U.S. man operates on himself with butter knife

reply to post by Welshextremist


No, I don't blog. I may also be tired, but I don't understand the last sentence in your post

Originally posted by JennaDarling

If you had proper healthcare for all..

.. this would not need to happen.

Disgusting that a country cannot treat their own citizens and those in need.

I would hardly call that a civilized country.

You seem to be really misinformed and your arguments appear more political than factual.

I had a similar, but way more involved (colostomy reversal from a cancer *scare*) surgery at the exact same hospital (LAcoUSC) when I was 30.

A ventral hernia repair can be a very serious deal to perform, and requires an operating room.
While this guy got fed up waiting and got, lets say, creative, he still would have gotten the surgery he needed.

Sounds like he was more than a little nuts to boot.

In my case, I opted to wait and luckily, a world famous surgeon doing a 1 year internship ended up operating on me.

The thing about that area is it's downtown L.A. and the population there is as dense as any city in the country, so it takes time to get the O.R. space and qualified personal worked out. The more emergent ones will always get priority, so hernia patients get to be on the waiting list... period.

I still find it odd though, that when I pointed out to the attending physician when I was admitted that he wrote "Male Hispanic" by mistake he said... "Do not change that!" .. but that's another story.

Originally posted by ExPostFacto
I go in for a hernia repair next week.

A little suggestion, make sure you aren't planning on going to work for a couple weeks as it will hurt more than you think. Force yourself to keep your abdomen completely relaxed after the procedure as it makes a HUGE difference. That and stretch your arms up over your head every now and then while you recover. This can prevent you from getting stuck all hunched over should adhesion occur.

But I digress, back to the OP...
Why the hell didn't I think of that!, could have cut 30 days off my wait!

Originally posted by lernmore

Originally posted by JennaDarling

If you had proper healthcare for all..

.. this would not need to happen.

Disgusting that a country cannot treat their own citizens and those in need.

I would hardly call that a civilized country.

You seem to be really misinformed and your arguments appear more political than factual.

I had a similar, but way more involved (colostomy reversal from a cancer *scare*) surgery at the exact same hospital (LAcoUSC) when I was 30.

A ventral hernia repair can be a very serious deal to perform, and requires an operating room.
While this guy got fed up waiting and got, lets say, creative, he still would have gotten the surgery he needed.

Sounds like he was more than a little nuts to boot.

In my case, I opted to wait and luckily, a world famous surgeon doing a 1 year internship ended up operating on me.

The thing about that area is it's downtown L.A. and the population there is as dense as any city in the country, so it takes time to get the O.R. space and qualified personal worked out. The more emergent ones will always get priority, so hernia patients get to be on the waiting list... period.

I still find it odd though, that when I pointed out to the attending physician when I was admitted that he wrote "Male Hispanic" by mistake he said... "Do not change that!" .. but that's another story.

Originally posted by ExPostFacto
I go in for a hernia repair next week.

A little suggestion, make sure you aren't planning on going to work for a couple weeks as it will hurt more than you think. Force yourself to keep your abdomen completely relaxed after the procedure as it makes a HUGE difference. That and stretch your arms up over your head every now and then while you recover. This can prevent you from getting stuck all hunched over should adhesion occur.

But I digress, back to the OP...
Why the hell didn't I think of that!, could have cut 30 days off my wait!

Missinformed?

Really?

What part of he performed surgery on himself because he got the run around am I misinformed on?

Please explain for us non Americans please because the concept of NOT being treated by a hospital is just gross to most of us outside the US.

reply to post by JennaDarling

"He told his wife he was frustrated with this hernia, and he didn't want to wait any longer for the medical procedure."

It doesn't matter if you have the finest insurance in the land, and if you're getting operated on at USC, chances are you don't have any. He was on a waiting list, he wasn't simply told to "Go Away"

Originally posted by lernmore
reply to post by JennaDarling

 

"He told his wife he was frustrated with this hernia, and he didn't want to wait any longer for the medical procedure."

edit on 28-7-2011 by lernmore because: (no reason given)

Could this be a life threatening medical condition?

reply to post by JennaDarling


First of all, you are very mis-informed about the "Obama-care" that the U.S. will soon be using. We won't be buying into a national health insurance, instead we will continue to go Capitalist all the way. Capitalism and the free market are "what we're supposed to be operating under" and will have to buy into a private insurance company. The thought behind this is it will drive down costs due to supply and demand. Since everyone will be supplied (by paying for the insurance or fines through the IRS), there will be no demand....or something along those lines. To be honest, there will be no change, just that everyone is paying into some CEO's pockets. The health insurance mandate did nothing to address health care for all, just insurance coverage for all. It also didn't address rising health insurance premiums, just a statement of "well if we get 30-40 million more people on insurance, we won't have to turn people down."

So in all reality had we advanced a couple of years to when the Obama healthcare mandate would be in effect, the gentlemen problably wouldn't have cut himself with a butter knife and cauterized with a cigarette, because he wouldn't be able to afford either. And it being a "hernia", that would mean it was not a life-threatening illness, so the priority of surgery would have been dropped down to aesthetic surgery such as implants and facial lifts.

