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Montana To Use Unmanned Drones Against Wolves

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posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:09 PM
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In early November, Sen. Max Baucus, a Montana Democrat, made his own political contribution. Thrilled at the testing of a drone aircraft manufactured in Montana, Baucus declared: "Our troops rely on this type of technology every day, and there is an enormous future potential in border security, agriculture and wildlife and predator management." A manufacturer's representative claimed his company's drone "can tell the difference between a wolf and a coyote." Pilotless drone aircraft used by the CIA and the Air Force to target and kill alleged terrorists now appear to be real options to track and kill "enemy" wolves.



How far we have fallen since the mid-1990s, when we celebrated the wolves' reintroduction. During the 2008 presidential election, candidate Barack Obama declared: "Federal policy toward animals should respect the dignity of animals and their rightful place as cohabitants of the environment. We should strive to protect animals and their habitats and prevent animal cruelty, exploitation and neglect."




We're altering the genetics of way too many organisms on this planet, releasing genetically modified mosquito's into the public, and now, coming to a wildlife reserve near you, destroying "predators" with drones.


I don't know about anyone else, but this leaves a sick feeling in my stomach. Our ability to kill is now so cold and calculating, that we exterminate via artificial intelligence---not just our enemies, but creatures we declare to be vermin.

How can we ensure this would be a humane death for the animal, and is this really nessasary?

It's clearly all about profit. Our country is legally bound to put profit over people (and innocent animals, obviously), and we're getting damned efficient at doing it now.


Source
edit on 1-1-2012 by v1rtu0s0 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:13 PM
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reply to post by v1rtu0s0
 


They need to leave the wolves alone theyre going extinct. There used to be lots of wolves in the U.S. but theyre mostly all gone now. Such a shame to what we have done to God's creation.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by v1rtu0s0
 


They need to leave the wolves alone theyre going extinct. There used to be lots of wolves in the U.S. but theyre mostly all gone now. Such a shame to what we have done to God's creation.



The fact that we have people like Sen. Max Baucus running our country shows why it's in a downward spiral. He wants unmanned drones to shoot wolves...Obviously they shouldn't be shooting them in the first place, but he has the audacity to suggest such a method of extermination--this suggests to me that people evil as #.
edit on 1-1-2012 by v1rtu0s0 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:22 PM
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Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by v1rtu0s0
 


They need to leave the wolves alone theyre going extinct. There used to be lots of wolves in the U.S. but theyre mostly all gone now. Such a shame to what we have done to God's creation.


Going extinct?

YOu have no idea what you are talking about.....

I spent 10 years in Idaho, and i can tell you the wolves in the north are NOT going extinct, infact they are growing so wildy out of of control, because of reintroduction.......that they are abandoning their natural instincts..

In the name of "preservation" species of wolves were introduced into Montana and Idaho that were not indigenous to the area, and their populations have become so bad, that they are decimating local wildlife.....

Large game herds are being wiped out throughout the area because of the boom in wolf numbers....

These packs have gone from hunting for food, to hunting and killing and not even eating the prey that they have taken down...they just leave the carcass there........Killing for sport is not natural wolf behavior

People need to do some research in whats going on up there before they start spouting off like they know whats up..

In the short amount of time i was in the area, we went from wolves only being in the panhandle and rarely seen, to the damn things being seen way down in the foothills above Boise, and in numbers........

Were talking wolves that are NOT indigenous to the area, NOT the species that originated in the pacific northwest....

Thats why you can get a hunting license for them now, they are growing out of control

Im all for nature, im all for preservation.........but im NOT for this
edit on 1-1-2012 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-1-2012 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:26 PM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


It's sad that the only way to fix our mistakes is to kill everything. We screw up and hunt them to extinction, then we screw up again by failing to reintroduce them properly... Then our solution is to kill them with unmanned drones...

Yeah, sounds like we know what we're doing...



