Gonzo Hermeneutics: Michael Harner, George Ripley and Don Juan Matos, page 3

reply to post by ImaFungi

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Science is merely a description of behaviour and a method for getting to that description.

A story is made of paragraphs, paragraphs are made of sentences, sentences are made of words, words are made of the alphabet, the alphabet is made of lines, lines are made of connected dots, the dots are connected by nothing.

I can describe all the parts, and all the nothing, but no matter how accurate my description is it is all still nothing without the art of putting it together. Even if it is just the parts are telling themselves the story that makes them something more than dots connected together by gaps of nothing.

Science is description without context. Context is the soul of the story. Much like the soul, the understanding of context is fluid and almost impossible to pin down yet everyone (almost) knows that there is context. Almost everyone understands context long before they understand how to put together a sentence. An infant deduces context, and then strives to put language together to share that context.

I'm probably way off topic by now.

reply to post by Xoanon

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What you are talking about, with the dragon and the red sperm....it has nothing to do with the hallucinogens taken (at least not in any direct term). Alchemy, as it is referred to by the dragon, is a European/Asian/African endeavor. The America's were far, far more mystical in nature.

To give you an insight....alchemy was the search for the "quintessence". That is, the material that is thought to be the base of all material. It is extracted via a process that is magickal in nature (more on that later). The "dragon" refers to a stage of the liquid. So does the red sperm looking things (it passes through a stage that is red, with an adjacent stage referred to as "the dragon", or something along those lines).

In many of the more mystical practices, there are parallels drawn between man and his crafts. The masons did it with building/architecture. The alchemists do it too, seeking to purify themselves by applying a metaphor of their craft (the search of the quintessence) to themselves.

For insight to this, a start will be:

“Take in the NAME of the Lord, of thy Paradisiacal Water, of heavenly Water of Mercury, as much as thou wilt, put it into a glass to dissolve, and set it in a slow heat of Ashes, that it may just feel the warmth, then have ready well purified Gold for the Red, or Silver for the White Elixir, for in both the Processes are the same. Let your Gold or Silver be beaten as thin as leaf Gold, cast it by degrees into your dissolving Glass, that contains your blessed Water, as you did in the beginning with your Salt, and it will melt like Ice in Warm Water, and continue so to do till your Gold or Silver lie therein four days without dissolving, then it has received its due Pondus. Then put this dissolution as before into a round Glass, fill it two thirds parts full, seal it hermetically as before, let your Sigillum be well dried. Set it in the furnace of Balneum Vapori, make a fire and let it remain forty days, as before, then will the Gold or Silver be dissolved radically and will turn of the deepest black in the world, which as soon as you see, have your other drying furnace in readiness.

From an article I wrote quoting a Manly Hall piece:

bigfatfurrytexan.wordpress.com...

If you are going to study anything related to The Mysteries, you have to include Manly Hall.

reply to post by Ladysophiaofsandoz

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Thanks for the great reference. Just purchased the book, and would love to hear some more insight.

After reading the scroll, Ripley seems to be indicating that the Philosopher's stone is the transmutation of energy via meditation and such. The picture represents certain levels or chakras, the lowest being the Dragon and the crown being the highest. My two cents.

Originally posted by yoyoma15
reply to post by Ladysophiaofsandoz

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Thanks for the great reference. Just purchased the book, and would love to hear some more insight.

After reading the scroll, Ripley seems to be indicating that the Philosopher's stone is the transmutation of energy via meditation and such. The picture represents certain levels or chakras, the lowest being the Dragon and the crown being the highest. My two cents.

I took the crown and dragon more of a universal,,,, good and evil,,,, or order and chaos,,,, order being what brings what is good,,,,, chaos usually brings negative effects,,,,,,

God being the most good,,,, the king of order,,,,,,

and evil,,, or chaos,, being the dragon,,, satan or serpent...

these are ancient ideas and archetypes,,,, so while chakras may be exactly what these scrolls are about i wouldnt be suppressed if those terms are related in that way,,.......,, the crown representing the humans center of intelligence,, the place where humans sort and create order of the material world.,,

reply to post by timewalker

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From The Emerald Tablet of Hermes...

