History that your teachers never taught you.

Originally posted by IpsissimusMagus
The Native American plague is most likely small pox.

en.wikipedia.org...

The most notable disease brought by Europeans was the destructive smallpox disease. Smallpox was lethal to many Native Americans, bringing sweeping epidemics and affecting the same tribes repeatedly. Within 1837 to 1870, “at least four different epidemics struck the Plains tribes.” Numerous other diseases were brought to Native American tribes, including “measles, scarlet fever, typhoid, typhus, influenza, whooping cough, tuberculosis, cholera, diphtheria, chicken pox, and venereal diseases

Agreed. Amazing how the immune system works...

"That's not in my American History Book" Thomas Ayres

Is another great example of a "revisionist" history compilation. I have been a history teacher in my professional life and one thing students love is to find out something new about history, like the Wright Brothers were not the first to make an scientifically observed, powered, heavier-than-air flight. (Gustave Whitehead)

That one hits home too because I taught in the "First in Flight" State.

Another poster suggested that source material is best, I cannot agree more. When living in DC, I lived on 5th and D NE and the park at the end of the road towards the Capitol Building had a statue of Nathaniel Greene. Being a teacher and interested in the history of my home state, I bought his biography, it was amazing how the letters between he and his wife recorded the struggle for independence so differently, she was in their home state of Rhode Island (I believe) and he was in the Southern Colonies fighting the British. Same time, husband and wife, two completely different accounts of the Revolutionary War.

It can happen that two completely different accounts of the same event can be true.

white people are evil
christians are evil

why did us bastards have to travel the world? we should have stayed in the cage right?
Indoctrination is pure evil

On the topic of lies/misconceptions perpetuated by teachers here is a video from the BBC series "Horrible Histories" that really takes the cake. Even those with the purest of intentions can unintentionally perpetuate a stereotype or lie about any given subject. Always good to fact check and use multiple sources but sometimes it is equally good to keep an open mind and prepare to learn something new about that topic you always thought had nothing new to discovered.

Note: Not poking fun at the serious nature of some of the misconceptions perpetuated.

Originally posted by Mkoll
If the plague hadn't devastated them so thoroughly the Europeans most definitely would have been unsuccessful at colonialism, I think. So long as they didn't start stabbing each other in the back (how the conquistadors won against the Aztecs.) there would have been too many of them and with the technology of the day it would be logistically impossible for them to get more than a foothold. Unfortunately human nature would have probably gotten the better of them and they would start using the Europeans to destroy their rivals and then be surprised when they are next in line.

edit on 19-5-2012 by Mkoll because: (no reason given)

Are you serious? The plague is w hy whitey won?
Wow, I didn't know it was that simple and i thought the spaniards consider themselves non white..

Originally posted by HamrHeed
white people are evil
christians are evil

why did us bastards have to travel the world? we should have stayed in the cage right?
Indoctrination is pure evil

White people are no more evil than any other race. All races have good and bad people in them.

I might agree that Christian leadership has more than their share of evil among them. But I wouldn't lump the average Christian in with them.

Originally posted by Sahabi
Was this plague a natural phenomena occurring in the Americas, or was it some sort of transfer of European germs (non-deadly to Europeans) onto the Native Americans (no previous immunity) through contact?

And, why did the natives of a any land catch Euro-diseases and not the other way around? Were the Americas disease-free before we got here?

reply to post by jiggerj


Good question! You are touching on something called the "Pristine Myth" that North America was some sort of Pristine wilderness the Natives did not properly utilize. On the contrary, they burned soil for better farming and shaped the landscape before Europeans arrived. Why the Europeans did not catch diseases? I am sure they did, but remember that the Natives were healthier, less cramped early on, and enjoyed a much natural holistic system of health and medicine that only recently has been validated.

reply to post by HamrHeed


Hey, I know of a good bridge you can live under and riddle and or murder passerbys from. You interested?

Originally posted by Klassified

Originally posted by HamrHeed
white people are evil
christians are evil

why did us bastards have to travel the world? we should have stayed in the cage right?
Indoctrination is pure evil

White people are no more evil than any other race. All races have good and bad people in them.
Sorry I was being sarcastic. I don't ride the anti whitey train. It has too many passengers that are getting a "free ride"
And I don't mean that in a racialist fashion. People are just trying to fit in when they beat and rob white folks in the street, unabated and proud

I might agree that Christian leadership has more than their share of evil among them. But I wouldn't lump the average Christian in with them.

