Atheists Seek Chaplain Role in the Military

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posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 08:17 PM
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I see where you guys are heading...but didn't we have an issue recently where a woman was raped, and went to the chaplain and he told her that she needed to go to church more, and basically blamed the rape on her????

When people are in a desperate situation and feeling hopeless...they can easily be manipulated by someone with an agenda. A chaplain would be a guy who has an agenda. That doesn't mean that every chaplain will abuse his position every time...it just means that clearly the chance is there to "do god's work"...and I'd be against that.




posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 09:46 PM
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reply to post by LazerTron
 


I don't recall that issue... You got a link?



posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 09:52 PM
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How about if the atheists appoint a head guru for their organized group rather than use the title of chaplain.



posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 09:54 PM
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reply to post by HunkaHunka
 


Here's a link to the story where the military chaplain said her rape was "God's will":
www.rawstory.com...

Here's a link to the Above Top Secret Forum where it was discussed:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

This ONE instance is all I need to say that military folks who do not wish to preached to should have an outlet that they can go to where religion will not be part of the counselor's "cure".



posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 11:11 PM
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Originally posted by mother1138

Atheists Seek Chaplain Role in the Military


www.nytimes.com..." target="_blank" class="postlink">https:

Strange as it sounds, groups representing atheists and secular humanists are pushing for the appointment of one of their own to the chaplaincy, hoping to give voice to what they say is a large — and largely underground — population of nonbelievers in the military.
(visit the link for the full news article)



Well that's fine but they won't have much of a job to do as nothing makes a trooper "find" God then getting your a$$ shot at for the first time.



posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 11:25 PM
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Atheist Chaplain? What da???? “Don’t worry my son…take courage…. Your friends are at peace now in complete blackness where you shall soon join them.”



posted on Apr, 28 2011 @ 11:46 PM
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reply to post by soleprobe
 


I know that you say that jokingly...but some people...like myself...find absolutely no comfort in being told that the biblical afterlife awaits us...regardless of which place you tell us we're headed.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:00 AM
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an atheist talking to wounded or dying soldiers on the battlefield is an excellent idea.

a dying soldier asks for a chaplain, with half his intestines out and scared beyond reason, and along comes the atheist:

soldier- " i'm scared of dying, help me"

atheist- " God doesn't exist, nobody can help you, you are going to die and rot, maggots and flies are going to eat your body. you'll never see anybody you love again and this one life, you just gave to your government, is going to end. you are going to cease to exist for all eternity, so your life was pointless. and eventually everyone you know is going to die, along with their memory of you."

soldier- "thanks, i feel much better now."



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:07 AM
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reply to post by randomname
 


Again, I find that more comforting than the Christian alternative...

And believe it or not...there are other reasons a soldier may need to talk to someone aside from them being in the middle of bleeding to death.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:13 AM
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Originally posted by LazerTron
some people...like myself...find absolutely no comfort in being told that the biblical afterlife awaits us...


Under what situation? Now on this discussion board or when your arms and legs have just been blown off and you're receiving counsel prior to imminent death?
edit on 29-4-2011 by soleprobe because: punctuation



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:22 AM
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reply to post by soleprobe
 


Under any situation. I have absolutely no desire to meet the god of the Bible. Believe it or not...some people simply aren't going to believe in something just because they are scared...and some people are firm enough in their principles to not cave when the going gets tough. If the god of the Bible is real, I'm not going to get along with him at all.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:26 AM
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As a military spouse of a 20 yr veteran, many times I could have benefited from words of advice, comfort, sympathy, etc. from an athiest or agnostic chaplain or equivalent. I did not want to speak to a chaplain because I didn't want the religion that comes with it. As a non-Christian, I would not feel comfortable with a Christian chaplain. Would a Christian feel comfortable seeking out a Muslim religious leader, or a Buddhist?

If the military can acknowledge Satanism, then they should also acknowledge atheism or agnosticism.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:30 AM
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reply to post by randomname
 


So, are you saying is an atheist is not capable of offering comforting words to someone who needs it?

Why does everyone think atheists are uncaring, unsympathetic, barbaric scum that can't be a moral, compassionate
person?

Maybe if some of you got rid of your tunnel vision you would see that athiest and agnostics can be and are some of the
most wonderful people in this crazy world.
edit on 29-4-2011 by virraszto because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:38 AM
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Originally posted by LazerTron
If the god of the Bible is real, I'm not going to get along with him at all.


Any other gods you think you might get along with?



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:53 AM
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Atheist chaplains are as meaningful as vegetarian butchers.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 01:44 AM
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Originally posted by soleprobe

Originally posted by LazerTron
If the god of the Bible is real, I'm not going to get along with him at all.


Any other gods you think you might get along with?


None that I've come across. Some are better than others. I tend to be opposed to the concept of forced worship anyway.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 05:24 AM
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reply to post by mother1138
 


Yes, it does sound silly however possibly they are just trying to enforce a logical, tangible and modern belief system. That is after all what religion is, isn't it?



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 06:41 AM
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Originally posted by Swissdom
Atheist chaplains are as meaningful as vegetarian butchers.


If you want to get hung up about the word 'chaplain', I suppose. But it's more like they call the cook a butcher because he only knows how to cook meat. So they need a new 'butcher' (by which they mean cook) who also knows how to cook sprouts.

The chaplain doesn't just perform religious services and give theological advice. He is a counselor to whom troops are routinely told to go when they're having any problems. The difference is that his perspective is colored by a religious belief which is of no use to an atheist. If you are religious, would you want to talk to an atheist from an atheistic perspective about your problems? Would you want to hear 'Don't worry, there's no God and nothing happens after we die'? If not, don't begrudge atheists in the military the same natural wish to have someone who understands their worldview to turn to for advice and support.
edit on 29-4-2011 by sepermeru because: (no reason given)
edit on 29-4-2011 by sepermeru because: edit button is my god



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 06:42 AM
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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
The issue is ordination. Chaplains attend religious schools, attaining a master's degree worth of education in some form of theology and are ordained by their faith.

I can't see how that would work for an atheist.


You're stuck on the semantics, He may not be an actual chaplain or clergy. But if he is, he would be trained to counsel atheists without religious dogma. He would be trained to counsel with people who feel the need for a little emotional support, sans religion.


Though people who follow such beliefs tend to be pacifists and stay far away from the military.


Generalize much?


I havn't seen a New Ager in the military.


Who's talking about "New Agers"? Atheism is older than religion.


Originally posted by MikeboydUS
We have people in theater to help with PTSD and various other issues.


We're not talking about PTSD. Seeing a chaplain doesn't have the stigma of seeing someone for PTSD. There's nothing wrong with these soldiers, They just want someone to talk to.



We have entire treatment facilities available to those who need help while deployed. So the lack of counsel is not a problem.


So, then just get rid of all the chaplains and everyone can go to these treatment facilities for counsel.

reply to post by virraszto
 


It's clearly prejudice out of ignorance. They pre-judge atheists as uncaring, un-spiritual, "new agers".
And it's because they don't know (or don't want to know) any better.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 08:06 AM
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Originally posted by LazerTron
reply to post by soleprobe
 


Under any situation. I have absolutely no desire to meet the god of the Bible. Believe it or not...some people simply aren't going to believe in something just because they are scared...and some people are firm enough in their principles to not cave when the going gets tough. If the god of the Bible is real, I'm not going to get along with him at all.



Not believing in the God of the bible doesn't mean that you aren't religious or spiritual. Judeo-Christian-Islamic God does not hold a monopoly on spiritual matters. I don't believe in that God either, but I am far from an Atheist in a the true sense.






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