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Proof that Libya was never responsible for the lockerbie bombing!!

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posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 02:27 PM
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Blog detailing the events surrounding the Lockerbie bombing and how it was a BOTCHED federal operation that gave IRAN it's way to get revenge on the US for shooting down an airliner of theirs!



Needless to say, the DIA was in a panic after Pan Am 103 blew up. They had never bothered to search the suitcase to ensure it only had heroin as they smuggled the bomb through security and onto the Pan Am flight . This blunder was not good for careers, America's image, or foreign policy. In addition, the U.S. Government would be humiliated if Iran were credited for revenge with the aid of duped American agents. It would also threaten to expose the truth behind the USS Vincennes shoot down, which Newsweek exposed four years later. Finally, the U.S. Government would find it difficult to explain why Captain Will Rogers, the man responsible for the deaths of 259 Iranian pilgrims on the Airbus flight to Mecca, and thus indirectly responsible for the retaliatory bombing over Lockerbie, was not in prison, but had been awarded a medal and a hefty U.S. Navy pension.




This is why Libya was blamed for Lockerbie. The U.S. Government hated Libyan leader Gaddafi. This Sandhurst trained "madman," had overthrown Libya's Anglo-American puppet king, kicked the USA out of Wheeler Air Force Base, its premier Mediterranean air training base, and began buying Soviet equipment rather than American weapons. Worst of all, he wasted his nations oil wealth improving the lives of Libyans rather than investing profits in Western corporations.


Now the thing I find most interesting about this article, which by the way is a good fifteen minute read detailing the incident and events surrounding it in detail and FULLY ANNOTATED!

But also the Author of this blog is a former American Military Service man and Loves his Country! This is not some embittered European who hates the US stating this but a man who is ASHAMED of the path our country is taking and doing EVERYTHING in his power to try to change it by educating people!

His blog is read by many currently serving military men and people in the defense industry, and is truly amazing ! If you have the time I highly recommend browsing his site in detail.
edit on 31-3-2011 by roguetechie because: thread title too long changed title




posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 02:44 PM
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Quite interesting. I had never researched that affair.

The news agencies are in full spin mode right now. CNN has some "confirmed source" that talks on CNN like he's on the telephone with them and explains the atrocities of the Gaddafi regime.

Is this guy real or an agent? These things may indeed be happening, however it does appear odd to me that there are no videos or photos of anything he says, and that all he ever talks about are the "confirmed" (according to cnn) actions of the brutality of Gaddafi's people. Even if these things are happening, this source seems to be a fake to me.

He could just be part of the psyops. Another chapter regarding the Lockerbie bombing?



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:02 PM
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There are a number of "alternative theories" which arose after the bombing of Pan-Am 103...

I was aware of the angle that is pointed out in the blog, but upon doing a quick search to verify the source material being used, (*see his endnotes) I came upon this interesting WikiPedia entry:
Pan Am 103 Conspiracy Theories

It looks into these angles:



Contents [hide]
1 Iran
2 CIA drug smuggling
3 Alleged framing of Libya
3.1 Recent Libyan history
3.2 Lord Advocate's comment
3.3 Reliance on forensic science
4 Iran and the London angle
5 Libya and Abu Nidal
6 Radio detonation
7 South-West Africa (Namibia)
8 Review by American RadioWorks
9 References
10 External links
11 See also



And has a ton of, what appear to be, very interesting source material in its endnotes.

Here we go again, I sense a lot of wasted time in my near future!

the Billmeister



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:08 PM
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Hmmm, that looks like something fun to look into on one of my boring nights.... Can we ever believe "Official Reports" about anything anymore? Better question, was there ever a time we COULD take "Official Reports" as gospel?



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:12 PM
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It was a Libian government offical that said he has proof the Gadafi ordered the bombing.
How is a blog by someone who I don't even know is real, proof?



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by sickofitall2012
It was a Libian government offical that said he has proof the Gadafi ordered the bombing.
How is a blog by someone who I don't even know is real, proof?