The Sun is its father, the moon its mother,
the wind hath carried it in its belly, the earth its nurse.
The father of all perfection in the whole world is here.
Its force or power is entire if it be converted into earth.

Newton's translation
en.wikipedia.org...

Ripley Scroll
Omogeni is my Father
And Magnesia is my Mother


Otherwise known as, "The Sun is the Father and The Moon is The Mother. O the mother. I the father.

It is really tempting to apply the symbolism of the tantras to all of this stuff. My friends and I used to make a game of it when we realized that it was so easy. Think about it, Bubba; all those books out there that ultimately fall back on the East to explain alchemy. I have gotten a lot from the friction that they create, but I always find myself back in the West, poring over the works of Breugel, Bosch and Durer.

Also, did you know that the symbol of the sister, Azot, that the serpent is advertising is the Caduceus?



X.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

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What you are talking about, with the dragon and the red sperm....it has nothing to do with the hallucinogens taken (at least not in any direct term).

Hi bigfatfurrytexan,

Thanks for coming by.

I think that the hallucinogens are the least interesting part of this whole mash up. What I think is interesting is this recurring theme of these great mass-y, biological entities that recurs in the narrative themes of these seemingly disparate sources.

Ripley: Great serpent-dragon, locked in a struggle with our immediate source of gravitation and sustenance, whose presence in the circuit seems to deliver some needed element unto earth (?) (the globe).

Harner: Space 'Whales' running from some doom hide themselves by disseminating their spoor into the biological system of earth.

Don Jaun Matos: More Space 'Whales' but of manageable size; same as above but more; they gave us their minds!!!!!!!!

Charlie Fort: WTF!!! it's Charlie after all.

If you were able to grab something from Manly P. concerning all of this I will personally film my head exploding for you and post it on YouTube.



X

reply to post by Xoanon

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nice !!! your a gentleman and a scholar!

Ive always played around with the idea that the depictions of dragons and serpents,, and satan equals time itself...... I guess its known that that snake eating its own tail depicts time,,,, but i think all evil comes from time,,,,,, all things come into order and that is good,,, for with out this, things cannot exist,,,,, but it is time which defiles and corrupts them, and ultimately kills them,, if there was order and life but no time, we would never die, and theoretically no reason to be evil and erratic and wild, ( these are our longings for heaven, a timeless place with all of our relatives who have been taken by time ,,, i think in the garden of eden it was time which tempted adam and eve to take the fruit of knowledge of good and evil ( or learn) it was only a matter of time....... if everything was static,,, there would be no motion or change,,, no new things brought into existence,,, this is the contradiction which causes duality,,, if it is wanted that new things come into existence and there is a progression,,, whats old must die........ this also i think relates to nature as the dragon bleeding or seeding or gods sacrificing themselves for life,,,, also relevant to the snake eating its own tail,,,, in the way that nature consumes it self for its self,,,,,, it is a big ball of recycle,,,,,, its like energy must use energy to get energy,,,

reply to post by ImaFungi

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My dearest friend on this forum has suggested that we have been placed in a circuit.

I agree with you as well as I am able. The mystery of time is something that I have a rather estranged relationship with. I do sense that we are all taking part in an endless and recursive procession. But I also sense in my heart that we have chosen for it to be this way. And some do, myself at times as well, believe that it has come to pass because we made a deal with the 'devil'.

Thanks for being here and posting.

X.

reply to post by Xoanon

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It is a long read, but a must for the path you are going down right now. Pick up a free copy of The Secret Teachings Of All Ages. You can google it up and read it in either .pdf or webpage.

I have read the Castaneda material, and believe every word of it. I have seen things in my time here in West Texas.

Regardless, read the above mentioned book.

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