight God

I dont blindly follow period.... I have questions for I am Human and the Gods are Gods... and one is a permanent fixture here called Satan and I am only human and can not tell the difference... so I took a bite out of the fruit of knowledge.... and the book is much more interesting with your eyes open.

Except for the Mystery element which involved God as in The Spirit of Peace and Love and Divine Creator of whom we are all infinite beings contained within, conducting this miracle. It is called a Miraculous Birth for a reason. OR ET.

reply to post by Unity_99


If what you say is true - then how do explain the world today... ??? I really dont think god gives a rats ass about that stuff.

Originally posted by 1BornPatriot
if I understand of how the sex is determined in humans.... that is .... So what ?
well, good question - I'm not sure .... I think the stories, beliefs and insights of Jesus are more Female than Male,
a male would have been killed long before challenging authorities Females were property in that time. so, Jesus .... was a She .... Hum, I dont know - but I thought it was a good point of debate on ATS... what say you... here is the facts I Found ... interesting thoughts - like if Jesus was a Female - how come we think of Jesus as a male... and if he was a Male how could he be born without a male chromosome... and how could a Male expect to live after chasing the bankers out of the temple .... a Female would be able to do that without challenge .... ???? I really dont know about this one.....

Chromosomes

old painting

edit on 12-11-2012 by 1BornPatriot because: (no reason given)

My opinion is that Jehovah was a dude, not a human dude but a dude... One who had footsteps, one who did physical things, one that didn't like being seen but could to an extent control the interpretation of what is being seen.

I do not believe that Jehovah should be confused with the term pantokrator or dunamis.. just as Pantokrator is associated with Christ in post biblical art in "The Church"

Jehovah walked around shooting fire or lazers and was divine in his knowledge and deeds beyond any other entity especially among his own creations so he was of highest rank but he was still a physical entity who did physical things and some of it seems a little barbaric but in that age I guess it appeared right to Jehovah because we know he was prone to anger. Jesus, while not as prone to anger in this form but then again the bible indicates he was made lesser than an elohim in that period, appears to identify with male and not as a female clone of mary like you are suggesting so this is why I believe he was a hybrid with Mary and what Jehovah was... an Elohim, during the biblical years prior to any further transfiguration. We are all hybrids in some way. This was Jehovahs attempt at a genetic truce of sorts because he wanted a connection with the creation on Earth... The way a master would work with his breeds.

So who says Jesus was missing chromosomes or was simply a Mary clone?

Even if he didn't HAVE to be physical, Jehovah could master more of the physical realm than anyone else so why so quick to assume he had no physical representation of any kind?

Like a ghost... sure, he is a ghost in part but he's a living God as we understand it.

We are also living beings but not as full of divine knowledge of pantokrator or dunamis which is the master of all reality... the entire universe, or MULTIverse... as Jehovah was. We should revere this because we need to learn from it but in those times man was nowhere near where he is now in science.... so all of this knowledge would have fallen on deaf ears of early biblical era man... so Jehovah had to rule, not as an equal but as a God and the desire is to bring all those who do not abuse knowledge of the universe into greater understanding of Divine knowledge. He made Jesus with scientific mastery, not with ghost DNA. Did he do it with his own body? I have no idea but the physical realm has a wide array of possibilities and is inseparable to energy.... so why does Jehovah get rumored to have no domain in the physical world?

He would not have loved the smell of burnt offerings of meat if he had no nose to smell it with. At least the people were good for some things since they couldn't be peers in understanding. He put them to work how he could for a reason and protected them from physical danger from a cloud in the sky but he can't have a chromosome?

reply to post by 1BornPatriot


I apologize,

If you're on a sincere quest for Truth, I have three websites I would like you to investigate, if even for a short while a piece...

FIrst up, Alice Linsleys blog on Biblical Anthropology, Just Genesis: jandyongenesis.blogspot.com...

Second, Dr. Hugh Ross, a brilliant astronomer and author who runs the Reasons to believe Ministries: www.reasons.org...

Last up: thedevineevidence.com...

There are other great resources as well,

Ravi Zacharias has some very tight philosophical arguments for Christianity, C.S. Lewis has a lot of good stuff, and the Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Churches have many good resources also (although I have some issues on Theological Doctrines differing from theirs, but they are still, IMO, Mainstream Christian brothers and sisters)

BioLogos and CARM came to mind also, although CARM I believe is Young Earth Creationist Creation Model, which I don't fully agree with, but they have valuable information and a dedicated staff

Originally posted by 1BornPatriot
reply to post by Unity_99

 

If what you say is true - then how do explain the world today... ??? I really dont think god gives a rats ass about that stuff.

Testing ground. We come in without memories to make our Love and Schooling count and show what we're made of. We need to deprogram and throw every seed of everything theyve put in us out. And stay in the heart and seek each day.

