Scientists offer quantum theory of soul's existence

Scientists offer quantum theory of soul's existence

www.news.com.au

A PAIR of world-renowned quantum scientists say they can prove the existence of the soul.

American Dr Stuart Hameroff and British physicist Sir Roger Penrose developed a quantum theory of consciousness asserting that our souls are contained inside structures called microtubules which live within our brain cells.

Their idea stems from the notion of the brain as a biological computer, "with 100 billion neurons and their axonal firings and synaptic connections acting as information networks".

Dr Hameroff, Professor Emeritus at the Departments of Anesthesiology and Psychology and Director of the Centre of Consciousness Studies at the University of Arizona, and Sir Roger have been working on the theory since 1996.

They argue that our experience of consciousness is the result of quantum gravity effects inside these microtubules - a process they call orchestrated objective reduction (Orch-OR).

In a near-death experience the microtubules lose their quantum state, but the information within them is not destroyed. Or in layman's terms, the soul does not die but returns to the universe.

An interesting article, which unfortunately does not go very in-depth about their theory. I don't know too much about either scientist, but the theory seems to be rather intriguing. While this might not be clear-cut evidence that the soul exists, it is a fascinating development that might lead to a more detailed understanding about the nature of reality.

What are your thoughts?

This is extremely interesting news and probably the best explanation we have surrounding our SOUL.

I think they're spot on with their findings.

An interesting subject no doubt. I often wonder what happens during a NDE, it seems to me the blood stops flowing, but are you really dead, or dreaming/ hallucinating? Cool thread, looking forward to everyones thoughts.

reply to post by Just Chris


? no one can be spot on about something like that, its a plausible theory though.

it seems to me they just arranged words to make somthing sound complicated that really isnt. we all return to the elements that formed us, and in that, the energy of who we are, and the energy we create never cease to exist. thus never completing its journey.

Just to add,

A comment from a chap called "Ryan" on the article page:

"experience of consciousness is the result of quantum gravity effects inside these microtubules" I thought microtubules were found in all cells of the human body. The sperm cell is pretty much a head with a nucleus, and a long microtubule tail. Plant cells also have microtubules. Does the quantum theory of conciousness apply to these cells as well or only cells found in the brain? How about the brain of a mouse? It's an interesting hypothesis but this news article doesn't give much. Peer review study please~"

Ryan is right in my opinion. The Quantum theory must therefore apply to all kinds of life from mice to plants.

He mentions the sperm cell containing microtubules, and it makes sense if you've ever wondered how it would be possible for our children to have a SOUL of their own when in practice, it's been created by the parents.

Not sure if this is relevant to the discussion or not?

reply to post by DocHolidaze


Do you think that the energy released when you pass on has a memory? Or perhaps recycled in the universe for another purpose?

reply to post by Just Chris

Would that not suggest ALL living things (plant/ animal) have a soul?

Weres their paper. Guys of penrose's caliber dont make press releases. They publish.

If not, its just a kick up of an old story. I doubt they would be the first to know of any major breakthrus.

Edit: Yup, get this out of breaking news.
www.huffingtonpost.com...

reply to post by Dark Ghost


Theories of quantum consciousness have existed for a very long time. To say the quantum information can exist outside of the microtubules and then go back in if the person is revived... that is an extremely vague and materialistic interpretation of the process and entirely lacks any technical details pertaining to quantum mechanics.

My personal interpretation and explanation would describe the consciousness of a self-aware observer as a self-collapsing and thus self-supporting quantum system capable of maintaining a functioning quantum structure beyond the constraints of a material brain or body. Placing all the focus on the microtubules leads one to overlook the fundamental process.

reply to post by Im2keul


that is something i have not meditated on, but just thinking out loud i wanna say it seems like since the elements of our bodies now have been "alive"(and i use that term loosley) before, than we are all connected to our past. is it in the form of memories? that seem impossible to know, unless there was creator/programmer of elements and energy, than whomever that was would know.

reply to post by Dark Ghost


Some years ago a bloke named Evan Harris Walker wrote this book:
The Physics Of Consciousness: The Quantum Mind And The Meaning Of Life

For decades, neuroscientists, psychologists, and an army of brain researchers have been struggling, in vain, to explain the phenomenon of consciousness.

Now there is a clear trail to the answer, and it leads through the dense jungle of quantum physics, Zen, and subjective experience, and arrives at an unexpected destination. In this tour-de-force of scientific investigation, Evan Harris Walker shows how the operation of bizarre yet actual properties of elementary particles support a new and exciting theory of reality, based on the principles of quantum physics-a theory that answers questions such as "What is the nature of consciousness, of will?"
"What is the source of material reality?" and
"What is God?”

