The U.S. Military's Plan for London-Like Riots

if you know anyone in the national guard ask them what their summer training drills have been last few years
here they are being trained on rounding up citizens and securing them at the airport
trained to secure airport perimeter
international airports land mass wise will hold most of any major city
so yes it is already in the plan and drill stage

reply to post by RUNSILENT


I'm currently in the guard and our summer drill was no such thing.

The only thing domestically we have been prepping for is hurricane season and thats it.

reply to post by MikeboydUS


my nephew last two years drill was such any emergency , the protocols to round citizens to airport
and how to secure such
he has been in the guard for quite awhile since coming back from korea and leaving the army

London-like raids would never happen in the US. Reason? Conceal and Carry.

People are a lot less motivated to bash a window in if there might be someone with a shotgun sitting behind it.

reply to post by ddaniel


The flip side also applies - perhaps people might be less inclined to sit behind their shopfront...alone.....facing a mob who might also be carrying!

and of course it HAS happened in the USA within my meory at least - LA riots 1992 after the Rodney King verdict - and there were armed shopkeepers and armed looters, and the Police did abandon areas, and the troops were called in!

civilian guns don't stop such behaviour - they just make it more dangerous for everyone!

reply to post by MikeboydUS


Thank you.
By no means am I saying that the crumbling economy and other factors may not lead to civil unrest and a reaction from the government, likely involving the NG. However, it is obvious folks on here need to do some easy Google/Internets searching and learn some basics about the US military and the National Guard.

1) Posse Comitatus is NOT in the Constitution. It was a law passed after Reconstruction(1870s) bc of the problems wrought by a harsh martial law which governed the former Confederate states for up to 12 years. It was effectively ended by George W Bush in 2006. Another misconception: There was NEVER any declaration of, or practice of, martial law in New Orleans after Katrina. There was bickering between Bush and the weak governor of LA but, ultimately the normal SOP remained and the Governor remained in charge of the Guard. The regular army presence was largely for media purposes. They had no power. The Louisiana National Guard, with the backup support of many other states' units, was in charge of the military situation there.

2)The National Guard's legacy comes from state and local militias. In 1903, the first steps were taken to bring uniform standard and some centralization to the state militias. It was further cemented by the World Wars and Guardsmen served valiantly in both.

3) The NG is made up of your neighbors. Your grocery clerk, your banker, your bartender, your neighborhood cop, the small business owner down the street, etc.

4) They have a multilayered mission. Sure, guard units deploy overseas under federal authority, but they also have local duties. If a natural or manmade disaster happens in your area, the most important first responders are the nearest Guard unit. They are trained to perform search and rescue, evacuation support, engineering support, and yes, law enforcement support. They generally reinforce local and state authorities, and in these local/state emergency situations, they are, by law, under the authority of the state Governor. Do you think Rick Perry, Bobby Jindal, or Haley Barbour would give up their power to Obama?

If riots and civil unrest happen, the NG will be involved, but as members of the community they are less likely to "unleash" on their friends, family, and fellow local citizens.

And Obama can federalize the Guard. I just don't see it happening that easily.

And I know what happened at Kent State, but if you look at the hundreds of NG state deployments that happened nationwide in the 60s during that decade's unrest, only one shooting incident is actually impressive and tends to reinforce the notion that a Guard unit is unlikely to attack its own community.

If I was the government and I wanted to prevent people from looting stores and destroying government property, I'd get the military involved too.

Moral of the story, if you want to rebel, do it wisely...don't give them an excuse to beat your ass silly and when they do, they look bad.

During Hurricane Andrew we had live ammunition, even though The Miami Herald reported otherwise, and many of the guys had sidearms (concealed). I was the designated marksman for my unit, sitting in the turret of a Hummer. At one point I had to draw a bead on a rowdy, and I probably would have fired if it came to that. My fellow guardsmens' lives depended on it. Of course we were in Liberty City, which is the roughest area in Miami, and each morning our task was to control around 5,000 people standing in line at a food stamp office. The Jamaican gang (whatever their name is) was reportedly watching at distance. Armored Trucks brought cash and food stamps in constantly, and our job was to prevent the hijacking of these trucks as well.
You have to remember that during the riots earlier that year they were setting fires and shooting the firemen as they rode up to put out the fires. It was a very, very serious situation.
I'm grateful to God that I didn't have to fire, but it was only because of the confidence in the soldier handling the situation. He was one of our best, and he struck the rowdy several times in the chest with his rifle to push him back. The guy left crying, and the incident was over.
Don't second guess what these guys will do, because their lives are at stake as well, and their training takes over...

I think there should be VERY clear consequences put into place ahead of time, so that rioters KNOW what can happen to them when and if it does, and then the military and government WON'T look bad, the rioters will.

ie. Rioting = we can shoot you with real bullets, anywhere on your body we feel like. Thus, if you riot, you're the one who looks dumb. Not us.

Call it.... population control, if you will. Some hotheads and irrational folks will get weeded out by their own volition.

Cheers.

reply to post by visualmiscreant


i know u are so rite those that think that the NG will not shoot will b sadly mistaken !

As a uniform member of the military, I will offer up my perspective of this:

You expect something different?

I am not, in the slightest, a proponent of 'big government' - and am not at all of the opinion that the people in Washington know their head from their ass. However, when there are people rioting in streets, destroying the property of other people, and generally disrupting society... what kind of -Service- member does nothing about it?

Riots are unjustifiable. There is no excuse for you to storm through the streets as a mob and do whatever the hell you feel like doing as part of some delusional concept of freedom. You don't have the right or freedom to tear other people's # up. A functional society doesn't behave that way.