Could this be a life threatening medical condition?

It could be if the hernia was large enough for loops of intestine pop through and become blocked, but that's almost never the case with a hernia. If it was, he'd be taken in and operated on immediately.

Originally posted by saabster5
reply to post by JennaDarling

 

First of all, you are very mis-informed about the "Obama-care" that the U.S. will soon be using. We won't be buying into a national health insurance, instead we will continue to go Capitalist all the way. Capitalism and the free market are "what we're supposed to be operating under" and will have to buy into a private insurance company. The thought behind this is it will drive down costs due to supply and demand. Since everyone will be supplied (by paying for the insurance or fines through the IRS), there will be no demand....or something along those lines. To be honest, there will be no change, just that everyone is paying into some CEO's pockets. The health insurance mandate did nothing to address health care for all, just insurance coverage for all. It also didn't address rising health insurance premiums, just a statement of "well if we get 30-40 million more people on insurance, we won't have turn people down."

So in all reality had we advanced a couple of years to when the Obama healthcare mandate would be in effect, the gentlemen problably wouldn't have cut himself with a butter knife and cauterized with a cigarette, because he wouldn't be able to afford either. And it being a "hernia", that would mean it was not a life-threatening illness, so the priority of surgery wouldn't have been dropped down to aesthetic surgery such as implants and facial lifts.

So you need something better than that then right?

If you don't want state healthcare, fine, how about a hybrid model where you have private health care while you are working and when you retire and or elderly and also unable to work / on income or disability benefits, you will get healthcare provided by the government. That is how Ireland works currently I believe, but i am myself a supporter of state providing healthcare for all.

Is that a compromise that the US will accept?

The argument that always bothers me, is the "I shouldn't have to pay for other people's health care"

There are just so many things wrong with this.

First of all, in a modern, civilized society, certain things are understood to be required to keep the nation in good standing. Things like Police, Firemen, Road construction/repair, etc.

If you have never called the Police, why can't you say "I don't want to pay for the Police, I never use them!"

If you never had a fire at your house, why can't you say "I don't want to pay for firemen, I never had a house fire!"

If you don't drive, why can't you say "I don't want to pay for roads, I don't drive!"

Those arguments are just as stupid as "I shouldn't have to pay for other people's health care" Certain things are needed to make a country run. Law and order, upkeep of infrastructure, and a healthy, productive population. If nobody can afford health care, and end up getting disabled, or industry looses a combined million man-hours of labor because of missed work, that effects all of society, not just the sick persons.

In addition to that, you are going to pay for it one way or another. Say a person is suffering from some ailment, that could be taken care of fairly easily and cheaply. But, they don't have insurance, and can't afford to pay out-of-pocket. So they do nothing, and their problem ends up getting worse. Worse to the point of needing SERIOUS medical attention. They got the ER and have a huge procedure, or they have to get picked up and worked on by an ambulance, and then taken to the ER. They are still broke, and now possibly disabled, or out of work for months and months because they couldn't get a simple problem taken care of before it got much worse.

So they can't pay, the hospital, the first response people, nobody gets paid. Where do you think that money comes from? You. Or your employer who pays into your medical insurance. Because they have to raise their costs to cover those that can't pay, so prices for everything goes up. You pay more cash out of pocket to see a doctor. You or your employer pays more for medical insurance. Your employer has to pay you less, or charge more for their product/service, to cover the increase in insurance cost. ALL of this when this person's problem could have been taken care of quickly, easily, and cheap. But no, that option isn't available to them, so they end up costing the whole system (in the end, you) more money because they couldn't stop it before it got worse.

Now, maybe this person becomes disabled. Who's going to pay for that? Again, you. He will get disability, maybe medicare, etc. You WILL pay one way or another, prevention is cheaper than cleaning up the problem afterward.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think everyone should be able to go to the doctor every single time they get the sniffles and do it on the taxpayer's dime. But I do think there should be a system in place, where serious ailments are taken care of without a person having to immediately pay. This would end up reducing costs overall in the long term, in my opinion. This would increase the overall wellness of the nation, which is good for everybody.

The whole "screw that guy who got shot in the gut because he doesn't have insurance and is poor" mentality is just plain stupid. and borderline evil. If nothing else, it doesn't make sense economically.

reply to post by JennaDarling


Trying not to get off topic, but there has to be a better system out there. Sure nothing in this world is free, and that definitely goes with the medical field (research, labratories, equipment, personnel). I don't know though, I definitely feel sympathy for the man's plight. It should have never come to that.

In America, we're led to believe we have the best healthcare in the world, due to a free market and capitalism. This is said to breed competition and to lower prices. In some ways it does do that, but currently there are only a few major pharmaceutical companies in America. With only a few, where is the competition? It's a mess here in America. We have put the issue to the backburner for too long, in my opinion. I really don't have an answer for the proper way of correcting the situation. Way beyond my little feeble brains capacity.

