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European policymakers are about to commit another major blunder in their handling of the eurozone debt crisis, and this time it could well be fatal.
Mistakenly, they have convinced themselves that it won't much matter if Greece leaves, and indeed that it might even help resolve the wider crisis to get rid of this persistent thorn in the flesh.
Bring it on, they mutter callously; it will be a lot worse for them than for us. On one level, this is just bravado. It's an attempt to put as nonchalant a face as possible on the now apparently inevitable. But they also seem to believe in their validity of their own analysis – that they have indeed used the past two years well, and are now fully prepared for a Greek exit.
Believe it if you will. The ineptitude to date of the eurozone's crisis response strongly suggests a different conclusion – both that the likely contagion from an exit has been hugely underestimated, and that by prompting a wider breakup, thereby tipping Europe into depression, it may end up as bad for everyone else as it is for Greece.
The Greek problem has been consistently misdiagnosed and mismanaged right from the start. First there was the suggestion a year ago from Angela Merkel and Nicolas Sarkozy that if Greece didn't buckle under and agree austerity it might be chucked out. Markets reacted logically by selling bonds in any country that looked vulnerable, thereby making it much harder for all periphery governments to fund themselves.
This disastrous admission was compounded by attempts to underpin confidence in the financial system by forcing banks to mark their sovereign debt to market. This destroyed the concept of the "risk free asset", forcing banks for the first time to apply capital to their sovereign debt exposures. Unsurprisingly, they stopped buying sovereign bonds in the distressed countries, again making it harder for governments to fund themselves.
Let's just briefly deconstruct the increasingly desperate position that Greece finds itself in. Greeks have voted to reject austerity but remain in the euro. They won't be allowed both.
If they don't continue with the programme, they'll be denied the remainder of the bail-out money. Unable to pay wages, pensions, healthcare costs and bills, government will quickly grind to a halt. The state could theoretically force the banks to buy its bonds, but the ECB would soon in such circumstances refuse further funding. At that stage Greece would have no option but to return to the drachma.
Hyperinflation would replace grinding deflation. The effect on living standards would be equally catastrophic. It's true that properly managed, leaving the euro does in the long term have the potential to return Greece to competitiveness and growth.
The threat comes instead from market contagion to other eurozone countries worst hit by the debt crisis. To Germany, Greece has always been a special case, a nation which cheated its way into the euro, whose citizens are lazy and won't pay their taxes, and is in any case basically ungovernable. There is a very different attitude to Spain and Italy. Germany's determination to make the rest of the eurozone work should not be underestimated.
The trouble is that once one has left, and the principle has been established that it is indeed possible to leave the euro, it's going to be tough to impossible to contain the crippling capital flight which is certain to set in elsewhere. Greece is just the canary in the mineshaft, an outrider for the much wider problem of imbalances and divergent competitiveness.
Time is running out. There's little doubt where Francois Hollande finds himself in Churchill's famous dictum that Germany is either at your throat or at your feet. On his first day as President of France, he's off like a poodle to Berlin for crisis talks. Can he persuade Angela Merkel of some kind of cunning, alternative plan? Does he even have one? Now why does this seem so unlikely? What a mess.
An outgoing Greek minister warned that the country could descend into “civil war” amid the chaos of a euro exit. “If Greece cannot meet its obligations and serve its debt the pain will be great,” Michalis Chrysohoidis was quoted as telling a local radio station. “What will prevail are armed gangs with Kalashnikovs and which one has the greatest number of Kalashnikovs will count … we will end up in civil war.”
Originally posted by MidnightTide
Yes, it is going to happen - and once that train starts rolling you are going to see Italy, Spain and the entire Euro zone crash. Markets going to crash, then eyes will turn to the states.
SHTF, about to come to a neighborhood near you.
Originally posted by babybunnies
Originally posted by MidnightTide
Yes, it is going to happen - and once that train starts rolling you are going to see Italy, Spain and the entire Euro zone crash. Markets going to crash, then eyes will turn to the states.
SHTF, about to come to a neighborhood near you.
I don't think you'll see Eurozone crash, but I bet there will be a new treaty negotiated before long with those large debt countries taken out.
Hopefully, United Kingdom will see sense and use that as an opportunity to exit the European Union. If the UK were to hold the referendum that David Cameron promised to his lapdog Clegg during his negotiations for a coalition government, UK exit would likely be sooner rather than later anyway.
Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by ProfEmeritus
World governments in general are making, in my opinion, intentional bad decisions. It's not just Greece. We can hope they'll just exit, but I lay you odds that they don't. They're going to bring the whole damn thing crumbling down around them. Watch.
Originally posted by babybunnies
Originally posted by MidnightTide
Yes, it is going to happen - and once that train starts rolling you are going to see Italy, Spain and the entire Euro zone crash. Markets going to crash, then eyes will turn to the states.
SHTF, about to come to a neighborhood near you.
I don't think you'll see Eurozone crash, but I bet there will be a new treaty negotiated before long with those large debt countries taken out.
Hopefully, United Kingdom will see sense and use that as an opportunity to exit the European Union. If the UK were to hold the referendum that David Cameron promised to his lapdog Clegg during his negotiations for a coalition government, UK exit would likely be sooner rather than later anyway.
i think that's what kind of held us together in some of the sell-offs. i wrote this morning about what i call the rationale input. after they let the mistake of letting lehman go under. they knew they had to step in and save aig. they've used the qes and the ltros. if greece leaves the euro it could be cataclysmic. it could be lehman on steroids
well, it will be a process. but it will be a rapidly moving process. and for today, today for example you saw the greek banks get hit very badly because one of the first steps in the process will be a run on the banks. people would say oh, my god -- not just in greece? not just in dwrooes. any peripheral country? it will start clearly, it's already begun somewhat in greece but it will access rate in greece. people will say, they're going to shut the banks for the week, print up the drachma and when i go to get my money out it's going to be in drachma. i want it in the euro. i want the buying power of the euro right now, i'm either going to buy something with it or try and store it away. that will spread almost instantly to spain and italy. that's the fear.