Here is a quote from one of the sourced articles:



The officer, who was a member of the Association of Chief Police Officers Scotland, is supporting earlier claims by a former CIA agent that his bosses "wrote the script" to incriminate Libya.

Source

You are correct to doubt a blog, that is why I followed through by checking the endnotes, which led to "reputable" newspaper articles. (I place "reputable" in quotations because one of the major issues in life as on ATS is which source one chooses to trust.)

the Billmeister



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:26 PM
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Indeed the poster was right to question... however if they had checked the FULLY SOURCED and ANNOTATED article (how many times do you see that anymore?)

Not to mention the writer of the article is as "true blue red blooded American" as you can ask anyone to be.
He campaigns for real solutions to the problems facing our country and is unafraid to look at the corruption and incompetence that is rife in the Military Indsutrial Complex and the clear and present danger it puts our nation in.

I have much respect for this man.... Oh and another rarity in this day and age, if you email him with a question comment or etc he WILL RESPOND with a well thought out balanced response.

Where his credibility is concerned I have long since confirmed that what he says can be verified and cross checked, but I do not blame anyone who chooses to do the same.

edit to add: what I found most interesting and vindicating is his view that the "real reason" we are intervening here is the refusal of the qaddafi regime to let the metanationals rape his nation's resources and destroy the middle class.

This article adds more credence to the russia today article about the benefits available to libyan citizens including free strudy abroad at the cost of the state, and grants to new families to help them start their life!
edit on 31-3-2011 by roguetechie because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by sickofitall2012
It was a Libian government offical that said he has proof the Gadafi ordered the bombing.
How is a blog by someone who I don't even know is real, proof?


Whilst this claim by this official was made, you also have to put it into context.

This official knows that If Gaddafi were to stay in power, then he (The defecting official) and his family would always live in fear of Gaddafi retribution, so let's not forget this official "defected" at the height of the rebels successes when it looked possible that Gaddafi might be toppled.

This official wants Gaddafi gone.......so by saying he has proof of the Pan Am bombing he may just be just a ploy incite more Western anger towards Gaddafi, and hopes that the West get involved to either remove or assassinate Gadaffi.

To my knowledge this "proof" still has not been presented yet.
edit on 31-3-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:43 PM
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The defector was years and years before the current unrest in Libya. And it just so happens there was a nice cash reward for info about the bombing!

Also note that full diplomatic ties were restored to Libya awhile ago... that is at odds with the renewed accusations that Libya is a state sponsor of terror...

Another interesting thing to note is even the Mainstream media in interviews with military personnel have given the answer of "shadows of al CIA duh" (their words not mine) working with the rebels... LOL that's gotta be right up there with Kinda pregnant for a stupid euphemism. But also if AQ is working with the rebels it wouldn't make sense for them to work with the loyalists as well would it?

I know it's not easy to stomach the idea of our governments being on the "wrong side" of this war or doing this for the wrong reasons. But honestly I've had a gut deep feeling that not all is as it seems in this situation and wondered why such an "oppressed" people look so amazingly PROSPEROUS compared to the footage from egypt and the poor schmucks getting killed in Syria, Egypt and other places right now...

The differences are STRIKING really when you stop to look!



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 03:47 PM
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USS Vincennes Capt Rogers was in charge when they shot down the Iranian passenger jet in Iranian waters.

Albeit the shooting down of the passenger jet was due to a whole catalogue of mistakes that were made......not least of all the fact that the ship was actually in Iranian waters when the airliner was shot down, or that the passenger jet was ascending not descending......as the crew of the Vincennes wrongly calculated at the time,
the gross mistake by Rogers and his crew should have excluded him from receiving the Medal of Honour.....If only to spare the feelings for the families of those that died that day.
Some Iranian families have been fully aware that Rogers was given this medal.......and for them it was a smack in the face.

If Rogers was an honourable man he should have not accepted the medal....out of respect for those that he killed......albeit unintentionally.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 04:01 PM
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This is a quote from the source article stating how the information from the "defector" came about.



