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Prayer out loud in Church

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posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 04:53 PM
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Can anyone point out the scripture where it says it's ok to stand up and pray out loud?

In Matthew 6:6, Jesus says to pray in secret. And the closet i think he's refering to is the prayer shawl if I'm not mistaken.




posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 04:59 PM
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He sure does say that.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 05:01 PM
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I'd like to know the same. So many people are trained to act and follow in the traditions of men, and there is nothing biblical about them.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 05:03 PM
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Whats wrong with praying out loud in church? What jesus was against was the pharisees making a big huge deal in public of their prayers....acting like they were more holy than everyone when they were just full of crap...



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 05:19 PM
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If you believe there should be no spoken prayer in church, what do you believe church should be like? It's pretty clear that Jesus gave few instructions on how it should be conducted. He was a big fan of "The Lord's Prayer," and "Communion" (or whatever it's called), but he really left church services up to Peter and the apostles with the words "Feed My Sheep."

May I ask you to look at a few of the prior verses in Matthew?

1 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.

2 Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

3 But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth:

4 That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

It seems Jesus isn't condemning prayer or acts done in public (or in church), He's condemning the practice of doing it to gain the praise of men.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 05:22 PM
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reply to post by mojo2012
 


I think most of the book of Matthew was Jesus sharing a way to pray. The lords prayer for example is really instruction on how to pray.
First praise God,
Then ask for what you need.
Ask for forgiveness for your sins.
Ask for the strength to resist sinning in the first place.
Be greatful.
But people say the instructions as the prayer.
Our Father who art in Heaven. etc.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 05:31 PM
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Originally posted by mojo2012
Can anyone point out the scripture where it says it's ok to stand up and pray out loud?

In Matthew 6:6, Jesus says to pray in secret. And the closet i think he's refering to is the prayer shawl if I'm not mistaken.



There are numerous places in the Scriptures where Jesus and the Disciples prayed outloud in public. The Matthew 6:6 prohibition is being taken out of context. It was a warning against praying in a way that draws the praises of men. You shouldn't be praying to seek attention from people and get them to think you are righteous. It's a sin.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 05:39 PM
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reply to post by mojo2012
 


First off, the whole context is the Beattitudes.

Second off, the immediate context is:

Matthew 6:5- 15
5 "When you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they may be seen by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. 6 "But you, when you pray, go into your inner room, close your door and pray to your Father who is in secret, and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you. 7 "And when you are praying, do not use meaningless repetition as the Gentiles do, for they suppose that they will be heard for their many words. 8 "So do not be like them; for your Father knows what you need before you ask Him. 9 "Pray, then, in this way: `Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. 10 `Your kingdom come. Your will be done, On earth as it is in heaven. 11 `Give us this day our daily bread. 12 `And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. 13 `And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from evil. [For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.]' 14 "For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 "But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.


So here's the breakdown:

1. Don't pray like a hypocrite. They pray in public for the purpose of being seen as righteous. That's all they'll ever get out of it, too.
2. So go pray in private, making sure your prayers are for the right reason. Note: it does not say you cannot pray in public. The direct command is don't be an actor in your prayer life.
3. Don't pray repetitious nothings. They mean nothing, and they have no power, therefore in vain.
4. God knows what you need.
5. So here's my public prayer to show you how it should be done: with further explanations about simplicity and humility.

Seriously, Christ never said Don't pray in public, and even WITHIN CONTEXT prayed a public prayer, right then. This is why people really need to reassess what they think they know about that book, quite often.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 06:02 PM
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I mentioned Matthew 6:6 in a post yesterday.

I find when i meditate that i truly go in a deeper state of meditation when i am alone. I feel more comfortable and relaxed, and that is my time with my Creator, and my family respects that.

I have been to churches where people will jump up and start talking out loud, and even though i don't agree with that, to each his own, If people find spiritual satisfaction in that way, i am not one to judge. Even if it is off-putting to me.

I prefer my room where i can have my own time, and take my time to find calmness and spiritual freedom that brings tears to my soul. Some days it takes longer than others. I have no time limit, it is my room


I am not a man of any church, nor any religion. I am a child of The Creator, and i will follow Him without the help of man.

In meditation I don't talk out loud/scream, but i do speak certain sentences out strong enough so that those whom oppress can hear me (i believe they cannot read my mind), So, when asking The Creator not to lead us into temptation, i will say in the Name of Yeshua, and by the authority of He Who is I Am. Those whom oppress us must leave, so i say it just loud enough so that i can hear, and that i know they heard me. Sounds dumb, but to me it works.

edit on 09/02/2012 by KaelemJames because: spelling



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 06:22 PM
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reply to post by KaelemJames
 


I agree, Kaelem, I prefer praying privately also. I feel so in tune with the Most High when I do it in "secret."



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by mojo2012
Can anyone point out the scripture where it says it's ok to stand up and pray out loud?

