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Roll over Einstein: Pillar of physics challenged

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posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:13 PM

Originally posted by playswithmachines
reply to post by buddhasystem

Sorry, i will explain, mass & energy are mutually interchangeable, and are doing so all the time billions of times a second. This appears to be mediated by a vortex or spiral movement, i say appears, i haven't read everything.

This is a bunch of pseudo-scientific garbage. Sorry. Not an iota of sense in what you said.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:13 PM

Originally posted by humphreysjim
Everyone is jumping the gun. This has not been confirmed, logic dictates this will be proven false in time, until then, speculation is pointless as we are speculating over something that is, most likely, false.

Got to love the skeptics. Always looking at the negative.
edit on 23-9-2011 by arbelisk because: (no reason given)

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:18 PM
reply to post by buddhasystem

Since you are not reading my posts, i dare to quote myself;

While we're on this subject;

"Thus two like charged particles with precisely antiparallel spin ought to run right through each other when they meet, with no interaction at all, electrical or otherwise, in complete contradiction to conventional collision theory and conventional electrical theory which states that like charges repel one another. Such an experiment has been done, at Argonne National Laboratory, with colliding protons. When the colliding protons have antiparallel spins, they do indeed pass right through one another. And there dies forever the old idea of concrete, solid, material reality. The experiment is not predictable or permitted by present electromagnetic theory or conceptual models of the proton and proton interaction."

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:19 PM
Its amazing how many people on here are smarter than Einstein

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:21 PM
I don't "do" pseudoscience, i do real observable, rational science.
I was pointing out these errors in EM and QM 30 years ago.
So now tell me i'm wrong

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:23 PM

The scientists are playing intellectual games with one another so as to have a bit of a joke on their less intelligent members. It did not take me long to realise that the answer is very simple really. The solution is as follows. The Photons are not travelling in a directly straight line, because they have to negotiate the curvature of the Earths surface. However, by their very nature the Neutrinos are able to go directly in a straight line through the Earth. Neutrinos are often called "Ghost Particles" because they are able to travel through the Earth as if it were non existent. Obviously the Photons in the experiment do not possess this almost supernatural advantage. Because of this the distance that the Neutrinos travel is slightly shorter than is the distance that the Photons have to travel. Thus the Neutrinos are able to arrive a split second sooner than do the Photons. Both are travelling at the speed of light. There is no contradiction. Sorry that I am such a boring clever dick. Sorry to spoil the fun. However the truth is always quite simple. Please do not feel offended. I am certainly not out to insult anyones intelligence.

edit on 23/9/2011 by CAELENIUM because: (no reason given)

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:24 PM
Here's a link to the OPERA group's just released paper if anyone wants to examine their methodology. Warning: It's written by physicists for physicists not for laymen. Some of it might still make sense to an educated layman:

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:28 PM
reply to post by CAELENIUM

If they measured it with lasers,or radio, then it's a dead givaway really.
They should have used 2 synchronised atomic clocks.
Very silly of them

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:37 PM
This has to be one of the best threads i've had the pleasure of reading through since I joined ATS (and before, when i was a lurker.).
I've learned quite a bit just reading through the responses to the OP and give everyone a pat on the back for their work both questioning and explaining the science involved. Thank you, everyone, for your input.
This is why I love ATS. Sure, I get a kick out of the conspiracy stuff but threads like this actually make me think and teach me something.
If you want an example of the power of ATS and it's users, here it is.
Starred, Flagged and appreciated.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:43 PM

Originally posted by playswithmachines
reply to post by BlackSatinDancer

That's my point, your first assumtion that gravity may have a reverse side or that the mass in the middle is being attracted to the mass outside because there is nothing in the middle to cling to, sounds ok
Plausible, but most theories tend towards there being a huge black hole in the center.
This is most definitely a humungous source of energy....
Anything's possible.

well, all i tend to notice... in just about everything, is duality and how things are smaller or bigger or more complex versions of other things... of coarse with variations and what not further contributing to the confusion, but so far we seem to not be able to find the exact center... plus gravity itself is kind of weird and complicated and from what I gather, poorly understood considering the fact that it's discovery happened a long time before any significant modern day discoveries that are much better understood.

There must be some very large scale of gravity.. somehow. I certainly wouldn't know because I haven't thought about that particularly much less studied but it sure seems suspect.. when things seemed to be scaled the way they are. I mean what is the largest gravity scale we can actually look at and calculate... the galactic level I guess? on a universal level i guess it just opens the possibilities for all sorts of things.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:43 PM
reply to post by CasiusIgnoranze

Entanglement is not travel. It's a poorly understood quantum effect. FTL travel has not been proven here. This needs way more confirmation and additional FTL events.

And not to burst any bubbles but going from quantum to macro sized objects if this proves to be correct is a looooong shot. Much the same as quantum teleportation. strange quantum effects often appear to vanish at the macro scale.

So far the only observation of a quantum effect on the macro scale was observed here...

Still looking for the article

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:45 PM
reply to post by KJV1611

you get a star for the TMNT reference. I wondered who would be first. Love it.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:46 PM
reply to post by dragonseeker

I was thinking along similar lines too.

The events of the 14th, rumours of returning Extraterrestrial (or Extradimensional) 'gods' coinciding with the Christian 'rapture' (amazing coincidence don't ya think! :@@
, Earth / Solar system changes, Curious and huge anomalous spherical objects apparently in close orbit around Sol, 'the ringbuilders of Saturn, talk of dwarf stars, comets (or not comets, whichever the case may ultimately be), loads of exoplanets being discovered, some in the 'GZ'...the list is getting larger and weirder as the year progresses.

