Through the eyes of Atheism

I just think it's important to know, what we're looking at, if atheism is correct ? If I look at the world through the eyes of atheism ? Doesn't man suddenly become far less, than what he has over millennia, come to believe himself to be ? Atheism says, there is nothing spiritual about existence and that man does not have a soul.
That anything paranormal is all BS and this mundane existance, has come about for however long. So life is simply a space between two nothings.
Basically, it seems as though atheism, takes the rules of empirical science to far and applies them to life.
Science being the study of observable phenomena.
Atheism dosn't believe anything out of the ordinary ever does or ever has happened. But isn't it out of the ordinary, for mankind to have come into this existence, and make up
a whole part of himself that says the exact opposite? If mankind only evolved some how ? Why would he evolve
with a belief in deitys ?

Atheism limits this existance to things it finds rational. But is that even rational ?

Mods, it seeems I can never get in the right forum, so put this puppy somewhere ? Or leave it right here ?

Originally posted by randyvs
If I look at the world through the eyes of atheism ? Doesn't man suddenly become far less...

You're not the first to ponder this question.
Since it ends up being personal opinion about how you feel about that situation I wont give an answer, but I will say that you're coming rather close to the old fallacy of "I dont like it, so it cant be true."

Atheism is a personal belief. Theism is a personal belief. Is one correct and not the other? The fact is, nobody can prove either. That is why I consider myself Agnostic. I think the majority of people on either side do suffer from a limited point of view, which is only taking into account our lonely blue planet. I believe the majority of religions are based upon the unknown. We need to make sense of the unknown and therefore make up theories that attempt to explain it. It doesn't necessarily make it right or wrong though.

If you taken Christianity for example, and how God made us in his image, and also the fact the universe is of unimaginable size, then either there is no other life out there (which would suck IMO) or all other species look just like us (which I doubt). Things such as this makes me lean towards atheism.

On the other hand, I still have not made sense of how exactly life began. Did it simply spontaneously begin? If so can it happen on other worlds? Or did it all come from some common place? If so then how did it come about? Maybe it is possible that a deity of some sort did begin life. Things like this makes me lean towards theism.

I don't push my beliefs on others and really dislike anyone doing the same to me. For all those who firmly believe in either side, please see my signature. Two cents cashed in.

Originally posted by randyvs
If I look at the world through the eyes of atheism ?

Atheism says.......

Atheism says nothing. Atheism is not a controlled group belief.

Atheism is not a religion.

Every individual sees through their own eyes. Everyone has a different perspective on all things. That perspective is derived from the life they have lived up to that point. Obviously, due to that, those who follow any individual religion, will share many common views, and have many similar perspectives.


There are no guidelines or detailed instructions, that state how someone does not believe.

Atheism is not a religion.

Originally posted by fenceSitter

Atheism is a personal belief.

False.

Correct term = Disbelief

Originally posted by randyvs
I just think it's important to know, what we're looking at, if atheism is correct ?
If I look at the world through the eyes of atheism ? Doesn't man suddenly become far less, than what he has over millennia, come to believe himself to be ? Atheism says, there is nothing spiritual about existence and that man does not have a soul.

No, atheism is simply the rejection of the claim that deities exist. Technically an atheist could still believe in spirits and souls.

That anything paranormal is all BS and this mundane existance, has come about for however long. So life is simply a space between two nothings.

Some atheists also have beliefs in the "paranormal ". I have never known an atheist to look at his/her existence as mundane, nor referred to life as a "space between nothings".

Basically, it seems as though atheism, takes the rules of empirical science to far and applies them to life.
Science being the study of observable phenomena.

Science has only helped atheists understand that many religious claims about the world and universe turned out to be incorrect.

Atheism dosn't believe anything out of the ordinary ever does or ever has happened.

Also not true.

But isn't it out of the ordinary, for mankind to have come into this existence, and make up
a whole part of himself that says the exact opposite? If mankind only evolved some how ? Why would he evolve
with a belief in deitys ?