This case was weak until the CIA found a defector fleeing Libya who had learned of a big reward for information about the case. He was willing to testify that Libya was involved in exchange for asylum and the reward. Libya knew the case was bogus and refused to surrender the two innocent Libyans to a kangaroo court. The U.S. and Britain pressured the UN to impose sanctions, which held Libya hostage for years. The cover up was complete and the reputation of the U.S. government secure, at least for a few years.


Here is a second quote from the article detailing a book written by a former DIA whistle blower who was forced to seek asylum in Sweden after being convicted of perjury and having his books publication stopped by the DIA who filed suit for libel... Years later he was cleared of the perjury charges in a SEALED judgement that neither he nor his lawyer could read!



. The publication of Coleman's book "Trail of the Octopus" was halted by U.S. federal courts because of DIA claims of libel. This is normally a civil matter that arises after publication, but suppressing the truth requires preemption. While attempting to clear his book for publication, Coleman submitted an affidavit that a bag of heroin, bound for a U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) drug sting, was switched for a bag of explosives on Pan Am 103. A federal judge declared it false and ordered Coleman arrested for perjury. He was released several months later and fled to Sweden where he was granted political asylum. Coleman was later subpoenaed to testify at the Lockerbie trial, but was prevented since he had been found guilty of perjury as part of the court proceedings to block the publication of his book. He was later cleared of perjury by a court of appeal. The judges issued a sealed ruling, which meant that Coleman and his lawyers couldn't read why his conviction was overturned. Since publication was blocked in the USA, Coleman declared his book public domain and it enjoyed a brief publication run in England. Some expensive collector copies can be found on the Internet today. In addition to Lockerbie, the book relates Coleman's life story and his experiences working in the DIA and the realities of Middle East politics during the 1980s. The story ends with the Coleman family adjusting to life as political asylum seekers in Sweden.



Now this is not nearly all of the article or even the best parts, just a teaser to keep people interested and make it worth reading for themselves!

Original g2mil blog article above quotes are sourced from

In situations like what we are seeing right now in Libya it is Imperative we ask ourselves a few pertinent questions.

1. What else do they not want us to see? This one is important when you watch CNN and see pretty airstrike footage and the lame pseudo debate the republicans and democrats are having over the validity of this or that around Libya. Yet we have how many Nuclear power plants in meltdown right now in japan?

2. What other purpose does this war serve? In my opinion this war is not just a great distraction from a serious environmental calamity (actually more than one as the leaks in the gulf of Mexico were making the news again until they started bombing libya) But it also serves the purpose of destroying one more country with a vibrant middle class of well educated western friendly individuals. This helps with the creation of the caliphate of radicalized and dirt poor middle eastern populations that are given more and more reason to hate the west.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by Logical one
 


The article actually goes into the whole rogers thing and his previous assignment before the incident.



Since Rogers' previous assignment was in office of the Chief of Naval Operations, one might assume that he was given command of the Vincennes with secret high-level encouragement to provoke Iran.


The funny thing is I had accepted it as "fact" that qaddafi had ordered the bombing of the lockerbie flight and still I thought there was something fishy about this war... But wow it's very very interesting how Libya went from normal relations back to the AXIS of EEEEBIIILLL in the course of a week or two and no one mentions that we had regular diplomatic relations with Libya and many of the other relevant facts.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 04:21 PM
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reply to post by roguetechie
 


have you ever noticed that some of our enemies, a.k.a. the "monsters" usually are guys who have a grasp of living in poverty as children, aim to make their lands independent, feed them healthy food. Gadhafi comes to mind, but a bigger monster is Hugo Chavez. I mean really...trying to make sure your people only have organic food!!!....what a guy. telltale signs of bad guys i guess..



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 04:34 PM
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Yes I have noticed that the single most dangerous thing a politician can do these days is try to look out for the interests of the people they represent first instead of all the other groups vying for a chance to throw money at them.

The reality is if we had a government that took care of it's people first we would have a stronger economy, a more robust ability to recover from setbacks and disaster (when you can barely feed yourself and pay rent and a disaster strikes chances are you have to weather the disaster in place possibly getting hurt and MOST definitely needing Immediate assistance for even basic survival)

Contrast this with a prosperous society where people have savings accounts and can take a week of paid vacation in times of need.... they don't need as much help after a disaster. Now if you have a well educated society on top of all this then you will have people not wanting much help in those situations if they don't need it because they'll UNDERSTAND that every dollar of aid they get HAS TO COME FROM SOMEWHERE.

