Proof of chemtrail/geo-engineering May 11

reply to post by tommyjo


You always add so many links in your replies just to argue your point! Why is that? Seems if you can't dazzle us with your brilliance, you want to baffle us with your bull*hit!

But....you can add all the maps, links, graphics and satellite imagery you want. Knock your socks off. It's your time and sweat but let me tell you something.....even if this was one MILE from an airport ....he still captured airplanes at cruising altitude (30,000) marking up the skies and blocking out our god-given sunlight.
The argument really stops and starts right there!

Originally posted by Human_Alien

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul

Originally posted by Human_Alien
[Whoa!!! I had no idea you had that thread. You should be the poster-member on how to present a compelling thread for persistent contrails! I humbly bow at your feet!!!

Really??

you'd do that because he presents a "compelling" case for persistent contrails?

And yet persistent contrails have been known for at least 70 years as per my extract from the wakes of war above, and a few papers linked to on here from time to time, and no debunkers argue otherwise than that they do exist whereas chemtrail believers think there is no such thing - that they aer all chemtrails??

Whatever. Isn't it time for you to lay an egg or something???

It is my pleasure to give kudos and accolades to people who obviously spend a lot of time preparing something for OUR benefit to look over.
That thread was well above the call of duty and above what is usually presented here on this subject. I know my threads don't come anywhere near as professional as Piano's thread does.

Why are you such a buzz-kill?

I can think of lots of reasons some people would use such tactics:

15. Fit the facts to alternate conclusions. This requires creative thinking unless the crime was planned with contingency conclusions in place.
17. Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can 'argue' with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.
18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can't do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how 'sensitive they are to criticism.'
19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the 'play dumb' rule. Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon.) In order to completely avoid discussing issues, it may be required that you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.

ibed link above.

There is much more to what happened than just contrail formation and he knows it as he was in that thread.

There were a large number of planes not on flight aware that were producing the spreading persistent contrails. There were a few that were on flight aware that were producing the contrails that NOAA data indicated they should be producing... ergo, possibly the ones not on flight aware making these spreading persistent contrails might have been spraying.

reply to post by Human_Alien

he still captured airplanes at cruising altitude (30,000) marking up the skies and blocking out our god-given sunlight.

Well, his and his neighbors' maybe. Not mine.
Yes contrails and other clouds (even the god-given ones) block sunlight.

Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by Human_Alien

 

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

How is this supposed to block out the sun?
The contrails, and their blockage of the sun are relative to the viewers location on the ground.

If you went 5 miles up the road from were the video was shot, the contrails wouldn’t anywhere near the sun.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

Got proof of that? What if it were more like 25 or 50 miles? Does that really make a difference?

That man has the GOD GIVEN birthright to have the Sun shine on him on a clear day. Period!!!
So I don't really care if this effects a single family, a small village or an entire Continent.

Your empathy isn't that becoming.

Originally posted by Human_Alien

Here's the flip-side of that argument. Why is the onslaught of con-trailing allowed to happen in the first place?

Because it saves fuel and lowers the amount of pollution generated by jet aircraft.

Jets are more efficient the higher they fly - it is trivial to stop contrails forming by flying at a different height.

But jets are already flying as high as they can or are allowed, so the only way to avoid contrails is to fly at a lower altitude. this means they will burn more fuel and generate more pollution.

Ironically it also means they will generate more water vapour which may later help form cirrus clouds without having formed a contrail in the first instance.

It can't be healthy because it does not LOOK healthy.

So the pollution generated by aircraft is healthier when you do not see it??

that doesn't seem like a very useful criteria for what is healthy. spirulina is supposedly healthy but isn't all that attractive. Neither is exercise.......although some exercising bodies dont' look to bad...

Our skies are not supposed to be filled with man-made bi product.

Nor with pollution from factories and automobiles, which generate many more times the pollution that aircraft do, and which generate it right at the same altitude that we breathe, as opposed to 30,000 feet up!

We already know that this is not water vapors because it defies water vapor principles by lingering for hours.

we already know that is nonsense, that you do not actually see water vapour at all, and that water and ice particles can hang around for hours because that is what CLOUDS are made of!

So something foreign is responsible for holding the molecules together that make up these trails that last ....for hours!

since your premise is untrue this is untrue too.

And then, changes our natural weather.

such as?

