Gay Marriage. I am honestly confused

reply to post by kaylaluv


We both earlier agreed everyone should be given equal rights under the law... period. No one group should be treated differently than another.... and we both agreed government really shouldnt be in our business that is private.... someday we will work toward that....

until then, no one is saying you cant have what you want, we just all need to make sure that what is happening in Europe where religious people are either forced to marry people they dont believe are allowed to marry, or shut down, and loose their place where they can gather to worship...

that here, is infringing upon their right to freedom of religion, because you are dictating to them how to practice their faith, and what their faith should believe.

No one is going to let that happen here. Our right to religious freedom, and for marriage to be a part of that, cannever be infringed upon.... its a constitutional right....


but you have the right to your rights, period.... people are just worried about loosing theirs when people try to redefine what marriage is according to our religions a bit too much.

I keep saying it but no one is listening, its all a corporation, they have created statutes not laws to be forced upon us. Merriage is just a way to sign a contract so that the profit that the new corporation makes can be tracked and so forth, automatically selling away your property the moment of, and that includes the children to be.

No matter what religion you have, its no one's buisness if two man or women wanna get merried, and by the way, Merriege is just a word, it was inveted before anyone of us was here, so why hold on to something that has nothing to do with us?

and again, im asking this just one more time, why are we following and arguing about things that have nothing to do with humans, or people if u like it that way, things that operate at a corporate level?

There is no LAW that says anything against gays or any two people getting merried, there is not even a statute for it.

Now no one is asking you to give up you religion, i dont know why you keep saying that, but remember, its not a religion its a corporation, a company, that belongs to other companies. there is no god or jesus, just products and a whole lot of bs to be sold.

reply to post by OpinionatedB
It's not enough that advocates wish to have their unions considered a marriage.

They are also requiring you to like and endorse it as well.

Personally, they can do whatever they want. Freedom, you know? But I am also free to feel as I please.

THAT'S what they want to control.

I guess your topic title and the original post is a bit confusing as well.
Just to clarify you do not care about homosexual marriage so long as it never infringes upon your rights.
So how is gay marriage infringing your rights nowadays ?

Let me put it this way. My marriage is part of my religion as well and in my religion marriage is a symbolical thing.
In my religion you do it and basicly forget about the whole thing a few months later. Im not making an obligation to god or whatever deity you choose to believe in.

According to you i must have freedom of religion. And in my religion its perfectly acceptable to get married in a church without actually believing anything that is written in the bible.
I don't get what you're confused about.

"God was the one who said (according to religions) what marriage is, and what marriage is not..."

In my religion it was the Red Turtle ( the creator of planet earth ) who said that marriage is purely symbolical.

Just to be clear i don't actually believe in red turtle, im just making a point. Which i hope makes sense

EDIT: Oh, I guess you're making the same point.

reply to post by beezzer


You know thats whats scarey to me too.... the fact they want to control my very thoughts and beliefs... and decide those have to change too...

That makes me want to fight it .... it makes me want to say well if my freedoms will be denied then ill be damned if your going to have any if it is in my power....

lol... which is crazy, because no one should be the one with the power.... there is supposed to be equality... I rather agree with that.... and I am ok with that...

I am just not ok with my religion being dictated to me by someone who cant even read the Holy Books!

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by OpinionatedB

 

It's not enough that advocates wish to have their unions considered a marriage.

They are also requiring you to like and endorse it as well.

Personally, they can do whatever they want. Freedom, you know? But I am also free to feel as I please.

THAT'S what they want to control.

Wait, who's trying to control how you feel? Now I'm confused.

reply to post by kaylaluv


www.abovetopsecret.com...

Its comments like this and others where they start saying that we are not entitled to our own beliefs and want to control our very thinking... this is not the only such comment in this thread...

reply to post by beezzer

They are also requiring you to like and endorse it as well.

I have a sense that OpiniontedB is really struggling with this - as are a lot of people

it's not about forcing you to like them or accept them - it's about everyone being treated equally under the law

something you should understand - it's kinda a no-brainer

and I'm guessing you really do understand it

shame you can't just be honest

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
reply to post by kaylaluv

 

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Its comments like this and others where they start saying that we are not entitled to our own beliefs and want to control our very thinking... this is not the only such comment in this thread...

You mean the reference to separate but equal? The blacks used to have separate but equal - it didn't work. This is not regarding personal feelings - this is regarding how the state treats its citizens. Gays want the exact same benefits from the state that everyone else gets - a marriage license. Not talking about personal feelings, not talking about what the church provides. What the STATE provides must be equal. You agree with this, so what's the problem?

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by OpinionatedB

 

It's not enough that advocates wish to have their unions considered a marriage.

They are also requiring you to like and endorse it as well.

Personally, they can do whatever they want. Freedom, you know? But I am also free to feel as I please.

THAT'S what they want to control.

Wait, who's trying to control how you feel? Now I'm confused.

It's not enough that for me to say, "Fine, call it a marriage, who cares!".

I have to somehow aquiesse and agree with their provisions as to why it is okay (in the mind of the advocates).

reply to post by Spotless


Everyone of us, in this thread, in this world, has a different view of what marriage is. We must then look at marriage as something that everyones beliefs needs to be protected yes? From someone like me, whose religion micro manages at times...

to someone who believes marriage is just a cute little thing, to another who says cool... tax breaks,.,,, we all have different interpretations of what the institution is.... so any rewording of what marriage is, really should be making sure all bases are covered in that wording, so that all people are protected, in their rights to their freedoms.


