Amen might be of pagan origin?

Originally posted by CaptainNemo

Originally posted by Sly1one
Amenhotep I,II,III,IV

Amun Ra (aka Amen Ra)

"Amen" definitely seems as originally Egyptian...It makes sense to me that the old/new testaments of Christianity would recycle old information/terms/etc or simply mistranslate them. Another good example of the bible using outside works is the epic of Gilgamesh.

The bible old or new is like a collective plagiarized older works/stories of various civilizations. For this reason I would speculate that the term Amen is most likely originally Egyptian…

So where's the forensic, linguistic, or ethnological evidence that the Genesis flood story is a copy of the Epic of Gilgamesh?

Following your logic, we would have to assume that since the Sumerians were the first ordered civilization every similar story thereafter would have to be a copy of it. That is, that the other 150+ cultures, who have global flood stories are liars.

These stories originated through word of mouth, and there were nomadic peoples before the Sumerians who told this story. Mesopotamia having the resources, needs, and knowledge to write, wrote the story down FIRST to preserve it. That certainly does not mean the other tales are untrue, that's just preposterous.

Word of mouth stories have the ability to drastically be changed through the years. Gilgamesh wasn't even the only survivor of the flood. It's highly plausible that the story is so different from Genesis because it was changed to become more of a national, prideful hym to Sumeria, per se.

The Semitic language family includes the Near East region, and the Middle East region. So this includes Mesopotamia and Israel. The word Semitic is derived from the biblical character Shem. Shem, being one of Noah's sons after the flood. Also, the first settlers of the fertile crescent were nomadic peoples that came in from the south. SO, almost without a shadow of a doubt we can say that infact the, the Epic of Gilgamesh was a more pride-centric version of the Genesis flood story.


en.wikipedia.org...

edit on 18-3-2012 by CaptainNemo because: (no reason given)

Take what I said and run a mile with it in the wrong direction if you wish...

I was merely implying that the BIBLE (new test) being a much younger COLLECTION OF WORKS is utilizing several EARLIER WORKS to tell a NEW STORY or CHRISTIAN/CATHOLIC story...

The bible is similar to if I went into the local library cherry-picked a few different genres of books wrapped them all up into one tale and calling it something new...when it is not, its a collection of previously written earlier works.

I didn't mean to imply I thought the only flood story was Gilgamesh there are several other cultures that had flood stories this I understand, but the bible in particular due to its later creation would surely be using one of or several of the other earlier flood stories as its basis.

reply to post by vaelamin

Stupid? Of all the people notyourtypical would say such things.

You totally misunderstood me. I didn't say you were stupid. Not at all, if my comment was taken that way, I'm terribly sorry for that. Please forgive me?

EDIT: Sorry, didn't notice the bottom of your last post after the quote originally. If you are unsure, then you don't have to say "Amen" at all, that's just custom. I say "Amen" in church when the pastor says something that really quickens my spirit, it's a natural reaction. You can always just end your prayer with "In Jesus's name." and leave out entirely the Amen at the end, it's not a big deal at all.

In fact, Paul argues effectively that anything not done of faith is sin. (I'll find the passage if you're interested, right off hand i can't recall the chapter and verse.) Man, I feel terrible now you thought I was calling you stupid.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Bah leave such thoughts behind you. Forgiveness is freely given. I hold no transgressions.

Originally posted by vaelamin
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Bah leave such thoughts behind you. Forgiveness is freely given. I hold no transgressions.

Thank you. You can say "Hallelujah" at the end of your prayer if you're a little unsure about Amen or not, no biggie. The important part is what you say to God, and what he says to you during the prayer itself, ya know?

Originally posted by Sly1one

Originally posted by CaptainNemo

Originally posted by Sly1one
Amenhotep I,II,III,IV

Amun Ra (aka Amen Ra)

"Amen" definitely seems as originally Egyptian...It makes sense to me that the old/new testaments of Christianity would recycle old information/terms/etc or simply mistranslate them. Another good example of the bible using outside works is the epic of Gilgamesh.

The bible old or new is like a collective plagiarized older works/stories of various civilizations. For this reason I would speculate that the term Amen is most likely originally Egyptian…

So where's the forensic, linguistic, or ethnological evidence that the Genesis flood story is a copy of the Epic of Gilgamesh?

Following your logic, we would have to assume that since the Sumerians were the first ordered civilization every similar story thereafter would have to be a copy of it. That is, that the other 150+ cultures, who have global flood stories are liars.

These stories originated through word of mouth, and there were nomadic peoples before the Sumerians who told this story. Mesopotamia having the resources, needs, and knowledge to write, wrote the story down FIRST to preserve it. That certainly does not mean the other tales are untrue, that's just preposterous.

Word of mouth stories have the ability to drastically be changed through the years. Gilgamesh wasn't even the only survivor of the flood. It's highly plausible that the story is so different from Genesis because it was changed to become more of a national, prideful hym to Sumeria, per se.

The Semitic language family includes the Near East region, and the Middle East region. So this includes Mesopotamia and Israel. The word Semitic is derived from the biblical character Shem. Shem, being one of Noah's sons after the flood. Also, the first settlers of the fertile crescent were nomadic peoples that came in from the south. SO, almost without a shadow of a doubt we can say that infact the, the Epic of Gilgamesh was a more pride-centric version of the Genesis flood story.


en.wikipedia.org...

edit on 18-3-2012 by CaptainNemo because: (no reason given)

Take what I said and run a mile with it in the wrong direction if you wish...

I was merely implying that the BIBLE (new test) being a much younger COLLECTION OF WORKS is utilizing several EARLIER WORKS to tell a NEW STORY or CHRISTIAN/CATHOLIC story...

The bible is similar to if I went into the local library cherry-picked a few different genres of books wrapped them all up into one tale and calling it something new...when it is not, its a collection of previously written earlier works.

I didn't mean to imply I thought the only flood story was Gilgamesh there are several other cultures that had flood stories this I understand, but the bible in particular due to its later creation would surely be using one of or several of the other earlier flood stories as its basis.

And yet you continue to make erroneous claims...

The Bible is completely what you said it is, a collection of earlier written works. It isn't claimed to be something new...I don't understand what you're trying to say.

EDIT: No. I just tried to explain to you that by simple logic, it makes more sense that the story has a common parent, originating in the ancient near east. Then I gave you evidence. The Sumerians were the first to write it down, so what...

Do some research on when and why the Torah was first written.

reply to post by vaelamin

I see your posts how there filled with good demeanor and no insulting words. Even though you might not believe in Jesus i can feel that you do good unto people which is his message. How ironic it would be for you to pass and face no judgement in the eyes of the lord while the so called church goers who dont practice what they preach will face his judgement's. Even though your ideals may differ that in its self to me seems like a fellow believer atleast to me.

Thanks.
I do believe in Jesus, in the fact that he existed, and he was teaching people that they ALL were part of the Divine. I even believe he was a "perfected" soul who came to earth to let the people know the Truth.

He taught love, kindness, reincarnation, and humility.

Others had done that before him. They were all right.

THE GOLDEN RULE: Treat others the way you would want to be treated.
I would also add to that: WE ARE ALL PART OF THE DIVINE. THE HOLY SPIRIT IS WITHIN.