So regardless if they're contrails or aerosol spraying why aren't the proper people who look after our safety jumping all over this?
And the sheer fact that they AREN'T leads us right back down the covert chemtrail path.

Only to the narrow minded who cannot conceive that contrails are a normal part of combustion of hydrocarbons at low temperatures and high humidity, and who make all the same errors that you have demonstrated already.

It's because of the lack of interest that's drawing so much attention to this matter.

Thank you for giving praise to Piano! It was certainly deserved!!

Only in his own mind.

Originally posted by tommyjo

Originally posted by Human_Alien


Planes do NOT hold at 30,000 feet

Seriously now you are just trolling!

Here's a news flash that you might've missed:

This is my thread therefore I can't be trolling.
Sure seems you're pretty desperate to get attention.

Originally posted by pianopraze
[There is much more to what happened than just contrail formation and he knows it as he was in that thread.

Yep - I read it all - what a waste of my time.

no evidence proffered other than assertion and assumption, and those clearly shown to be wrong .... and yet still you persist in highlighting it.

There were a large number of planes

no there weer not - there were a handful.

....not on flight aware that were producing the spreading persistent contrails.

and since not all planes are on flight aware, and you admit they made contrails, what was eth actual problem again??

There were a few that were on flight aware that were producing the contrails that NOAA data indicated they should be producing... ergo, possibly the ones not on flight aware making these spreading persistent contrails might have been spraying.

Or might not - you just don't know and have no way of knowing - your "might have been" is pure speculation for which there is not even supporting evidence that such a programme exists in the first place, has ever existed, or would even look like persistent contrails if it did exist!!

Let's see which of these you managed to fulfil:

15. Fit the facts to alternate conclusions. This requires creative thinking unless the crime was planned with contingency conclusions in place.

Tick - they look like contrails, behave like contrails, are generated like contrails, there's no evidence they are anything other than contrails, but you fit these facts to an alternate explanation - they are not contrails.

17. Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can 'argue' with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.

Tick - you've changed this discussion to be about your own thread, and how hard done by you were there.....

18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can't do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how 'sensitive they are to criticism.'

Tick - you have responded in this thread to identify "signs of disinfo" (I forget the exact title) from which you have extracted these "signs" and try to argue emotionally that these show you to be correct because the actual facts don't support you at all.

19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the 'play dumb' rule. Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon.) In order to completely avoid discussing issues, it may be required that you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.

lol - yep - I don't ask for proof at all - I ask for evidence.

But apparently I have to provide proof that therse trails are NOT chemtrails or geoengineering.

you, on the other hand, do not even offer evidence, and ignore a wealth of verifiable, scientific data with scant atention to logic or credibility, resorting to arguments like this one of your which attempts to get around the lack of actual evidence and make it all about personalities and tactics.

Well sorry - but it dosen't matter what you do - the FACT is that you stil do not have 1 single piece of verifiable evidence that supports you contention that there is geoengineering being carried out by airliners.

Let alone that contrails form part of it.

that's got nothing to do with me. nothing to do with who I work for, or who pays me. nothing to do with the tactics that I use.

It is solely down to your LACK OF VERIFIABLE EVIDENCE.

And you can solve it yourself - again without any input from me and regardless of what I do or do not do.

All you have to do is provide 1 single piece of verifiable evidence showing that airliners are being used to conduct a programme of geoengineering.

Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by Human_Alien

 

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

How is this supposed to block out the sun?
The contrails, and their blockage of the sun are relative to the viewers location on the ground.

If you went 5 miles up the road from were the video was shot, the contrails wouldn’t anywhere near the sun.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

Such logic goes out the window when the 'sun blockers' start bleating about chemtrails. No doubt the explanation will be in the realms of fantasy or if all else fails then Nibiru will be thrown in. Perspective obviously baffles Human_Alien as he thinks that planes and their trails are shooting up from the direction of the Atlantic. He thinks that planes can't possibly hold at FL300 or above. No doubt he thinks that NASA went to the trouble of putting up 'aircraft holding pattern' propaganda to hide the 'racetrack spraying'. The mind boggles. What next, I ask?

reply to post by pianopraze


As much as I know there's a psychology to this I am also convinced that some people really and simply don't see this impact (regardless of what it is) as we do.
There is a definite line in the sand and it's too bad. Because if we're right (which I am 99% certain we are) then it effects everyone and everyone should be united on this.

