Melting ice caps will cause the oceans to rise and flood land? Watch Mr. Wizard, debunker!

In all seriousness, this video did make me think twice about my belief in the idea that the melting ice caps would result in ocean levels rising..

A good bit of nostalgia for anyone who remembers this as a kid ..feel free to debate =)

The flooding would be due to the water locked up above sea level on land moving into the ocean. Not the ice that is free floating already.

That said... that is probably one of the top 3 Mr. Wizard episodes of my childhood memories.

Originally posted by ErgoTheConfusion
The flooding would be due to the water locked up above sea level on land moving into the ocean. Not the ice that is free floating already.

That said... that is probably one of the top 3 Mr. Wizard episodes of my childhood memories.

edit on 7-7-2011 by ErgoTheConfusion because: (no reason given)

It really is an excellent episode that forces you to think.. but yeah ice that is presently on land that melts back into the ocean would be what causes the rise, not the actual melting glaciers or ice that is already in water..

reply to post by miniatus


lol
john titor said this too...
he had to of watched this show

Well Where's Gore and all the merry band other con men(aka Treehuggers)? They better come in here and explain this project grandpa was showing

is that a boy or a girl in that rather flashy red sweater. sounds like a girl and looks like a girl but has one of those girly hair styles that only american boys seem to have in movies.

back on topic, the sea is rising and thats all i can be bothered to say for now

reply to post by ErgoTheConfusion


"due to the water locked up above sea level"

,, in other words that would be water surrounding the glass,,continually funnelling to the rim of the glass,, right?

any idea how much that might be?,,

I enjoyed watching that even though this guy was before my time. I'm in with the Bill Nye generation

Originally posted by BirdOfillOmen
I enjoyed watching that even though this guy was before my time. I'm in with the Bill Nye generation

Ha! I once wrote Bill when I was still a young kid and intentional mistook him for Mr. Wizard just to be a jerk and so Bill Nye sent me an autograph poster with a big "HA HA Very Funny" signed on it .. he's awesome

Exactly. the ice will not displace anymore water in the ocean that's already there, its the Ice caps and Glaciers that is locked up on land. That is unless you believe that as the ice melts the land mass will rise due to the weight being removed from it. But i don't think that will play much of a role. And as for the ice that's already melted in both Greenland and the antarctic, I'm still a semi skeptic on just how high the ocean levels will actually rise. Now as for all the freshwater diluting the salinity of the Ocean waters, I believe this may become a serious problem. Disrupting the oceans Thermohaline currents.

OG Mr.Wizard. I used to watch him once a week in science class in elementary. He makes it easy to understand. Maybe the rising sea levels are from people peeing in it.

reply to post by Pegasus2000


IT"S ALIVeeee,, it's alive,,, (my best Dr. Frankenstein),, bless you mr wizard,,, for saving actual science fact!,,,,,,,bless you,,,,,,,

Sorry
continue,,,,,

There's nothing like Mr. Wizard on the air today.. tv seems mindless, though sometimes I don't mind ( Gotta love Archer ) .. it's still these kinds of things that helped contribute to my intelligence as a kid..

I also loved "Beyond 2000"

Originally posted by ErgoTheConfusion
The flooding would be due to the water locked up above sea level on land moving into the ocean. Not the ice that is free floating already.

That said... that is probably one of the top 3 Mr. Wizard episodes of my childhood memories.

edit on 7-7-2011 by ErgoTheConfusion because: (no reason given)

I don't have the link at the ready but the math does not work. The cubic meters of land based ice in a ratio of how much world-wide ocean cubic meters currently exists puts all such frozen ice on Earth to be at less than .0001% of the existing ocean waters. (Result: less than an inch if ALL melted)

Originally posted by tkwasny

Originally posted by ErgoTheConfusion
The flooding would be due to the water locked up above sea level on land moving into the ocean. Not the ice that is free floating already.

That said... that is probably one of the top 3 Mr. Wizard episodes of my childhood memories.

edit on 7-7-2011 by ErgoTheConfusion because: (no reason given)

I don't have the link at the ready but the math does not work. The cubic meters of land based ice in a ratio of how much world-wide ocean cubic meters currently exists puts all such frozen ice on Earth to be at less than .0001% of the existing ocean waters. (Result: less than an inch if ALL melted)

I didn't have the figures but I was trying to imagine that as well.. there would have to be a TON of ice on land melting in order for it to make a significant measure ... the estimates I've seen talk about the oceans rising several inches.. I can't imagine there's that much land locked ice on the planet ..