We are being told more and more that government will not be able to help as much if something goes wrong yet every year MORE of our money goes to pay for a government that is actually costing many of us more than we can ever hope to get back from it!

I just hope that people wake up soon and get that SERIOUS CHANGES need to happen soon or we could end up being the generation that watches the last of the american dream go up in smoke.



posted on Mar, 31 2011 @ 11:10 PM
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Trying to keep this thread from dying out of my utter BONE DEEP conviction that this Libya affair is a turning point!

The press is running with and TAKING SERIOUSLY the BOMBING as HUMANITARIAN AID propaganda...

ANd there are many other things that I am seeing that are straight out of 1984 and globalresearch.ca, and Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars!

This whole show (aka libyan campaign) is specifically designed to permanently cement the growing cognitive dissonance into the logic straight out of 1984!! Making War for PEACE

Qaddafi is EVIL but we won't effect regime change?

There is so much more to this than meets the eye ... the symbolism and the utter KNOTS they are twisting facts into (AND MAKING PEOPLE BELIEVE IT) it's ... I hesitate to call it this but it's UNHOLY!

When I watch the news coverage around it the voice in the back of my mind tells me DOWN THIS ROAD MADNESS LIES!

THe fact that Lockerbie is blamed on qaddafi when it's KNOWN who really did it... and the fact that LIbya, A PROSPEROUS WESTERN FRIENDLY EDUCATED nation with a vibrant middle class (kinda rare those middle classes in the middle east) is being used for this symbolic reversing of EVERYTHING WE SEE AND KNOW to this alternate reality where BLACK is WHITE

we GO TO WAR to MAKE PEACE ...

WE SEND FOOD to NATIONS THAT NEED JOBS!!!

THE RICH GIVE AWAY THEIR MONEY SO THEY CAN KEEP IT FOREVER!! (Look at recent tax law changes that allow you to pass on your wealth in perpetuity tax free by "donating" it all and creating a charitable foundation!!! AND you thought Bill Gates gave away his fortune to BE NICE LOL how silly!!)


The world bank and the IMF are used to keep POOR COUNTRIES POOR and STEAL their resources for the rich!

Where the too big to fail banks are using federal reserve funds to "pay off their TARP LOANS"

This reversal of everything you SEE AND KNOW is DESIGNED to create a paralysis in you... a psychological fugue state where you function and continue working etc but can't protest because your mind is so dangerously close to a point where you WILL GO CATATONIC if you think too hard about it... And where IF YOU DO ESCAPE THE TRAP of it all you will be ostracized shunned or even face CONSEQUENCES for trying to bring the sheer ABSURDITY OF IT ALL to the attention of your fellow man!



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 09:27 AM
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reply to post by roguetechie
 


The Lockerbie disaster was what got me interested in conspiracies. I had a friend who’s uncle was killed in the town and her mother was injured and saw the whole thing, yet refused to believe that Libya were behind it. So I got interested went off done some of my own research then formed my own conspiracy which can be found here



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 01:05 PM
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Incidents like Lockerbie and Oklahoma City plus some of the embassy bombings and etc that have happened seem to get little to NO attention on most conspiracy sites...

I find this sad and disturbing for a myriad of reasons, but also it confuses me. If people did their homework on Oklahoma City and some of the other early incidents it would actually HELP THEM make a stronger case when it comes to 9.11 and other incidents since then!

For example the controversy around the footage that in some cases still hasn't been released from OKC (or the footage that was released but is MYSTERIOUSLY MISSING like 28 minutes of KEY footage!!) Contrast that with the videos we still haven't got released from 9/11... Or Just like the building 7 controversy there were the reports on the day of OKC that another bomb was disarmed in the aftermath was reported on local stations and NEVER HEARD ABOUT AGAIN.... well except the odd stories that get bandied about centering around a helicopter load of EOD personnel that may or may not have "crashed" on it's way back to base.