Originally posted by Mkoll
reply to post by HamrHeed

 

Hey, I know of a good bridge you can live under and riddle and or murder passerbys from. You interested?

edit on 19-5-2012 by Mkoll because: (no reason given)

I was being sarcastic. Sorry if anyone took it offensively.. I am white but not christian

In my youth I sought out information about Native Americans. I was never informed of how vast the trade network was. There were not isolated tribes and trade between North and South America is documented. a thousand years ago feathers of parrots were brought from equatorial regions all the way to Canada, with the live birds attached.

Originally posted by MysteriousHusky
reply to post by jiggerj

 

Good question! You are touching on something called the "Pristine Myth" that North America was some sort of Pristine wilderness the Natives did not properly utilize. On the contrary, they burned soil for better farming and shaped the landscape before Europeans arrived. Why the Europeans did not catch diseases? I am sure they did, but remember that the Natives were healthier, less cramped early on, and enjoyed a much natural holistic system of health and medicine that only recently has been validated.

WOW
If you said that in public, the hardcore racialists would stone you to death..
add> it's well known that the indians had a utopia before the euros came.

The fact remains that the settlers attacked and killed many Indians that were left. The Indians knew they had no choice but to sell their lands to the Europeans or they would have been killed. That is a fact because many Indians were killed for not complying with things that settlers wanted. Their young were shuffled off to schools to recondition them too. My ancestors were not here to do this so I do not feel guilty. I also do not approve of how the Native Americans were treated in the past. I do not feel I personally owe the Indians anything other than respect. Our country does owe them though and I am part of our country so I will support reimbursing them if necessary.

Big businesses have taken from the Indians a lot in the past and it seems the little the government got in taxes was never enough to reimburse the Native Americans so the taxpayer paid. Why didn't our government make sure that things were right in the first place. This is going on everywhere in this country today, the quest for money by businesses rapes the local people. Our government has not got much better at anything other than being better liars today. For the good of the people is the evilest thing I have ever seen. For the good of the wasteful the conservationists loose everything.

My sympathy for their plight has worn thin, sadly. After years of institutionalized racism, I find it hard to even relate to people who accuse me of genocide because my skin is white.
My family had nothing to do with it, yet i'm told to "go back to europe" cracker

reply to post by HamrHeed


I know quite a few Indians and they don't say anything bad about white people. They just are trying to get some reimbursement for a little of the injustices that have been done to them over the years. They also want to have some of their fishing and hunting rights back and not have to pay for a license. The conflict isn't between the regular guy and the Indians Many government officials in the past let their rich friends screw the Native Americans over.

history teaches all kinds of things like this. it just depends on what you read.

i remember reading a story from the 1830s, perhaps, Carolina explaining how one night unidentified assailants went house to house and village to village murdering the inhabitants.

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by HamrHeed

 

I know quite a few Indians and they don't say anything bad about white people. They just are trying to get some reimbursement for a little of the injustices that have been done to them over the years. They also want to have some of their fishing and hunting rights back and not have to pay for a license. The conflict isn't between the regular guy and the Indians Many government officials in the past let their rich friends screw the Native Americans over.

edit on 19-5-2012 by rickymouse because: (no reason given)

No, the racism comes from everyone BUT natives in my experience. The islamists and marxists have latched onto the race card. I have natives in my immediate family.
They know that back in the day it was mob rule and it wasn't the regular folk who made war agin them. In fact, I think they're realizing our struggles are similar

Originally posted by jiggerj

Originally posted by Sahabi
Was this plague a natural phenomena occurring in the Americas, or was it some sort of transfer of European germs (non-deadly to Europeans) onto the Native Americans (no previous immunity) through contact?

And, why did the natives of a any land catch Euro-diseases and not the other way around? Were the Americas disease-free before we got here?

I'll have to look around but I read an article recently that stated that some of the STD"s started with the Amerindians and we're then spread to the Europeans.
Very interesting.

What took care of the Indians was a few well paid men who sat around all day shooting the millions of Buffalo that used to roam the midwest.

Literally paid to sit there and shoot day after day after day....so the Indians would be starved to death.

Who paid those few guys to sit there and shoot day after day....shooting millions of rounds and just letting the Buffalo rot. Didn't even use anything on it to try and make money.