I am curious what a national healthcare system is like though. I'm told its "socialist" and in America that is almost like saying jesus was a hermaphrodite. It stirs peoples blood because we were raised with the notion of every man for himself. While this works in some ways, it does nurture survival of the fittest, there are serious social ramifications for that mentality.

Anyways, didn't want to sound like America has the greatest healthcare in the world, because obviously we don't. Just wanted to give my opinion of what America has to look forward to with its "revolutionary" new healthcare system, that doesn't address healthcare at all, but lining corporate executive pockets with hard earned money from people just wanting to live a decent life. Oh wait that's how it was before, but soon everyone will have to pay. Not just ones that could afford it or the ones not denied by the insurance providers, but everyone.

Taxes that go towards the infrastructure I have no problem with. Taxes that go towards non-essential infrastructure things I get a little testy with. Being forced to pay some company/corporation for a service is definitely not ok in my book. And that's what the Obama-care thing boils down to in my opinion, being forced to pay a company for a service. Now say the Government, was in charge (a clean, non-corrupt gov't of course), that would be okay. My reasoning is, I'm funding the greater good of the community, while on the other hand, paying a company doesn't always equate to greater good of the community, but more of greater good of the company. And most companies I know aren't out for charity service...those companies like calling themselves charities. Most companies I know are out for one thing....making that buck. I have never seen making that buck equate to greater good of the community.

Poor guy though. He probably didn't get a chance to get the dental floss and sewing needle to start the closing up procedure before the cops stopped him...kinda unfortunate.

To the OP AHHHHH Cringing here, oh crap am I sore now, had one done years ago and it was my first real invasive surgery besides the usual broken bones and knee caps.
Went in thinking this is a cake walk and came out thinking what the hell have I done to my groin?
I thought I was dieing from the "leakage and discomfort" as they call it....it is really called blood and serious pain!
Not to mention that you will be guaranteed to have at least one if not two Blue Balls and I kid you not.
A butter knife? Insane I say.

Regards, Iwinder

Originally posted by luckythirteen
It never ceases to amaze me how desperate some people are for proper healthcare in the US, a huge, rich and developed country. I still can't quite believe that so many people are refused life saving medical attention because they don't have the adequate insurance or a huge amount of money.

As usual, I mean no disrespect to the USA or its citizens, it just makes me truly appreciate the National Health Service in the UK. Yes, national insurance is mandatory for tax payers and it's not a tiny amount that we pay, but I am happy that anyone who needs treatment will get it somehow.

Just out of interest and if anyone is willing to share, how much does it cost for decent health insurance in the US?

about $1000 a month for my family + $3000 deductable per person + $20 copay per visit + $10 copay per perscription. I am MUCH happier living in Europe under socialized medicine. Doctors aren't so quick to cut on you or send you for an MRI just 'cause.

Scandinavia has some of the best healthcare in the world.


Take at look at how they do it.

You also rarely hear them in the news crying about going bankrupt or their countries are in debt and so on.

Ofcourse you pay high taxes, but they are always top rank for the healthiest and happiest places to live in the world. Go figure.

reply to post by James1982

The argument that always bothers me, is the "I shouldn't have to pay for other people's health care"

There are just so many things wrong with this.

First of all, in a modern, civilized society, certain things are understood to be required to keep the nation in good standing. Things like Police, Firemen, Road construction/repair, etc.

exccellent points

you missed : ` i dont have children , i should only have to repay the tax burden of my own education `

Originally posted by JennaDarling
Scandinavia has some of the best healthcare in the world.


Take at look at how they do it.

You also rarely hear them in the news crying about going bankrupt or their countries are in debt and so on.

Ofcourse you pay high taxes, but they are always top rank for the healthiest and happiest places to live in the world. Go figure.

edit on 28-7-2011 by JennaDarling because: (no reason given)

Ditto here for Canada.........high taxes and free health care.....
maybe not the happiest place to live in the world but not bad either......You sure don't need a butter knife here.
Regards, Iwinder

Originally posted by jjkenobi
Jeebus, how did he get a butter knife to break his skin? I'd go with a steak knife myself, and probably some grilling tongs to move organs out of the way.

I literally just finished eating my steak with a butter knife. It cuts so smoothly(not what you want to hear on a story like this) LOL @ grilling tongs

Originally posted by yourmaker

Originally posted by jjkenobi
Jeebus, how did he get a butter knife to break his skin? I'd go with a steak knife myself, and probably some grilling tongs to move organs out of the way.

I literally just finished eating my steak with a butter knife. It cuts so smoothly(not what you want to hear on a story like this) LOL @ grilling tongs

Laughing here.........at the same time I am Cringing too.
Regards, Iwinder

Sounds like one tough SOB never underestimate old people their hardcore haha great story and i agree they do need a classification for this haha

reply to post by kinnerarity


That's staggering! I had no idea that it cost anywhere near as much as that! Now it makes so much more sense that millions don't have insurance. I don't have a bad income, but I would definitely struggle to meet those bills!

Thanks for answering a question I had wondered about for so long!