I think the more we learn about quantum behavior, the closer we will be to understanding just what the "soul" is, and yes, I believe it exists.

The book starts out with the author recalling a teen love who had since died. He's a physicist, and goes through the very heady calculus physics stuff first (it's slow going for a non-physicist to try to comprehend), but then it gets easier, and it makes sense.

I think what people have experienced as "connection" to the deceased, as well as spontaneous healing (whether following "prayer" or simple "mind over matter" effort, or still-unknown physical processes, or "energy work") are all probably explicable, but we just aren't there yet.

We have an idea of it, and as the human race matures, and further steps are taken (tiny baby steps, one generation at a time), eventually we'll know. And that will be the new paradigm for "What is God?" In my opinion for now, God is that: the connectedness of invisible particles that transcends what we currently know about physics; what seems miraculous and "surpasses understanding". But we're getting closer. And the drive to know seems to be universal.

One day it will all come together in a spectacular "Ah HA!" moment, and the world will have to deal with it. I doubt in my lifetime, but I'm glad people are dedicating themselves to the questions and possibilities.

Excellent find! S/F

Eben Alexander,MD-was on C2C last night and he basically had this same Idea about what happens at near death and death.

He said, 'the quantum mechcanics" of the soul is that your soul exist outside the body and you travel to another existance that is real as chit. He wrote this book www.lifebeyonddeath.net...

I'm not sure of the theory, well the micrbotubules may contain neurons but that does not mean the "soul", i'm pretty sure brain is a big component for the "soul"... i would say the human electricity or the Biomagnetism would be more "soul" than the microtubules.

________

Just so you know how the whole process works before people start to take things in different interpretation and going against the theory.

This theory was offered by 2 scientists, does not mean it actually 100% true YET, this needs to "tested" repeatedly by main scientists until its approved.

I find it interesting that this should come out now since I just wrote a short piece on the same subject for my own web site about a week ago and put it up on my site on 10/24/2012.

Link to the full article

I recently came across an article on the psychic connection that has been shown to exist between identical twins. The article was in Issue#11 of Edge Science and was titled “The Twin Thing”. Here are two relevant excerpts from the article along with their research source notes. (the two excerpts are at the link to the full article)

Since the connection has been proven this started me thinking about how such a weak electrical signal as a brain wave could possibly have any influence beyond a few feet, never mind across a continent. The only thing that I could think of was the phenomenon known as quantum entanglement. Albert Einstein described it as “spooky action at a distance”. Quantum entanglement is a connection between two subatomic particles such as photons, which were created from the same event, which allows one of the particles to react to a state change in the other instantaneously over any distance. This seems to violate the universal speed limit of the speed of light.

reply to post by Dark Ghost


This is something I'm going to keep an eye on because I'm quite excited by such things...I'm that sad.

S&F for bringing this to our attention.

Rev

Its nice to have scientists working on this theory like this and giving it weight for a change.

In their desperate search for a physical (and therefore scientifically acceptable) theory of non-physical consciousness, scientists such as these two expose the intellectual sterility of modern scientific understanding of reality. It has NO broad, theoretical framework that can account for the presence, amongst all the floating bits and pieces of the universe, of self-organized, carbon-based units of consciousness called "human beings." If it did, it would cease to be called "science." What pathetic attempts are these that pull the intellectual wool over everyone's eyes by regarding the essential you as just indestructible bits of information bound by the laws of quantum mechanics. But don't we just love these maverick strayings over the wall that science has built around humanity to enclose what it calls reality? Sometimes, when the academic credentials of the theorist are impressive enough, we even take them seriously. Well, at least privately, but, of course, not shared with anyone in the college Fellows Common Room! Not until we own an FRS or Nobel Prize or two - or at least a tenured professorship. THEN, we can speculate to our hearts' delight without censorship from our peers, although still only within limits. I mean - we still cannot mix science with religion.

Which seems to beg the question as a scientific explanation of the soul....

reply to post by luciddream


I can agree with that.

I find it hard to understand the NDE, I tend to believe that it is more of a hallucination due to the amount of time it takes for the brain to truly die.

wiki.answers.com...

reply to post by Just Chris


Ryan's comment negates nothing; all life: plant, mineral, organism, has a soul. Rosicrucian and relative texts confirmed this over 100 years ago.