These Earlier events were not as well "managed" and in my mind also set the precedents and procedures by which the newer cover ups and incidents are handled...

Well that and I think Libya is just a completely CRUCIAL turning point for us. The utter nonsensical nature of the war, and the fact that every day it looks more and more like the rebels may actually be the bad guys in this play (But we're supporting them because they promise MORE OIL More acquiescence to MULTINATIONAL CORPORATE pressures, and will most likely be MUCH MUCH easier to bribe or otherwise steer into selling off the future of their country for PENNIES ON THE DOLLAR!!)

It's quite scary in my personal opinion... this war is DESTROYING a country that has a well educated relatively prosperous people and was until very recently HAD FULL DIPLOMATIC RELATIONS with the US government and other governments worldwide.



posted on Aug, 31 2011 @ 12:58 PM
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Here's another article I found which also posits a similar scenario that the Lockerbie bombing was a hoax.

www.rumormillnews.com...




America's Leaders Screwing the American Public
(The Lockerbie Tragedy of 270 Deaths)

This is one in a series of articles on how key people in the government of the United States, and their shills in the media and elsewhere, have been and continue to trick the American public through a series of corrupt acts, which then either directly inflict, or enable to inflict, harmful, sometimes, deadly, and sometimes catastrophic consequences.

Unfortunately, to understand this segment of the many other forms of duping the public requires the exercise of mental energy. This example evolves around the investigation by personnel of the U.S. Department of Justice into the downing of Pan Am Flight 103 over Lockerbie that killed 270 people.

The key issues include:

DOJ personnel fabricating evidence to blame Libya.

DOJ personnel fabricating evidence to blame two Libyans.

DOJ personnel covering up for the actual perpetrators.

Continuation of corrupt culture of personnel in control of the U.S. Department of Justice, which culture then play8ed major enabling roles in several subsequent and major terrorist attacks on U.S. targets.

Preliminary information on the Lockerbie bombing of Pan American Flight 103.

The reason the bomb was placed on Pan American Airlines Flight 103.

The commander on the U.S. Navy ship U.S.S. Vincennes, Captain Will Rogers III, recklessly ordered the shooting down of an Iranian airliner that had just departed from nearby Abadan and was climbing on a regular scheduled flight on a civil airways. The 290 people on that flight were going to holy sites in Saudi Arabia, as part of Ramadan, and known as the Hajj. That occurred on July 3, 1988.

Shortly after it happened, President Ronald Reagan justified the U.S. Navy commander's shooting down of the aircraft and the murder of 290 people.

President George H.W. Bush thereafter awarded the commanding officer, that ordered the shooting down of the passenger airliner, with a medal.

Iranian officials publicly stated that they would retaliate. They halted their determination to retaliate after the bombing of Pan Am Flight 103.



It's interesting that Ghadaffi was intensely vilified in the West for this bombing, which he may well not have been involved with at all. BUT that vilification in the eyes of the public has served the Cabal's interests very well....it provided the fertile ground upon which the current disinfo campaign and the demonizing of Ghadaffi has taken root. Because so many believe he was responsible for the Lockerbie bombing, they are programmed into believing any heinous story the MSMind-programming broadcasts.



posted on Aug, 31 2011 @ 01:07 PM
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Saddam wasn't guilty of anything and he swung from a rope.


The new cross drilling for oil technique was used in Kuwait to drill under Iraq and steal their oil. Muslims don't like thieves. Per their law, they punish thieves and call them dogs. So he invaded Kuwait to punish them for stealing.

Saddam killed Kurds? Big deal. We've killed more Kurd's than he ever dreamed of. Plus we gave Turkey the green light to annihilate the Kurds in Northern Iraq. Saddam treated the Kurds better than we did.

Even if Gaddafi was a truly good person, the media can portray him as a nut to justify swinging him from a rope and we'll all laugh at the South Park episode soon to come showing Gaddafi in Hell with Satan and Saddam.

Only Evil wins in this world. Good guys don't finish last. They get killed.





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