As far as the smartarses asking for air sample proof well.....once again, either they're not thinking that out or.......they know that's an impossibility.

Because I can just see it now. Someone in a Red Baron plane--- jettisons up to 30,000 feet (with video camera in hand) and takes out a mason jar then...scoops up the trail and closes with lid

Then brings it back to here...get's it properly analyzed.....rendering a report stating high levels of "barium and aluminum" and the naysayer will then say the sample was tampered with.

So the request to get a sample is ridiculous and that's what they're feeding off it. This is really untouchable territory unfortunately.

But who knows.....maybe yet ANOTHER whistle blower will come forward (even though the debunkers love ripping them up too).

We'll see.
Thanks for your participation in this thread. You're a delight!

Originally posted by tommyjo

Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by Human_Alien

 

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

How is this supposed to block out the sun?
The contrails, and their blockage of the sun are relative to the viewers location on the ground.

If you went 5 miles up the road from were the video was shot, the contrails wouldn’t anywhere near the sun.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

Such logic goes out the window when the 'sun blockers' start bleating about chemtrails. No doubt the explanation will be in the realms of fantasy or if all else fails then Nibiru will be thrown in. Perspective obviously baffles Human_Alien as he thinks that planes and their trails are shooting up from the direction of the Atlantic. He thinks that planes can't possibly hold at FL300 or above. No doubt he thinks that NASA went to the trouble of putting up 'aircraft holding pattern' propaganda to hide the 'racetrack spraying'. The mind boggles. What next, I ask?

Don't tell me what I think or don't think.

The military jets that I see over the Atlantic come from ships. Therefore they are ascending in altitude.

As far as holding patterns? Hold for what? To land? Not at 30,000 feet are they holding to land. Do you think I'm a moron and this is my first day on the planet?

You are ridiculous and a pure waste of time.

PS. Nibiru (or a 10th planet) is real. Was just semi announced yesterday but still..not quite because they don't want panic. But here it is as of May 15th
They don't report crap without an agenda. This is not being reported just to fill up space. So we'll see whose laughing last.
Secret rogue planet may be hiding behind Neptune

Originally posted by Human_Alien

Got proof of that? What if it were more like 25 or 50 miles? Does that really make a difference?

That man has the GOD GIVEN birthright to have the Sun shine on him on a clear day. Period!!!
So I don't really care if this effects a single family, a small village or an entire Continent.

Your empathy isn't that becoming.

Good grief. Will they be targeting individuals next? Have you tried Orgonite? It dissolves those pesky 'chemtrails'. Just think a few of those in your garden and you will always be in the sunshine! Instant results or your money back!

reply to post by Human_Alien

The military jets that I see over the Atlantic come from ships. Therefore they are ascending in altitude.

What type of jet? You are so full of baseless assumptions it's not surprising that you think Nibiru is real or that the hypothesis from Gomes has anything to do with it.

Read a book (other than Dr. Suess). Feed your head.

Originally posted by tommyjo

Originally posted by Human_Alien

Got proof of that? What if it were more like 25 or 50 miles? Does that really make a difference?

That man has the GOD GIVEN birthright to have the Sun shine on him on a clear day. Period!!!
So I don't really care if this effects a single family, a small village or an entire Continent.

Your empathy isn't that becoming.

Good grief. Will they be targeting individuals next? Have you tried Orgonite? It dissolves those pesky 'chemtrails'. Just think a few of those in your garden and you will always be in the sunshine! Instant results or your money back!

I called you out, clarifying where your assumptions went wrong and you go right into the next round swinging without a mention to the last insulting post.

You are not worth it. You're a provocateur and nothing more.
And as much as I don't mind going fist-to-cuffs and spar around a bit with others, you're clearly not on that list.

Have a good evening sir!


To all others reading this: Aerosol spraying is real. There's no more debate over this matter. Congressman, weathermen, scientists, pilots etc wouldn't waste their precious time chasing and demanding answers over water vapors!
So let's get everyone up to speed on this phenomenon.

Someone (probably military) have orders from somebody (probably the government) to do something in our skies involving these trails.

Our mission, if you chose to accept it is to find out the 'who' behind this matter. Forget the 'what' and the 'why' because the easiest part would be 'who'. The rest should fall into place after that.

