An international group of prominent scientists has signed The Cambridge Declaration on Consciousness in which they are proclaiming their support for the idea that animals are conscious and aware to the degree that humans are -- a list of animals that includes all mammals, birds, and even the octopus.

Is this some sort of greenie, vegetarian initiative?

One of my friends used to work in a abattoir. He told me that sheep had no concept of death - they would stand there undisturbed as other sheep were killed around them.

It would appear that all animals are not as conscious and aware to the degree that humans are but is someone trying to make political capital out of the claim that they are?

Should it change the way we treat animals, such as animals raised and slaughtered for food?

Like how?

I guess if they ever figure out how to communicate with chickens and cows we could tell them we're sorry and thank them for their sacrifice, their yummy, yummy sacrifice.

ETA: Forgot to add Fish.

Originally posted by tvtexan

Should it change the way we treat animals, such as animals raised and slaughtered for food?

Like how?

I guess if they ever figure out how to communicate with chickens and cows we could tell them we're sorry and thank them for their sacrifice, thier yummy, yummy sacrifice.

Well, I was thinking perhaps more humane treatment.....

I imagine that being conscious simply means being aware of your existance. Are we debating that animal are going through the motions?

Even though this has appeared obvious to me since I was little, I hope that such an announcement causes at least a few people to think of animals in a more empathetic way, and maybe change people from being meat-eaters on moral grounds

Animals are more pure, just as sentient, and very much deserving of respect. More so than lots of humans.

I've known this since I was aware of my first thoughts, and it disturbs me greatly that people don't think animals have feelings or awareness.

Granted, some of them (sheep, maybe, fish maybe) are more limited in their intelligence, but this doesn't give us the right to cruelty....
when it comes to cats, dogs, equines, elephants, dolphins, whales, birds, however....yes, they are absolutely aware and have feeling. I echo the member above who stated that it's obvious they are every bit as lucid as we are.

BTW, smylee, I love your avatar.

Animals are conscious? Wow, stunning! It sounds like a revelation if your only exposure to animals was coloring books and animal crackers.

I interpreted what they said as animals experience and process things in very similar ways to us, at the very least, not that every animal thinks on a similar level to humans. Keep in mind that a very large proportion of what humans eat goes towards powering your noggin, a larger proportion than most other animals. Most other species don't have the energy budget or a good reason to develop bigger brains.

I believe that many animals are smarter than we give them credit for (although some are smarter than others; a dolphin is much smarter than a sheep) and that everyone should respect and care for animals. I think that this very is not incompatible with hunting and agriculture of animals, so long as those animals are treated with respect and care. I despise factory farms and industrial scale hunting.

I draw the line at what animals we can eat at dolphins, whales, and elephants. We have analyzed their vocalizations for patterns and it certainly seems language is present (In dolphins and elephants at least, I can't remember if they discovered language in whales. I wouldn't be surprised). If these are not truly sapient beings they come close enough for me. I can't wait until we develop the techniques to converse with these creatures.

They are attacking our ability to have cheap and abundant food.
Only the elite will get to eat the exotic roast beef or cuisine chicken McNugget of the future. The rest of the peasants will grovel for corn meal that hasn't been turned into fuel.

Common sense prevails. However, I would not trust or respect "scientists" who took so long to realise something fundemental like this. I bet funding was involved.

Humans are not special.

Interesting thread, Smylee. I always feel bad when I buy meat at the store, knowing that the animal (whether chicken, turkey, pork, or beef) was slaughtered in an inhumane way.

My thoughts on this subject are confused. I know that Native Americans, upon killing in a hunt, would thank the animal for the gift of its meat and fur. They recognized the sacrifice of the animal to give them food.

We have no opportunity to do this, of course, since when we get the meat, it's been dead for days, shipped from someplace else. Does this mean I'll give up eating meat? No, I'll still eat it...but I never feel 100% good about it. I wonder if the terror and fear the animal felt a few minutes before it's slaughter somehow lingers.

Yet, I don't think farm animals fear death as we do, once they know it's coming and there is no escape. For example, I used to live next to a cow pasture, and one day I saw buzzards circling, so I went to check it out. A cow was trying to birth a calf. The calf was dead, I could see the cord wrapped around it's neck. The cow couldn't push it out all the way, and so she was lying there waiting to die as she was bleeding to death. I did not assist with this, as agricultural laws are tricky, and if the owner found out I had done something and the cow was dead, I could be charged the price of the cow.

Anyway, I felt so bad, and I looked into the cow's eyes, thinking I would see fear and pleading in them. Instead, there was an odd calm, as if she accepted her fate and was waiting patiently for the inevitable. She seemed to look past me.

Yet, a few months ago, I had a cat that was in kidney failure, and he was suffering, so I took him to be euthanized. While in serious pain, he still looked at me with a pleading in his eyes. I asked that they give him a sedative before the actual euthanasia, and when the sedative took hold and he wasn't in so much pain, his eyes seemed to say, "I'm gettin' the hell outta here" and I had to keep him from escaping, as weak as he was. He cried and clung to me as the vet tech tried to take him away for the death shot.

Not sure where I'm going with these stories, except that I suspect they feel much as people do. If we are connected by love to others, we don't want to die and leave this life. When there's nothing holding us, we pass out of this life so much easier.

There is no way to know if the meat we eat was once an animal that had earthly attachments and feelings of fear and longing. If I knew the animals were treated humanely and with consideration for their feelings, I would probably feel less guilty.

As soon as some brave soul convinces a 'conscious' Bengal Tiger that killing and eating other animals is cruel and mean, I'll stop too.

Then they can go to work on sharks, lions, hyenas, bears, hawks, owls..... Hell, even anteaters need to get with the program.

For my part, I was already sure of this.
And yet- I eat meat, I work with horses, dogs, cattle.... I participate in the slaughter of cattle, pigs, rabbits and chickens.
I experience communication with animals that is commonly termed "psychic", and feel very close and loving with the animals I interact with.

Some people find this contradictory and confusing.

To me, it is not. What I experience, and what I pick up from animals, is that one doesn't fear death of the biological container if a connection to the source is kept intact. If one does not shove into subconsciousness their being as part of a collective consciousness.

Repulsive reactions to pain-causing experience is automatic in the body and for good reasons- the survival (and procreation) instinct helps us keep up the production and evolution of biolgical containers for us to use. But we also have the possibility of comprehending that we do not ever cease existing- we simply re-integrate our larger whole.

I advocate methods of treating and slaughtering animals which are compassionate and respectful.
Even I would agree to let myself be killed to feed others, if it could be done in a way which spares me suffering.
I suspect people mix up in mind pain and death, and their repulsion to pain is interpretted as a repulsion to death itself.
Animals do not do that.