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:29 PM
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I have often read in the news about civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq being accidently targeted by these drones. Our government weighs its options, denial or apology, and goes about their business. What is going to happen when one of these drones accidently open fire on a herd of cattle or a shopping mall in Montana? I realize those in the know will tell us about safeguards and how it "can't happen". But it will. Give them time. I foresee our citizens declaring open season on these drones. Some hunters and collectors I know have some pretty wicked firepower available. When the wolves and Afghans are all gone, then what? Use the drones to control civil obedience?



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:36 PM
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They really need better target practice... Wolves?? Like I hope it's in places wolves are plentiful..

Here in Mid Eastern Wisc, Wolves have started coming around when they usually arnt here.. Probably running from everyone else but everyone here seems like their intruding and introducing a special wolf hunting season...


Poor wolves.



posted on Jan, 1 2012 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by v1rtu0s0
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


It's sad that the only way to fix our mistakes is to kill everything. We screw up and hunt them to extinction, then we screw up again by failing to reintroduce them properly... Then our solution is to kill them with unmanned drones...

Yeah, sounds like we know what we're doing...


I agree, that there should be better solutions..........no arguments there......

My only beef is when people dont think of the other reprocussions, or become involved w out knowing facts...

I agree its sad that the indigenous species were wiped out......

But if something isnt done, these newly introduced species could wipe out other indigenous forms of animals...

Wiping out the wolves isnt the answer, but i understand reducing numbers to where the impact they have on animals native to the areas they hunt in is minimal



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 12:22 AM
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Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by v1rtu0s0
 


They need to leave the wolves alone theyre going extinct. There used to be lots of wolves in the U.S. but theyre mostly all gone now. Such a shame to what we have done to God's creation.


Going extinct?

YOu have no idea what you are talking about.....

I spent 10 years in Idaho, and i can tell you the wolves in the north are NOT going extinct, infact they are growing so wildy out of of control, because of reintroduction.......that they are abandoning their natural instincts..

In the name of "preservation" species of wolves were introduced into Montana and Idaho that were not indigenous to the area, and their populations have become so bad, that they are decimating local wildlife.....

Large game herds are being wiped out throughout the area because of the boom in wolf numbers....

These packs have gone from hunting for food, to hunting and killing and not even eating the prey that they have taken down...they just leave the carcass there........Killing for sport is not natural wolf behavior

People need to do some research in whats going on up there before they start spouting off like they know whats up..

In the short amount of time i was in the area, we went from wolves only being in the panhandle and rarely seen, to the damn things being seen way down in the foothills above Boise, and in numbers........

Were talking wolves that are NOT indigenous to the area, NOT the species that originated in the pacific northwest....

Thats why you can get a hunting license for them now, they are growing out of control

Im all for nature, im all for preservation.........but im NOT for this
edit on 1-1-2012 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-1-2012 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)


Yeah i do know what i'm tlaking about. I live in arkansas and there hasn't been any wolves in this state since they were all killed off in the late 1800's. All the southern states are like this.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 12:28 AM
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reply to post by lonewolf19792000
 


Arkansas is not Idaho and Montana nor the Pacific northwest........so no its not the same.....

And its apparent that not all states are like this or there wouldnt be wolves to hunt there at all now would there?

Thats saying because one state has one sort of animal that another doesnt, that its the same across the board........

I dont see how you can even consider that a valid argument, this has nothing to do with southern states

You dont solve the problem by introducing non indigenous species into areas they shouldnt be........

Like i said, then you threaten to wipeout other species that are native to the area

Just because you think wolves are beautiful and majestic (which they are) doesnt make it any less wrong
edit on 2-1-2012 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 12:31 AM
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Makes my blood boil if we didn't start screwing around with the populations in the first place none of this would be needed it's called Cause and Effect. We hunt larger animals therefore less of a chance the wolves are killed hunting larger prey as well. Leave nature to it's self there's a reason nature can outlive us we need it it doesn't need us.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 12:51 AM
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predator management


Its ironic, someone claiming the need to manage predators, whose a part of the most predatory species on the planet by an extreme longshot, and the only animal that kills for pleasure under the euphemism of "sport".