And so far a likely culprit is this Evergreen facility
Do the research. It's all out there.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by Human_Alien

 

The military jets that I see over the Atlantic come from ships. Therefore they are ascending in altitude.

What type of jet? You are so full of baseless assumptions it's not surprising that you think Nibiru is real or that the hypothesis from Gomes has anything to do with it.

Read a book (other than Dr. Suess). Feed your head.

edit on 5/15/2012 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Navy jets. What's so hard to understand? Why so difficult to accept that? What?....jet's don't leave ships anymore?
When you're on the beach and see jets originating low in the eastern sky and traveling upward at an incredible rate of speed, my 3 year old knows they are military planes coming off of ocean bond ships.

I'm not sure why you're doubting and debating that? Is this going to be like the 'planet' verses the 'Earth' ridicule.....dad?

I read enough books, thank you. In fact, I just read one on Planet X.

It was a pleasure having you bump my thread every 15 minutes, making more people aware of this phenomenon and exposing the truth. That's all I want.

Please be sure to stop by again!

]Originally posted by Human_Alien

This is my thread therefore I can't be trolling.
Sure seems you're pretty desperate to get attention.

I'm desperate? Take a good look at the number of posts you have made on this subject. It is like an obsession with you and it always descends into lunacy with your claims in regards to aviation. Nothing ever seems to get through to you as you just handwave it all away and start afresh with the aviation blunders. Obviously it will make no difference and a thread will appear in the future riddled with all the same aviation misinterpretations. Repeat, rinse and recycle should be your posting motto! You probably still can't comprehend that aircraft can hold at FL300 and above? Correct?

Here's a thread that you can impart you knowledge on.

'Do Aircraft Fly Around In Tight Circles At 30,000 Feet?'

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Probably see you in the next thread in the near future? Remember to keep up the aviation comedy posts as I don't want your standards slipping!

reply to post by Human_Alien

When you're on the beach and see jets originating low in the eastern sky and traveling upward at an incredible rate of speed, my 3 year old knows they are military planes coming off of ocean bond ships.

I didn't depend on my daughter's judgement much when she was 3. So you don't know what type of jet they are. Too bad, that would help determine if they come from aircraft carriers or not. Some people think they're missiles. They aren't. They are planes coming from beyond the horizon at altitude. It's a matter of perspective.


www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I read enough books, thank you. In fact, I just read one on Planet X.

I guess it wasn't a thick book:

My reading levels off at around Dr Seuss! But not the thick books though.

I like science fiction too. But but I know the difference between fiction and non-fiction.

Originally posted by Human_Alien

www.youtube.com...

This is highly excessive and abnormal.

The last couple of days here have been similar to this, to the point that even my sister was curious about it. If you knew my sister, you'd know that is really saying something.

ANYONE who says "oh! this has been going on since the 50's!!!" blah blah blah can go POUND SAND for all I care.

There are 5 or 6 of those "persistent con-jerks" on this website and it's going to get harder and harder for them to do their jobs here, as folks who may have not noticed this before are going to soon, because it's just getting more and more obvious.

My advice to those of you who wish to discuss this, is ignore those members. They are not "de-bunkers". They are only here for one reason. Divert/disrupt any/all conversation about this agenda.

Just look at that video. (and this is a great example) IT IS NOT NORMAL FOR THE SKY TO LOOK LIKE THAT.

period

reply to post by HIWATT

IT IS NOT NORMAL FOR THE SKY TO LOOK LIKE THAT.

No need to yell.
But you're right...sort of. If there were no jet aircraft transportation the sky would not look like that.

I starred and flagged you on this one, Human_Alien.

Normally I don't respond to someone just posting another youtube video, as it's getting pretty tired.

This one however, is extraordinarily disgusting IMO. Good catch.

reply to post by Phage


Who knows, besides a select few, what types of planes are flying?
My expertise isn't aviation. I never claimed it to be.
If I saw a plane crash, would it be irrelevant because I didn't know what type of plane it was?

These are clearly military craft. Again, what's so amazing or argumentative about that?
I see military copters all the time going out into/over the ocean (most likely to a ship). Just because you may be land lock doesn't mean coastal laymen don't know what certain crafts are.

My 3 year knows truth. He hasn't been brainwashed yet. Perhaps you should've relied on your child's wisdom a bit more because maybe then you would've grown to be more opened minded