"Breaking The Spell" by Daniel Dennett addresses this question beautifully

Atheism limits this existance to things it finds rational. But is that even rational ?

There are plenty of irrational atheists. Raelians are a sect of atheists with irrational beliefs.


I know atheism seems foreign, almost like conspiracy theory, to a theist's mind. That really it provides so little of the answers that religions so often provide. But atheism isn't a religion in any way. In fact it's most often the unavoidable result of intellectual honesty. It's recognizing that there's no tangible evidence pointing to the existence of deities nor the claims about that which they are alleged to have done. It's the practice of recognizing that "I don't know" is a better response than explaining the unknown by invoking deities.

reply to post by randyvs


You cannot get something from absolutely nothing, that would violate the laws of physics.

Eyes, what eyes? The atheist is blind to the miracle that is life itself, and to his own life experience, since the human being is just a "thing", and free will, the soul etc. - not real. But how can "life" - be dead?

I don't understand them or their reasoning.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
Eyes, what eyes? The atheist is blind to the miracle that is life itself, and to his own life experience, since the human being is just a "thing", and free will, the soul etc. - not real.

Incorrect in every way. Atheism is simply the rejection of the claim that deities exist. Once you read more into it than that you are simply presenting a straw man argument.

I don't understand them or their reasoning.

That could be because you have a misunderstanding about what atheism is.

reply to post by NewAgeMan

You cannot get something from absolutely nothing, that would violate the laws of physics.

May I ask which law of physics it violates?

Art.
The precision of Vermeer for his time I love, just absolutely adore his capture of light, Durer's prints many of which are dark and full of allegory. Rembrant's ruddiness an obvious imbiber of life, Turner's seminal impressionistic swirls of light energy and movement and the French Impressinist's school taking it further breaking the spectrum itself down.
Picasso et al who then went further and broke form and perceptions of reality down, Mondrial rigid formality challenging your view of form and colour. Kandinsky and others with the frightening view of the wretched state of humanity as it crawled towards the two most awful wars the World has known.
Music.
Where to start as much like all art forms one can pick from a giant smorgasbord of delights to transport and transcend. From the haunting Air on a G string or Brahm's lullaby through to Beethoven's majestic orchestral power, all have the power to move and sing eloquently of the power of the human spirit. Transcendental, this is the hint in your op.
Through to the pop music of today, if we cherry pick as history will do we find in rock and roll much of that spirit to elevate to seek the noble and the worthy.
Literature
This is how we have explained and examined ourselves more than other way in the past few hundred years. In fact if you consider the oral tradition unwritten Literature then this has always been a major part of our narrative since the dawn of time. Bards, poets, songmeisters the writers of sagas and epics, fact writers, fiction writers giving us a wealth of culture and opinion that some would seek to narrow down if not ban altogether.
How many works give us this transendence that certain people claim can only come from one thing. Too many for a short answer so I will just include one that moves me and speaks volumes whilst you're waving the military and religous flags ( again and always at the same time ), Wilfred Owen who served in the trenches WWI.

DULCE ET DECORUM EST
Bent double, like old beggars under sacks
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots Of tired, outstripped Five-Nines that dropped behind.
Gas! Gas! Quick, boys! – An ecstasy of fumbling,
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling,
And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime . . .
Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.
If in some smothering dreams you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie; Dulce et Decorum est
Pro patria mori.

Wilfred Owen 8 October 1917 - March, 1918

*Dulce et Decorum est Pro patria mori- It is sweet and right to die for one's country.

Which personally moves me much like your descriptions of an epiphany, and I'm an Atheist.
Science
Can science move us in this ethereal way you suggest is only the provence of religion. Well listen to Carl Sagan or any other true scientist tell you about the size and complexity of the Universe and without anthropomorphising it gaze with wonder. Remember chasing ants with a magnifying glass or your first look through a microscope. Wonderous of and in itself.
What was it like for society when the scientists discovered virus and bacteria as causes for diseases not a curse from some callous deity, must have been quite liberating. Transcendental again may one venture.

