reply to post by Laokin
I've come up with a better way to explain this, so excuse the back to back post.
What is an ethical salesman, vs, an unethical salesman?
A "Car Salesman," isn't a salesman at all. When some one wants to buy a car, they go to a car lot. So the sale is already garaunteed. The sales
persons job is to show the cars, and allow the person to judge which features they like on which cars.
A car salesman doesn't do anything, they just show you the MFG's bullet points on each car, and they work out how to get you into one. They don't
have to convince you that you need one, because if you didn't... you wouldn't be at a car lot.
That is an example of an Ethical sales person... Another one, is a sales rep at a store like best buy. If you go in looking for a TV.... the sale is
already there. It's their job to make sure they can make it affordable for you, it's also their job to show you the differences between models.
(This doesn't mean you can't have unethical sales people at these venues, just one example of unethical sales at Best Buy, is when you come in for
like a music CD and walk out with a 2,000$ television you don't need. They target you, ask you questions... find out the type of person you are, say
a gamer, or a graphic artist, then they proceed to use that information against you, acting like they know your hobby or profession, in attempts to
convince you that it will be a helpful purchase, that ultimately benefits you. When it won't.)
An unethical sales person uses tactics that target you. They data mine for information that they can use against you to convince you that you need
the more expensive version which ultimately benefits them by adding more funds to their wallet.
They use phishing scams to find out personality tropes, and to target those in order to convince you that you need something that you don't.
This is NOT acceptible business practice. Also, anybody who is educated about sales, will never buy something from any sales person that employs
An example, door to door sales people. We'll use, Kirby Vacuumes as our example here. They knock on your door, offer you a free steam clean of any
amount of rooms that you will accept to. They start usually by saying 3 rooms. The more rooms equates to more time in your house... (BTW, I worked
selling Kirby Vacuumes, I quit because it's unethical.)
The more time they have to be in your house, the more they can prod for information. They try to find out what you do and don't like about using the
machines you already have... then they make false promises of their machine, using tests concocted by kirby that cannot be used on conventional
vacuums to prove to you that their vacuum works better.
In short, it doesn't. Any $150-$300 Vacuum is going to knock the pants off your Kirby.
I was in a house, and we were talking to this old lady. She loved wine, once we found out she loves wine, my sales associate preported she should
bust out the wine and poor us all a glass... We Drank ours extremely slow, and talked to her about everything from what schools she was going to, to
her husband, to her experiences of WW2, to her kids.. all the while pretending to steam clean the room (which we didn't even start yet, to buy more
time in the house) when she finished, she poored another, and another, and another... till she got trashed.
My associate, then asked her if she liked massages ... They teach you how to use a dirty ass vacuum attatchment to give some one a scalp massage. We
use the same machine all day, in everyones house. We advertise the model that we use as, never before been used. They are filthy machines, cleaned
He then uses the attatchment for cleaning your drain lines in your sink (which is also a semi scam) on her head. When we used it to blow out some
ones kitchen sink the house before.
So, run down is. We found out she was succeptible to alcohol, coaxed her into drinking, talked to her for like 4 hours, made her think we were her
new besties... gave her a message on her scalp with a dirty ass attatchment, then convinced her using phonie tests that our vacuum was better than her
current one... And sold a unit for $2300. The base price on a Kirby is 1300, and can go as low as $600. We sold it for $2300, to a women we knew
couldn't afford it, using questionable practices by data mining her on the spot for over 4 hours.
You want to essentially give them 5+ years of data to do the same thing we did in 4 hours in that home. It's unethical, it's illegal in most states
already, yet they want to give free reign on the internet to more dubious and less trusted sales people.
How is this considered an acceptible business practice?
It's not. It's abuse. It's over the line. It's Illegal for sales reps in florida, (the kirby place I worked for was called American Eagle Corp. and
was indicted numerous times, there is even videos on youtube of interviews with the boss, who TRAINED ME to do these things, claiming he has no idea
it's going on.) Yet, you propose, it's totally acceptible business practice?
This is a video with John Joyce, the guy I used to work for.... The guy who taught me these practices. He openly endorses ripping off old people.
They actually have a "Golden Ager" Policy, to protect old woman from scammers, yet -- nobody in the building was aware of this policy. It was
concealed from all the employee's by order from Kirby.
They have this policy for plausable deniability, because they have been indicted so many times for ripping people off.
I worked there when this happened. And yes, she was denied the refund. Only once the news go involved did they return the lady her money.
It's a total scam.
If data mining didn't aid in concocted bogus sales pitches, then people wouldn't use it. As it stands, year after year after year, major companies
purchase your personal "private" information from all sorts willing to sell it. They do this, because they make more money off the scam then it costs
for the data.
It's really, really, really, incredibly simple.
If you propose the data doesn't help forge fraudulent sales pitches... then I have to ask to you, how does the data work then?
What do they get out of knowing what I do for a living? Clearly, so they can target me with some product that I don't need, that they advertise will
improve my productivity.... It also exposes your weaknesses to a certain pitch, allowing them to tailor one specifically to you. Which they don't
even lie about, they openly admit that is what they are doing. That's the ONLY practical use of Data Mining for advertisers.
edit on 27-5-2011
by Laokin because: (no reason given)