Most aren't strong enough to get rid of the bullies walking over them and I don't really tough love anyway, only Love Kindness Love is anything I ever believe in so I suggest people ask for help, since we can't become them to get rid of them and they're destroying this planet.

reply to post by 1BornPatriot


Believe me when I say that my faith has been strengthened by asking questions. If you don't questions, however are you supposed to learn? Unfortunately, it is hard to find answers. Knowing where to turn is very very hard. Everyone has there own opinion and I don't think that any two people have the exact same thoughts about "their" God.

Even the Bible can be a bit contradictory at times. Good for you for being brave enough to ask your question aloud and standing your ground during the debate.

May you find the answers you are seeking.

In my personal opinion, no woman in that time period would have been taken seriously. It would have been hard for the people to see a woman as their savior. Could you imagine at a time when women were sold to the highest bidder for one to stand up and say they are the spawn of God?

People would have been confused. How could they be led by a woman? It was a masculine world and men were the leaders and teachers. They bought and sold and ruled, women were there to make babies and keep house. (Yes, I am aware of strong women of the time, but Jesus came from peasant stock.) it would have been near to impossible for the people to have followed a woman, IMO.

From the Old Painting link

Shocking Archaeology Discovery: Jesus Was A Girl!
Ancient artifacts confirm that Jesus was female

Tuesday, April 1, 2008; 5:15 AM ET

as you are probably aware, I have been questing for a very long time...
these are a few conclusions I have reached....

1. What you and I are experiencing is a holographic experience - a very powerful software program like software nothing has any substance, everything is built from solidified light - like light / life has no substance, the way we can tell this is every thing vibrates at a sub micron level, particles disappear and reappear (we do not know where they go or come from - just like electricity that does not exist, neither do we. and the book describes this... everything is made of Atoms and Atoms are 99.9999999% nothing. but an Atom contains the greatest power yet discovered.
2. We appear to have been created to handle matter - something light beings can not do.
3. We are on a prison planet - for which there is no escape - not even a short trip to the moon. is allowed.

I believe if an all powerful being can just magically make a woman pregnant with a child said magical being could also alter said child's genetic structure to make it male.

Anyway this is a very silly topic funny to read all the true believers responses though.

reply to post by Pauligirl


OMG! It's all true.

www.nobeliefs.com...

JERUSALEM- A team of archaeologists discovered artifacts near the wall in Jerusalem's ancient City of David that not only shows evidence that Jesus actually existed, but that "he" was a female. The amazing discoveries make it, not only the earliest known evidence for Jesus, but reveals that Jesus was actually a girl.

Carbon dating puts the artifacts at around 30 A.D. which makes this the earliest known evidence for an historical Jesus.

In describing the painting, Ephraim Balzar, a professor emeritus at Tel Aviv University, depicted the mural as, "Jesus with flowers in her hair, wearing a pearl necklace and a beaded anklet (ankle bracelet). And note Christ wearing the red lipstick." Also in the painting, "you can see a vertical ichthys that had a special meaning in ancient religions."

The dirty little secret in Christian history is that Jesus has, many times, been shown as a woman. "This is no secret to the early Catholic priests," says Balzar. "In fact, Jesus as been reinterpreted as Mary, Christ's mother, to avoid the embarrassing consequences to Catholic congregations," said Balzar. "The virgin Mary is actually the virgin Jesus," claims Balzar..........................

reply to post by 1BornPatriot


Most people do not understand the Marriage process of ancient Hebrews.

A women was considered a virgin until she bore a Son to her husband, even if she had many daughters before the son.

A women who had lost her husband and remarried was also considerd a virgin until she bore a son to her new husband.

Hence the idea that Jesus' mother was a Virgin, even though she had at least two other children to her former husband... one daughter and one son.. who we know as Jesus' brother "James".

Please don't let Belief overpower Reality.

Originally posted by Tayesin
reply to post by 1BornPatriot

 

Most people do not understand the Marriage process of ancient Hebrews.

A women was considered a virgin until she bore a Son to her husband, even if she had many daughters before the son.

A women who had lost her husband and remarried was also considerd a virgin until she bore a son to her new husband.

Hence the idea that Jesus' mother was a Virgin, even though she had at least two other children to her former husband... one daughter and one son.. who we know as Jesus' brother "James".

Please don't let Belief overpower Reality.

way to try to be a pragmatist but we all know that is not the point the bible was trying to make.

it clearly states that mary would bear a child who was not fathered by a man but by Jehovah and if the whole point of the bible is to illustrate the differences between God and man then it's kind of silly to attempt to blur God and man into the same thing.... but seeing as how you are unbeliever obviously then there is no point in referencing Mary AT ALL.... OR THE BIBLE.

Why are you trying to explain a book in a pragmatic light that you don't even believe at all?

that makes NO sense.

No, I believe he made it clear he was the Son of God / Son of Man.

Matthew 17:5 - "This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him."