Disclosure may not be an open mike, scripted, one off spectacle sort of event after all...we may be witnessing it in a way now.

Where we all may have thought our respective heads of government would break into regular TV or radio programmes to make 'an historic announcement regarding ET's', and make a disclosure this way, it might not happen like that at all...first the underpinning science behind ET's and their technology may be sporadically revealed, through what may become an accelerating process of 'new scientific discoveries', contradicting or disproving (or significantly amending) long maintained theories, as a conditioning tool for humanity (as if we needed it anyway!).

If we were at neolithic levels of technology, and we met ourselves as we are today, we would certainly have worshipped our future selves as gods, we would be in fear and absolutely awestruck at what we would witness from a technological point of view. If during the Neolithic, we were given time to understand levels of technology similar to our own today and know it for what it was, we wouldn't be in awe or in fear of 'the gods'.

Perhaps this is the form disclosure will take...take the magic and mystique away from the gods, and only then reveal the ordinary man behind the curtain as an equal and a teacher, not as a god to be worshipped or an entity to be feared.

If this is what's happening, i don't think it's our governmental heads making the decision, i think they have dithered and procrastinated too long and lost the right to 'do it their way', i think the choice is being made for them..the sooner the better as far as i'm concerned.

I have a sneaking suspicion we are going to be seeing more apparent 'impossibilities' becoming realities very soon..

Today, it's a sub-atomic particle with mass (however small), travelling faster (however slightly) than a massless photon, which has always been held to be impossible by conventional theory.

What will it be tomorrow i wonder?

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:46 PM
reply to post by CAELENIUM

They did use synchronised Caesium 133 clocks, and i imagine they took the curvature into consideration.
So the measurements could still be correct.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 02:56 PM

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

Originally posted by gimme_some_truth

The idea in the theory of relativity is that nothing can go faster than the speed of light because as any object accelerates, it gains mass. So the faster it goes, the bigger it gets, and the bigger it gets, the more energy is required for it to continue accelerating...

To me the theory of relativity sounds like utter non-sense. When you accelerate your car down the highway does your car get bigger, smaller or remain the same? I know my car stays the same!

Sometimes people need to think things out better. It makes little difference if we are talking about cars, shuttles or super-dooper space ships. If the space shuttle going to the moon acclerated to twice the speed it originally went, would it get bigger in volume or mass? I think not!!

Just because I have a bachelors degree in computer science and someone has a doctorate degree in astrophysics does not mean they have good intentions and I am too stupid to understand anything. Geez.

no pun intended but it's all relative. a car going 60 mph down the hwy is NOTHING compared to a particle traveling at or near the speed of light.
Your entire premise is faulty. I'm sure i'm not the first to point this out since this post was on page 5 of 17 but your comparison is just...meh.
I don't know why yoou got so defensive at the end there. I hadn't seen anyone calling you stupid.
Hell, I barely have a highschool education and never made it past algebra I. A piece of paper does not a thinker make.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 03:02 PM
reply to post by constantwonder

Entanglement may not be travel, but it's theorised that the phenomena can be exploited to enable travel..different things yes, but as a means to an end, entanglement may actually turn out to be rather handy for travel, or at least, instant communications or data transmission and reception over vast distances....even interstellar distances.

It's been noted too that entanglement may also have applications in regards to dimensional travel or time travel to you and me. The idea is that entanglement may span not just distance, but also the 4th dimension.

It may be possible one day to have a live audio conversation with someone or interact with computer data, from the past.

Neutrinos may actually turn out to be the cosmological equivalent of our cellular stem cells.

They have the ability to be any one of three different six different types of neutrino (including the 3 anti varieties), and may be able to switch back and forth between the types.

We're on the verge of a dawn of scientific understanding, finally starting to glimpse what may be on the horizon for us. Dogma and negative thinking has held us back for far too long, thankfully it looks like that is changing at last.

Anything is, and will be possible.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 03:04 PM

Originally posted by robomont
reply to post by nenothtu

your car is a farraday cage,so you are protected as long as you dont stick your body parts outside.when the craft/car is turned off you would then have to wait for the radiation to subside.thats why the car/crafts outer skin needs to be aluminum.aluminum has a very short half life compared to steel.thats why occupants of ufos rarely leave their craft and people should not walk up and touch one.when its on or off.

Kind of a big leap there, wouldn't you say?

thats why occupants os ufos rarely leave their craft and people should not walk up and touch one when its on or off.

When did we find out, exactly, what alien craft are made of and how they work... not to mention the motivations of said aliens?
Though I see your point, I guess.
I don't plan on walking up to a foo fighter and high fiving it unless it's Dave Grohl.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 03:08 PM
Quantum entanglement is just using an unknown interaction force that is propagating FTL.
That's all.

posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 03:10 PM

Originally posted by mnemeth1
Would you care to explain why dark matter and dark energy were dreamed up for us?


Dark matter's effects have been observed over and over. It's not just that galaxies spin too fast, you know.


posted on Sep, 23 2011 @ 03:18 PM

Originally posted by spikey
reply to post by constantwonder

Entanglement may not be travel, but it's theorised that the phenomena can be exploited to enable travel..different things yes, but as a means to an end, entanglement may actually turn out to be rather handy for travel, or at least, instant communications or data transmission and reception over vast distances....even interstellar distances.

Problem is, nothing beyond random noise can be "sent" via entanglement, so you can give that one up.


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