The plant that softens stone.

reply to post by skjalddis

very good thread..i remeber my mumm used to say about her grandma knowing how to find a similar plant but this is not in south america but in europe..she said you have to find the little ones of a hedgehog and keep them locked..the mumm would come up with the plant and cut off the lock...could be just a story..i was just a kid when i heard this from my mumm but i remember i was amazed and she said it was all true..

www.geopolymer.org...

think i may have found something...sorry if link was already posted


check it out may be what every one is loooking for

Originally posted by dizTheWiz
www.geopolymer.org...

think i may have found something...sorry if link was already posted

edit on 22-4-2011 by dizTheWiz because: (no reason given)

check it out may be what every one is loooking for

edit on 22-4-2011 by dizTheWiz because: (no reason given)

Excellent find!!!!
Just think of ALL the ancient wisdom that has been lost,
that someday we "modern " humans my once again
rediscover.

reply to post by skjalddis


My wife is from one of those countries, and I will ask her whether she can check with family re: the veracity of the tales and the reality of the plant..

Interesting nonetheless! Only read the OP so far, will come back with more comments later I suppose.

Excellent first post and awesome thread with members posting their research and contributions throughout.

For the Spanish article, what you can do is use Chrome and the Google Translate extension. You can then translate into English and paste the contents in EverNote for reading later.

Best.

reply to post by kdog1982


Yes glad i could help all i googled was "molding rock with plant extract" and was on first page

lets bring all this knowledge to skill in our homes and neighborhoods and better our ways of living
"ill logically advanced with the knowledge of the past"

reply to post by kdog1982


A marvellous point, and the comment you quoted led me to one of the most fascinating and satisfying documents I've read in a while..

Here's one fantastic little snippet, which made me think of all those mainstream archaeologists (or wannabe debunkers) who have barfed out the same old crap about sand-boring time and again in the 'ancient and lost civilisations' forum:

An experiment of interest was to compare the technique with the shaping of a hole using steel tool and the quartz sand technique recommended by historians. The test was run for 15 minutes and the Vh measured for each technique.

Vh after 15 minutes of working:

steel tool - 12 ml (spoon spatula)
quartz sand - 8.5 ml
bio-tooling - 9.5 ml

The hole resulting from sand abrasion has rough walls, whereas bio-tooling gives a smooth finish.

Would the ancients have farted around with sand and muscle power when they could have dissolved the stones to make them fit in the exact manner by casting?

Wonder which shaman/ 'god' told them about the correct process to liberate the oxalic acid content of the plants using citric acid? (Thoth anyone?)

Opuntia looks like it was the best plant for the job, according to the data in that link... (the link is HERE if people aren't sure what I'm referring to).

Excellent research, and negates my need to check with my wife about the existence of these plants and their actions. A fascinating development/ informative OP which definitely deserves all those stars and flags. You get one of each from me too!

I will be re-assessing some of my beliefs about the way these megalithic pre-Incan structures were built in light of this information. (NB - I still believe the 'gods' had a hand in it all....)

reply to post by dizTheWiz


If we ever need to 'reinvent the wheel' so to speak, with regards construction methodologies (for example after a global war), then this info will be very easy to keep in mind and experiment with practically.

Survivalists rejoice!

You know,this is how a thread should be.
No egos fighting over who is right and who is wrong.
Instead it's about fellow ATS'ers coming together as a collective
to research and contribute to a common cause.

So now,I'm gonna mix up some stuff and see if I can repair
my driveway.

SnF I'll be dipped in oatmeal. Stupendous thread. Absolutly what I love to find at ATS .
in terms of importance this is great knowledge and I thank the OP for bringing it forward.
This changes any convesation I will ever have about the ancients stone structures.
From, I wonder how to I have read information.
This is a hint, a clue if you would and a damn good one. I have always thought the stones had to
be molded somehow not sanded. The glaze that is on every stone being from the use of a
chemical, is mistaken for polishing. Bitchen info.

Randyvious

reply to post by skjalddis


If there's a plant which softens stone, then there are more than a few people, including members of ATS who ought to be eating or smoking it.

I wasn't expecting this thread to take off quite like this! I've just caught up reading all the posts and I have to thank everyone for their contributions, there is some great stuff there that has been posted up, and I'm glad that people are finding it interesting.

Now, I'm going to go back over it and try and post up some replies, may take me a while cos I'm a bit slow at writing posts.



peace
J

Little bit of Video of the Andean Flicker (Colaptes rupicola) entering its hole in the rock.

and one exiting his hole in the rock

Originally posted by FedSen
Great thread! This could very well explain how the ancients were able to create such large structures with precision joints. If you soften up the ends then stick them together they will dry as one. I also like the idea brought up that entire bricks can be formed on site instead of being hauled around. I would also like to know what Hancock book talked about this so I can read more on it.