If only Mr. Wizard was still alive,,,,
Question Mr. Wizard,, would the weights before and after be the same?
Good question Billy,,, here let me show you,,,
If we were only more advanced today, maybe someone could answer such a question,, but sadly children,,,,,,all we have is Bill Nye,,, lol

Originally posted by Pegasus2000
Exactly. the ice will not displace anymore water in the ocean that's already there, its the Ice caps and Glaciers that is locked up on land. That is unless you believe that as the ice melts the land mass will rise due to the weight being removed from it. But i don't think that will play much of a role. And as for the ice that's already melted in both Greenland and the antarctic, I'm still a semi skeptic on just how high the ocean levels will actually rise. Now as for all the freshwater diluting the salinity of the Ocean waters, I believe this may become a serious problem. Disrupting the oceans Thermohaline currents.

There are studies looking at the current already in response to this. They are also looking at the increased melt of the ice and if the cold water run-off is having any effect on wildlife in the top 50-100 feet of the ocean.

I believe the sea level will only rise a few meters at most but that could potentionally have a drastic effect on alot of people. Hardly an end of the world event though.

Glaciers and ice caps

Each year about 8 mm (0.3 inch) of water from the entire surface of the oceans falls into the Antarctica and Greenland ice sheets as snowfall. If no ice returned to the oceans, sea level would drop 8 mm every year. To a first approximation, the same amount of water appeared to return to the ocean in icebergs and from ice melting at the edges. Scientists previously had estimated which is greater, ice going in or coming out, called the mass balance, important because it causes changes in global sea level. High-precision gravimetry from satellites in low-noise flight has since determined Greenland is losing more than 200 billion tons of ice per year, in accordance with loss estimates from ground measurement.[15] The rate of ice loss is accelerating, having grown from 137 gigatons in 2002–2003.[16]

Ice shelves float on the surface of the sea and, if they melt, to first order they do not change sea level. Likewise, the melting of the northern polar ice cap which is composed of floating pack ice would not significantly contribute to rising sea levels. Because they are fresh, however, their melting would cause a very small increase in sea levels, so small that it is generally neglected. It can however be argued that if ice shelves melt it is a precursor to the melting of ice sheets on Greenland and Antarctica[citation needed].
If small glaciers and polar ice caps on the margins of Greenland and the Antarctic Peninsula melt, the projected rise in sea level will be around 0.5 m. Melting of the Greenland ice sheet would produce 7.2 m of sea-level rise, and melting of the Antarctic ice sheet would produce 61.1 m of sea level rise.[17] The collapse of the grounded interior reservoir of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet would raise sea level by 5–6 m.[18]
The interior of the Greenland and Antarctic ice sheets has been (as of 2009) sufficiently high (and therefore cold) enough that direct melt there cannot cause them to melt in a time-frame less than several millennia; therefore it is likely that they will not, through melting of the interior, contribute significantly to sea level rise in the coming century. They can, however, do so through acceleration in flow and enhanced iceberg calving. Also, melt of the fringes of the ice caps could be significant, as could be sub-ice-shelf melting in Antarctica.
Climate changes during the 20th century are estimated from modelling studies to have led to contributions of between –0.2 and 0.0 mm/yr from Antarctica (the results of increasing precipitation) and 0.0 to 0.1 mm/yr from Greenland (from changes in both precipitation and runoff).
Estimates suggest that Greenland and Antarctica have contributed 0.0 to 0.5 mm/yr over the 20th century as a result of long-term adjustment to the end of the last ice age[citation needed].

The current rise in sea level observed from tide gauges, of about 1.8 mm/yr, is within the estimate range from the combination of factors above[19] but active research continues in this field. The terrestrial storage term, thought to be highly uncertain, is no longer positive, and shown to be quite large.

Since 1992, a number of satellites have been recording the change in sea level;[20][21] they display an acceleration in the rate of sea level change, but they have not been operating for long enough to work out whether this is a real signal, or just an artefact of short-term variation[citation needed].

This is in no way the most accurate source but it should give you an idea of where to look if your really interested.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by miniatus


I think the icecap is so heavy it sits on the land beneath it..

Originally posted by tkwasny
I don't have the link at the ready but the math does not work. The cubic meters of land based ice in a ratio of how much world-wide ocean cubic meters currently exists puts all such frozen ice on Earth to be at less than .0001% of the existing ocean waters. (Result: less than an inch if ALL melted)

I should have noted: I have no idea whether anything would happen if all land based ice melted or not... as I personally can not measure it and treat any other studies as "best estimates based on what we know for the moment".

I was responding specifically to the use of the principle explored in the video as a means to state it couldn't happen. The two scenarios are different (ice floating in the water, vs ice melting from solid surface and flowing into water).

Namste!