Then there are the elements of one's own life. I have two children and the first time they were put in my arms was something you never forget, watching them grow and discover.
I've also fallen in and out of love and still that first moment empathy or desire occurs are other magical transcendant and may I say soulful moments.
Atheists can have a soul but the Theist soul always belongs to somebody else.

reply to post by NewAgeMan

I don't understand them or their reasoning.

I don't understand religious folk, what with all the science and logic we now have available to us, people can still believe what is written in their guide books.

reply to post by BrokenCircles


Atheists do not lack a belief. They believe there is no god.

You must be thinking of agnostics.

If you truly would like to understand what "though the eyes of atheism" means, Robert Ingersoll states something very eloquent:

"When I became convinced that the universe is natural, that all the ghosts and gods are myths, there entered into my brain, into my soul, into every drop of my blood the sense, the feeling, the joy of freedom. The walls of my prison crumbled and fell. The dungeon was flooded with light and all the bolts and bars and manacles became dust. I was no longer a servant, a serf, or a slave. There was for me no master in all the wide world, not even in infinite space. I was free — free to think, to express my thoughts — free to live my own ideal, free to live for myself and those I loved, free to use all my faculties, all my senses, free to spread imagination's wings, free to investigate, to guess and dream and hope, free to judge and determine for myself. . . I was free!"

I find this to be a common experience for many modern atheists.

reply to post by randyvs


i am an atheist and your discription of an atheist is so far off the mark its frightening .
i believe in the spirit , the soul and reincarnation .
i don,t believe in an omnipresent all seeing all knowing god .
i believe in mother earth , the universe and all that comes with it .
if you are a true christian and you believe in your bible , then i will remind you of what jesus said ,
don,t look for me in houses of brick or of stone , pick up a rock or stone and you will see me , pick up a piece of wood and you will find me ( ok maybe not the exact wording but you get the drift ) he was talking a bout the planet earth and mother nature. i believe we , mankind together with the earth and the universe are god. what you call god is a collective energy of all these things , an intelligent energy .

Originally posted by Bleeeeep
Atheists do not lack a belief. They believe there is no god.

You must be thinking of agnostics.

Wrong.
Believing there is no god is different than disbelieving in gods.

Originally posted by tom.farnhill
reply to post by randyvs

 

i am an atheist

i believe we , mankind together with the earth and the universe are god.

It sure doesn't sound like you are an atheist at all.
...

reply to post by randyvs



I think agnosticism and theism are the only proper thought patterns.

I think science corrupts the minds of atheist because science often only gives one solution for a problem. It is like stating 2 + 2 = 4, while ignoring there is unlimited ways to get 4 as an answer. For this reason, I think atheism is idiotic.

reply to post by goldentorch

Can science move us in this ethereal way you suggest is only the provence of religion. Well listen to Carl Sagan or any other true scientist tell you about the size and complexity of the Universe and without anthropomorphising it gaze with wonder.

I like what Abraham Lincoln said also.
" I can look around at this world and see how someone could claim, there is no God. What I can not fathom, is how someone can look up into the universe and make the same claim ".

Drummer

It dosn't sound like your all that much an athiest right now either ?

No, atheism is simply the rejection of the claim that deities exist. Technically an atheist could still believe in spirits and souls.

Originally posted by Bleeeeep
Atheists do not lack a belief. They believe there is no god.

You must be thinking of agnostics.

I don't believe that.

Originally posted by BrokenCircles

Originally posted by fenceSitter

Atheism is a personal belief.

False.

Correct term = Disbelief

Your just playing semantics. Trying too hard to prove your point? Whether you say 'I believe there are no deities' or 'I don't believe in deities' really doesn't matter.