As for the book that you found the original information in, "Lost City of Z" I believe...how is it? I've thought about reading this as well but haven't heard any reviews on it yet.

It is a very interesting book, certainly worth reading but bear in mind what it is - it is basically a travel journal. I mean, I like reading that kind of thing - accounts of early explorations in Tibet etc. And it is something of a period piece - that is the late 19th - early 20th century - so you have to be prepared for a very different cultural context.

peace
J

Hello I am a gardener and CAN COFNRIM I HAVE FOUND THIS PLANT WHICH TURNS STONE SOFT I USE IT REGULARLY

Lots of background and stories about trying to find the plant that softens stones

here.

reply to post by MrCrindleton



Do you know the specific name of the plant, or can you provide pics? What types of uses have you put it to?

Traditional use of the Andean flicker (Colaptes rupicola) as a galactagogue in the Peruvian Andes

Venero Gonzales [2] reports that the plant is often said to be manka p'aki (Eupatorium peregrinum, Eupatorium sternberginianum),

2. Veneros Gonzalez JL, Cannon PG, Casanova JA. Agroforestería en Ccachín. In: Proyecto FAO-Holanda/INFOR-CENFOR IX Cusco, editor. Informes Técnicos Forestales. Lima: FAO; 1987. pp. 77–82.

Originally posted by kdog1982
Well dug a little deeper and came up with the plant that was supposedly used

... Aukanaw, an Argentine anthropologist of Mapuche origin, who died in 1994, related a tradition about a species of woodpecker known locally by such names as pitiwe, pite, and pitio; its scientific name is probably Colaptes pitius (Chilean flicker), which is found in Chile and Argentina, or Colaptes rupicola (Andean flicker), which is found in southern Ecuador, Peru, western Bolivia, and northern Argentina and Chile. If someone blocks the entrance to its nest with a piece of rock or iron it will fetch a rare plant, known as pito or pitu, and rub it against the obstacle, causing it to become weaker or dissolve. In Peru, above 4500 m, there is said to be a plant called kechuca which turns stone to jelly, and which the jakkacllopito bird uses to make its nest. A plant with similar properties that grows at even higher altitudes is known, among other things, as punco-punco; this may be Ephedra andina, which the Mapuche consider a medicinal plant.5

From this source

davidpratt.info...

edit on 22-4-2011 by kdog1982 because: (no reason given)

Fascinating article that you have found there. I haven't read it all yet, there is a ton of info there and I would recommend everyone check it out if only for the pics. Also, I did not know that they used polygonal blocks in contruction in ancient Greece - check out the pics from Delphi and Ephyra - the blocks are small and don't look as neat as those from the American sites but even so, it makes you wonder how widespread this technology was. In that respect, I thought I would add the following bit from the above article..

Davidovits has also argued that the disaggregation of stone materials with organic acids from plant extracts was a universal technique in antiquity. Pliny mentions the use of vinegar (acetic acid) in the disaggregation of limestone rocks, and Hannibal (219 BC) used the technique to bore holes in and burst open rocks obstructing his path through the Alps in his attempt to conquer Rome. Davidovits and his coworkers have demonstrated that a solution containing acetic, oxalic, and citric acid (obtained from plants) can disaggregate rocks containing calcium carbonate (e.g. limestone and calcite). He draws attention to the extraordinary skill in fabricating stone objects displayed by the pre-Inca Huanka (or Wanka) civilization. Some contemporary shamans belonging to the Huanka tradition do not use tools to make their small stone objects, but use plant extracts to dissolve the stone material (which contains calcite) and then pour the slurry into a mould where it hardens. He believes the same technique was used to make the earlier statues.14

thanks for that one

peace
J

Whilst looking for more info on the plant Kechuca, I came across the following item which suggests that the same technique was known to and used by the ancient Hebrews..

While we are on the subject of building, according to Jewish tradition King Solomon used a “Shamir” to cut rocks in building the Temple in Jerusalem. The Shamir is traditionally referred to as being a worm. The word actually means a guard. In common Hebrew Shamir is also a plant with thistles.

Among the stories of building the Temple is the one about how King Solomon caught and utilized the Shamir. According to legend, the Shamir was used to cut the stone for building. In the story of King Solomon there was a bird that knew where the Shamir was. In order to catch it a piece of glass was placed over the nest. When the bird saw that the nest was blocked, it went and brought back the Shamir — and was able to break through it to the nest.

[...]

When we think about how people used their ideas, we find this story in the stories of King Solomon. The Shamir referred to, could in fact be a plant that was brought in by certain birds, and not a worm. It is easy to conclude that people assumed that it was a worm based on their knowledge of the fact that birds are known to carry and eat worms.

revealingthesoul.com...


peace
J