If you all want to express your dissent with the way the federal government is behaving - do so in an orderly and civil manner. You can do that, and be effective, without setting any random crap on fire. If you all start that - you have no place being in a society I want to be a part of, and will be removed.

reply to post by silent thunder


CONPLAN is mostly used for state emergencies, and sometimes Riots The general mission statement of Conplan is a reactionary force. ( National Guard Troops ) The commanders will take the orders from the Governor of the state . National Guard commanders will execute the orders of the Governor office of said state. The Governor is given consensus i.e. calls shots on the Conplan, If the Governor receives any suggestions by the Pentagon the Governor has the final say so and can deviate from the mission and exclude any recommendations. ( i.e. it's not written in stone.) Governors would only follow such suggestion by Washington if the event in question calls for activating the guard to a national level activation. ( requires the presidents signature ) I.e. the national guard status is changed to active Army troops.

National Journal's White House correspondent is pulling information from other places that has no relation to Conplan. The part where he mentions section K. ( indicators for potential violence) ( there is no section K in Conplan.) he pulled that from a NATO document. That mission is entirely different and for the active Army in a foreign country like Mogadishu, remember Black hawk down. Most of the stuff this corespondent is stating , is taken out of context or form other doctrine to sensationalize the article.

The section below is taken out of context. This type of situation would fall under the Governor. This is from a list, theres more to it though. Again nothing is set in stone as ConPlan is moslty a list of recommendations and guidelines.

CONPLAN 3502 is the U.S. military's plan for assisting state and local authorities in the event of a riot or major civil disturbance:

The map that is showing in the article if for a national activation of national guard troops in all states. The map changes quarterly and so do the units. Conplan is written as general guideline for mostly Governor to follow. There is nothing spelled out that troops do this and troops do that. ( it's a reactionary force ) The National Guard Commander of the State will give suggestions to the Governor of the state. The Governor has the finale say and issues the orders to the commanders. unless the mission requires a national activation; then the president directs the troops.

The term "Reactionary Force" covers everything from filling sandbags to riot control. ConPlan has never been implemented to an active status on a national scale. but has been for state emergencies. Yes, live ammunition is also covered in the Conplan, a good example is Katrina. There is also the ROE to follow if live ammunition is issued to the guard troops.

My source is experience.

That's good news.

The Rules of Engagement overseas are different from the Rules for the Use of Force domestically. NG are certainly allowed to fire on a civilian but only if said civilian is in an immediate act of using(or about to use) deadly force against him, his fellow soldiers, or other civilians. Firing on civilians who are otherwise breaking the law is against the rules (i.e. looting). That doesn;t mean they may not bust a couple heads trying to stop such activity, but you will not see a line of Guardsmen lighting up a bunch of civilians for breaking stuff.

NOPD and NG actually allowed civilians to enter drug stores and grocery stores in New Orleans and checked what they were taking as they were leaving to make sure it wasn't something non survival related. In other words, food and over the counter medicine were allowed to be taken. Hair care products and PS3's were not.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

en.wikipedia.org...

Militia members are citizen soldiers, meaning they work part time for the National Guard and hold a civilian job as well

Established under Title 10 and Title 32 of the U.S. Code, state National Guard serves as part of the first-line defense for the United States.[4] The state National Guard is divided into units stationed in each of the 50 states and US territories, and operates under their respective state governor or territorial adjutant general.[5] The National Guard may be called up for active duty by state governors or territorial adjutant general to help respond to domestic emergencies and disasters, such as hurricanes, floods, and earthquakes.[5]

That is the loophole, While you are correct in the detail of they are military controlled and a reserve military force, they are Technically a civilian militia, It takes congress or the president to mobilize the military while it only takes a governor of a state that has direct control over that states guard unit... further civilian control.

as was stated by another user The US. military is not to be used on the civilian populace. Originally posted by ziggy1706
ok, if its the military, isnt that illegal? posse commetatius...forbids miltary use against civilians. constitution says so.

So the "Civilian Militia" of the National Guard was made to circumvent that Constitutional amendment.

A Civilian Militia on paper but beholden to the Military in practice. Sucks right?

reply to post by Aim64C


i respect what u said . people need to realize every action has an equal n opposite reaction . it might take the NG to stop but it must b stopped ! sometimes doing the rite thang will not win friends but who would want friends of folks that r looting n rioting !

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


He was the nephew of a well known kingpin.

You should get your facts straight!

There is another case you may not be aware of, that we were briefed on before deployment. They don't normally advertise this because of the sensitive nature. In the State of Florida (that's all I know) you have the ability to shoot a known felon in the commission of a felony (subsequent). How you know if he is already a felon, I'm not sure. I certainly would not shoot another citizen in this situation, unless lives were at stake, and anyway these days, I myself am a convicted felon and can't possess a weapon or ammunition. Even though it's been eleven years since I was convicted, and it was for marijuana, I probably will never have my rights reinstated because the conviction came from the State of Alabama. Alabama will only reinstate your civil rights if the Governor himself pardons you, and it is extremely rare. As a word of caution to you smokers out there, passing a joint is a felony (furnishing marijuana) distribution. I found out the hard way...

Heyo guys, I will turn up to mention that I did the story which kind of teed up this news getting around There was info on globalsecurity.org but the USARNORTH presentation I found originally. Finally this story gets more exposure -- in the big picture it matters a lot that many people are now aware of what is developing and can seek & share more information aboot it!

I posted the story here originally in November, the thread is funny I'd say
www.abovetopsecret.com...