In Matthew 6:6, Jesus says to pray in secret. And the closet i think he's refering to is the prayer shawl if I'm not mistaken.



Can you show the verse where a person praying for others or group prayer is prohibited? Jesus is merely telling the discipmes how they should pray, it's not an exhaustive teaching on prayer.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 11:04 PM
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reply to post by charles1952
 


When the church was born at Pentecost they were in the upper room praying in one accord. It's a non issue really. Legalism, still alive and kicking all these years.



posted on Jun, 13 2012 @ 11:22 PM
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Originally posted by phroziac
Whats wrong with praying out loud in church? What jesus was against was the pharisees making a big huge deal in public of their prayers....acting like they were more holy than everyone when they were just full of crap...

Because you are directing it to something out there, instead on in here. To pray out loud is to stroke the ego, and to impress peers only.
I know well my inner God and Goddess, don't you, friend?



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 12:42 AM
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But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeith in secret shall reward thee openly.

I have been told that the closet is the prayer shawl. Jews would put it over their head to pray.

He's saying to pretty much pray where people can't hear you since the prayer is only to the Father.

If you can give exact scripture where they used prayer aloud feel free to post the exact verse.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 12:43 AM
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reply to post by shaluach
 


Post the verse(s)



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 12:45 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by mojo2012
Can anyone point out the scripture where it says it's ok to stand up and pray out loud?

In Matthew 6:6, Jesus says to pray in secret. And the closet i think he's refering to is the prayer shawl if I'm not mistaken.



Can you show the verse where a person praying for others or group prayer is prohibited? Jesus is merely telling the discipmes how they should pray, it's not an exhaustive teaching on prayer.


I never said praying for others is prohibited.

Give me a verse after Matthew 6:6 where they prayed other than the way they were told.



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 12:52 AM
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Originally posted by CynicalDrivel
reply to post by mojo2012
 


First off, the whole context is the Beattitudes.

Second off, the immediate context is:

Matthew 6:5- 15
5 "When you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they may be seen by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. 6 "But you, when you pray, go into your inner room, close your door and pray to your Father who is in secret, and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you. 7 "And when you are praying, do not use meaningless repetition as the Gentiles do, for they suppose that they will be heard for their many words. 8 "So do not be like them; for your Father knows what you need before you ask Him. 9 "Pray, then, in this way: `Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. 10 `Your kingdom come. Your will be done, On earth as it is in heaven. 11 `Give us this day our daily bread. 12 `And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. 13 `And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from evil. [For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.]' 14 "For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 "But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.


So here's the breakdown:

1. Don't pray like a hypocrite. They pray in public for the purpose of being seen as righteous. That's all they'll ever get out of it, too.
2. So go pray in private, making sure your prayers are for the right reason. Note: it does not say you cannot pray in public. The direct command is don't be an actor in your prayer life.
3. Don't pray repetitious nothings. They mean nothing, and they have no power, therefore in vain.
4. God knows what you need.
5. So here's my public prayer to show you how it should be done: with further explanations about simplicity and humility.

Seriously, Christ never said Don't pray in public, and even WITHIN CONTEXT prayed a public prayer, right then. This is why people really need to reassess what they think they know about that book, quite often.


Cite verse(s) after Matthew 6:6 where they prayed aloud.

My argument is prayer aloud not where and when.

The prayer is suppose to be for the Father not announced so others can hear. That is what i get from the passage.

Like at my church the pastor usually stands up front and prays to the congregation out loud like an announcement prayer and this is what I'm ultimately questioning.


edit on 14-6-2012 by mojo2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 01:30 AM
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I think I have confused some of you that have posted.

By out loud I meant projecting your voice. Of course you are suppose to say your prayer with your voice but prayer is meant for the Father so you say it in a low voice.

The reason i made this thread is because some pastors pray out loud(projecting their voice) and I believe prayer shouldn't be done this way based on Matthew 6:6.
edit on 14-6-2012 by mojo2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 01:52 AM
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I did some searching and i suppose i was mislead about the prayer shawl thing being the closet.

So, feel free to also cite scripture where Jesus prayed with others.... aka prayed when he wasn't alone.

Matthew 14:23

And when he had sent the multitudes away, he went up into a mountain apart to pray: and when the evening was come, he was there alone.


edit on 14-6-2012 by mojo2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 14 2012 @ 02:01 AM
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Originally posted by charles1952
If you believe there should be no spoken prayer in church, what do you believe church should be like? It's pretty clear that Jesus gave few instructions on how it should be conducted. He was a big fan of "The Lord's Prayer," and "Communion" (or whatever it's called), but he really left church services up to Peter and the apostles with the words "Feed My Sheep."

May I ask you to look at a few of the prior verses in Matthew?

1 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.

2 Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

3 But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth:

4 That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

It seems Jesus isn't condemning prayer or acts done in public (or in church), He's condemning the practice of doing it to gain the praise of men.



Post a verse where Jesus prayed when he wasn't alone.



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