Humans need some "predator management" of their own, honestly.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:00 AM
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reply to post by CaticusMaximus
 


You apparently didnt read my post where I stated the strange behavior of these not native wolves, Killing and leaving their prey lay, without eating it.....

Killing for sport............

But then again, i suppose no one is going to listen to anyone who knows whats going on up there, or might have a different point of view other then "coddle, the cuddly wolves"

I think conservation is great, I think protecting species is a must, however im not blind to common sense and real problems either



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:09 AM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


Do you have links to studies on this phenomena?



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:18 AM
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There's other problems but for now let's just consider the cost :

- Predator drone : $3-10 million each.
- Hellfire missile : $68 000
- Cost of training pilots
- Cost of UAV maintenance
- Cost of accidents (forest fires for example)

Total cost for every wolf killed : probably in the $100 000 range.

Hell for that price, pay people a bounty of $100 for every wolf killed and you'll save $99 900 every time.
edit on 2-1-2012 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:18 AM
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reply to post by CaticusMaximus
 


Wolves kililng for fun in Cali

Wolves in idaho doing the same

Reports again in Dillon

They are doing this all across the Pacific northwest, these wolves are getting out of hand and killing off local big game and livestock, and not eating them just letting them lay...

Im sure im going to get some excuse , or circumventing my sources but thats ok......

ive seen the havok these huge packs of non indigenous wolves , have caused on big game in these states, because i use to be an avid hunter up there........

Ive also been witness to the uneaten carcasses just left behind .......



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:20 AM
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Originally posted by Vitchilo
So let's consider two things :

- The cost :
- Predator drone : 3$-10$ million each.
- Hellfire missile : 68 000$
- Cost of training pilots
- Cost of UAV maintenance
- Cost of accidents (forest fires for example)

- The unconstitutionality of it.

This is just an HORRIBLE plan.


.........whats unconstitutional about it again?

No one said they were using missles to kil these wolves.......nor predator drones........there are a plethora of other type of drones.........come on man.........lets use some common sense here



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:22 AM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


Thank you for the information. A strange phenomena.

I still find it ironic though the talk of "predator management" coming from a species who is in general hyper predatory itself.
edit on 1/2/2012 by CaticusMaximus because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:24 AM
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Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by CaticusMaximus
 


You apparently didnt read my post where I stated the strange behavior of these not native wolves, Killing and leaving their prey lay, without eating it.....

Killing for sport............

But then again, i suppose no one is going to listen to anyone who knows whats going on up there, or might have a different point of view other then "coddle, the cuddly wolves"

I think conservation is great, I think protecting species is a must, however im not blind to common sense and real problems either

Indeed these wolves are not native to Idaho.


The Canadian Gray Wolf was introduced as a “nonessential experimental” species as defined by the Endangered Species Act. The ESA only allows the introduction of an “experimental species” when the original native species is extinct. But the Idaho Timberwolf was not extinct; we had about 80 of them. These Timberwolves were documented by recognized experts. No problem for the federal government, they just solved that dilemma by lying. Consequently, the introduction of the Canadian Gray Wolf into Idaho was based on fraud. source


The introduced wolves to the area really spread into ID. Fall/winter 2009 they killed a lot of our local animals and not even for food. Carcasses were just left in farm fields after the wolves had their way with them(possibly training pups, & and for sport/fun). The beautiful moose calf-who of course you don't get to close to for safety reasons but we allowed them to visit the land for grazing, numerous elk that frequented our farm and area, were killed. The wolves had come onto the property scaring 3 of our dogs as well as us.

edit on 2-1-2012 by dreamingawake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 01:25 AM
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Originally posted by CaticusMaximus
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


Thank you for the information.


anytime my friend..........always happy to provide what I can..

Like I said , Im all about conservation and taking care of our planets animals...

but i think we do have to use judgement as well, we cant just let our emotions rule what we do........same in reverse I suppose......

Its like Texas, lol non feral hogs are slaughtered wholsale down there and you never see anyone raising cain about it.......

But they arent as majestic as wolves are either......

Makes you question peoples motives really



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