This is what should be established, and it wont be established by fighting, only by talking.

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis
reply to post by beezzer

 

They are also requiring you to like and endorse it as well.

I have a sense that OpiniontedB is really struggling with this - as are a lot of people

it's not about forcing you to like them or accept them - it's about everyone being treated equally under the law

something you should understand - it's kinda a no-brainer

and I'm guessing you really do understand it

shame you can't just be honest

But I am!

I
Don't
Care

But that isn't good enough. I have to accept the new "norm" now. Which I do fight.

It's like abortion.

I hate it. I am against it. It is legal though. So it'd be like abortion advocates getting upset because I don't advocate abortion because it is legal.

Get it?

reply to post by kaylaluv


And I agree with you...

But you understand right? I am sure you have been there yes? someone telling you what to believe, someone telling you you have no choice but to accept their version of right and wrong?

Its not a likeable thing, for anyone.... so when people say things like we have to believe what someone else does.... you understand the feeling

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by OpinionatedB

 

It's not enough that advocates wish to have their unions considered a marriage.

They are also requiring you to like and endorse it as well.

Personally, they can do whatever they want. Freedom, you know? But I am also free to feel as I please.

THAT'S what they want to control.

Wait, who's trying to control how you feel? Now I'm confused.

It's not enough that for me to say, "Fine, call it a marriage, who cares!".

I have to somehow aquiesse and agree with their provisions as to why it is okay (in the mind of the advocates).

Well, I'm an "advocate", and I don't care why you are okay with gay marriage.

I have never heard a gay person demand that people love them and cheer for them while walking down the street. Just don't be cruel, and give them the same legal benefits from the state.

reply to post by beezzer

But that isn't good enough. I have to accept the new "norm" now. Which I do fight.

who is telling you you have to like it?

that's my point - you're not being honest

you know what's what - but you're willing to perpetuate this idea that people are somehow forcing you to like something you don't want to like

in case you're confused beezzer - you're free to dislike all the things you've always disliked

you don't even need anyone's permission

see?

:-)

reply to post by XaniMatriX


I really like your post. Not that I agree with everything, but you make some good points.

You may be right about the government's purpose in "tracking" marriage. But many "common people", like myself, don't really care at this point. They want to track my "corporation's" profit, let them. In this day and age, unless I was raised by wolves, they already know more about me than I'm comfortable with... Even if I were single, they'd know me and my "profit".

So, twenty years ago, when I got married, I did it for MY reasons, without concern for the government's reasons. I admit, though, I have had thoughts of getting divorced, just because I don't like the idea of having the government's "sanction" to cohabit with the person I love. But marriage works for us and so, for now, I will do nothing about it.

Originally posted by XaniMatriX
and again, im asking this just one more time, why are we following and arguing about things that have nothing to do with humans, or people if u like it that way, things that operate at a corporate level?

Because, marriage my be a "corporation" to some, but it means something TOTALLY different to me. I don't care WHAT people think of my marriage. My own definition of my relationship is unique and is not marred by any other thoughts or purposes of the government nor is it "changed" by the fact that other people also get married. I think people who want to control other people's relationships are weak and insecure. This relationship is MINE, and even without the paper or government sanction, I'd consider us "married" because of the bond we share. No one else's relationship can TOUCH mine.

There is no LAW that says anything against gays or any two people getting merried, there is not even a statute for it.

Sure there is. The blue states below have specific laws against gay marriage:



Source

Now no one is asking you to give up you religion, i dont know why you keep saying that...

This is the excuse many religious people use to continue to oppress gay people. Some sort of illusive "rights lost" by religious people if gays are allowed to marry. It's ludicrous! State marriage has absolutely NOTHING to do with religion. But what else are they gonna say? They have no logical reason to oppose gay marriage, so they make up these weird scenarios in which they are somehow possibly harmed by gay people having the same piece of paper that they have... There is no logic to be found here.

Must See Proposition 8 Video

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


read some of the posts dear... some of them really do want to control our thoughts...



but the rest I am fine with...

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
reply to post by kaylaluv

 

And I agree with you...

But you understand right? I am sure you have been there yes? someone telling you what to believe, someone telling you you have no choice but to accept their version of right and wrong?

Its not a likeable thing, for anyone.... so when people say things like we have to believe what someone else does.... you understand the feeling

Sure, I get it from some fundamentalist religious nuts. But not all religious people do this. And not all gay rights advocates do this, right? Different personalities - don't lump everyone in one group. Most gays just want the rights they have coming to them - that's all.

Originally posted by OpinionatedB
reply to post by Spiramirabilis

 

read some of the posts dear... some of them really do want to control our thoughts...

but the rest I am fine with...

well - sweetheart... :-)

maybe you're not reading as thoroughly as you think you are

if you can't understand - that's one thing

if you don't want to understand - that's another - and that's on you

toodles...

:-)

reply to post by kaylaluv


I know

and I know

By the way, I really do not hate anyone.... thats never been who I am.... I have just always wanted to practice my faith openly and in peace....

what kind of person would I be if I did not think everyone deserved the same?

nice taking with you by the way....