Japan Nuclear Plant: No Chernobyl Possibility

reply to post by usanews


Which of course explains the following:

US warships, planes move from Japan's nuclear-crisis coast

U.S. warships and planes helping Japan's earthquake and tsunami relief efforts have moved away from the country's Pacific coast temporarily because of low-level radiation from a stricken nuclear power plant, the U.S. Navy said on Monday. The U.S. Seventh Fleet, in a statement, described the move as precautionary measure.

Nuclear fuel rods fully exposed at Japan reactor

Nuclear fuel rods at a quake-stricken Japanese nuclear reactor are now fully exposed, Jiji news agency said, quoting the plant's operator, Tokyo Eletcric Power Co .

The report referred to the Fukushima Daiichi complex's No.2 reactor, where levels of water coolant around the reactor core had been reported as falling earlier in the day.

Originally posted by meathed
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

Gday,
Good to hear your thoughts on this Proto.
Im going to sit back now to see what extra knowledge you can provide for us all.

Cheers,
Meathed

I wish I had more to share on this issue since it's such an important one, but the New York Times is reporting that these releases of Radioactive Steam might go on for months.

WASHINGTON — As the scale of Japan’s nuclear crisis begins to come to light, experts in Japan and the United States say the country is now facing a cascade of accumulating problems that suggest that radioactive releases of steam from the crippled plants could go on for weeks or even months.

www.nytimes.com...

With the actual cores flooded with sea water, and the normal cooling equipment not working, not only is there no logistical let alone safe way to get people into the cores, but it's pretty clear that if they stopped pumping the sea water in, that they would experience a total melt down in short order.

The fact that they are saying weeks and months pretty much displays presently they don't have any clue on how to solve the problem.

Shades of the BP Disaster this summer where yet another powerful Energy Company this time Japan's Nuclear Power Utility now has to invent how to solve it's own problems it created itself as it goes along.

Over 150,000 people have been evacuated from the area so far, so clearly it's not a 'safe' situation, or one they are going to get under control anytime soon.

Potential for it to get worse before it gets better appear to be high sadly.

Further no one is asking the question of what is being done with the sea water being pumped back out.

Presumably as it super heats it has to be pumped out in a cycle of adding more fresh cool sea water, and more boron to it.

So what's happening to all the radiated and boron treated seawater?

Are we to believe in a disaster zone with roads smashed and the plant smashed that they are safely storing it on sight, or trucking it safely to some disposal location.

So as usual the press is asking nothing but a lot of soft ball questions and taking a lot of pat and canned answers to dessiminate as gospel while the circumstantial evidence certainly indicates a far more grave situation.

Leaving the rest of us as usual to just pretty much hope for the best, and having to accept what ever outcome and what ever they tell us is the 'best' since we have no alternatives on either score.

The truth is that this is another sad byproduct of the Western Powers controlling and price fixing oil at the source. Both coal and oil are plentiful and could be powering Japan but because of the Oil Cartels manipulation it makes nuclear energy more attractive.

One day people are going to learn you get what you pay for, but more importantly often you are going to have to pay for what you got.

Originally posted by Alina
reply to post by Hitoshura

 

I'm in no way saying that it is not a problem, and a big one at that.

I am saying that it is not comparable to Chernobyl, It's ability to cause that much radioactive damage is not as high, even with more than one plant.

Even with a meltdown, although horrible and a tragedy on it's own, still can not cause as much damage.

It's just not really possible, as SirMike explained.

It's like putting a wall between you and an explosion instead of sitting right on top of the bomb like at Chernobyl.

Ah ok, see what you mean now, thanks.

2 exploded reactors with at least one more in meltdown, tells me Chernobyl is going to end up as small potatoes compared to Japan.

Nuke engineer: Fuel rod fire at Fukushima reactor “would be like Chernobyl on steroids”

I hope the report in the OP is correct and this situation can be contained, but there is evidence that it is far worse than what is being reported.

A US military aircraft sensors alarmed the crew that they had been exposed to radiation while flying search and rescue missions... The crew was exposed, and were "scrubbed" to remove radiation...

They believe they detected radioactive Cesium-137 and Iodine-121 particulates in the air they flew through, this could be an indication that at least one reactor core is breached, despite claims to the contrary.

Of course these reports are being scrubbed, minimized, and dismissed as "nothing to worry about at this time"

But that is because Japan would potentially face widespread, dangerous mass panic, I believe.

Regardless, I am hopeful that this situation isn't as bad as it MAY actually be, the quake and tsunami were bad enough alone, the unthinkable potential of a major widespread nuclear disaster added to it is too difficult to imagine.

Scary times.

reply to post by Regenmacher


While Arnie Gundersen does have a bachelors in nuclear engineering he has never worked a day in his life as a nuclear engineer so to call him an expert is a bit of a stretch.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Thanks again.
I share you concerns.
I hate the idea of radioactive steam in the air.( Nuclear Rainbow doesn't really have a nice ring to it, Does it? But I bet you that , that little rainbow glows)
I would like to know where all radioactive salt water has and will continued to be dumped.
And yes,
BP, Chernobyl and Three Mile Island still comes to my mind also.
This disaster has the potential to be the worst man made disaster ever, yet many still cant comprehend it.

this is going to be the wolds worst nuke accident, now there is this finance.yahoo.com... and then this www.myfoxphilly.com...

The reason they keep saying this can not be like Chernobyl is the fact that the reactors are differing designs. In the end it is only nit picking. It is like saying the wound from a hollow point would never cause the same injury as a full metal jacket that is very true, but. They both kill just the same. Look for the news to slow, as the first wave will begin to die, the second wave will be dying in the next 36 hours and the third wave will be brave volunteers and the last that had a clue about the operation of the plants, then nothing more than bodies.

An interesting article on Cnn that has went missing quoted some one who knew the designs very well said “they are essentially trying to put water inside a fully inflated balloon and truly have no idea how much if any is even making it in.” If you know anything about liquids then you know they CAN NOT be compressed, the fact that there is “steam” in the coolant lines is very telling. So if you can not compress a liquid where did the void come from that allowed the steam to collect? Logic would dictate there has been a coolant leak, ok bad news but not catastrophic. However if the water is off the rods this means they are heating up uncontrolled. Don’t let them fool you the containment walls are partially gone. It is not contained and doubtfully ever will be.

Right now they are trying to stave off panic and will be in full spin mode for as long as they can. When you hear the news of an American engineer or volunteer or two dying or becoming sick, then you know the words I speak are true. By then will be too late to prepare. Watch the jet stream now and see where it is going.

Here is a word GE will not want to hear in the coming months THORIUM…….

We should all spend a moment and honor those who are making the ultimate sacrifice for the rest of us. What a terrible way to go.

The truth is that this is another sad byproduct of the Western Powers controlling and price fixing oil at the source. Both coal and oil are plentiful and could be powering Japan but because of the Oil Cartels manipulation it makes nuclear energy more attractive.

One day people are going to learn you get what you pay for, but more importantly often you are going to have to pay for what you got.

The scarey thing is Proto, the first Reactor to explode was made by General Electric and was supposed to be decommissioned next year.

Unfortuately I think this thread is now out of date.

Japanese officials say the nuclear fuel rods appear to be melting inside all three of the most troubled nuclearreactors - AP


www.breakingnews.com...

Originally posted by JohnySeagull
Unfortuately I think this thread is now out of date.

Japanese officials say the nuclear fuel rods appear to be melting inside all three of the most troubled nuclearreactors - AP


www.breakingnews.com...

I will star that.
I think they were there on Saturday already. Now they have to admit it.

reply to post by JohnySeagull


Even the MSM is reporting this now, and using the words "exposed fuel rods"

The core is exposed... all bets are off.... They will need to evacuate the plant itself now, or everyone in the vicinity will likely be exposed to lethal levels of radiation... If they leave and abandon efforts to cool it, and it melts down the very worst case scenario would be likely at ALL of the reactors at this facility.

Well one thing should be taken in consideration is that Ukraine had absolutely no idea what they where doing or how to manage a power plant back then. There was still little know and more then that the morale was very low. After that happened a whole new set of laws were established. So a disaster a big as Chernobyl is unlikely. Especially since Japan has always been on the forefront in safety technology and things like that. Of course I could be wrong. Nonetheless nuclear energy is absurd.

Originally posted by Regenmacher
2 exploded reactors with at least one more in meltdown, tells me Chernobyl is going to end up as small potatoes compared to Japan.

Absolutely right! This looks worse than Chernobyl already.

It's irresponsible that people in this thread, and elsewhere, are trying to downplay the severity of this. Latest I'm reading is the possibility that one of the reactors in partial or full meltdown has already breached the reactor containment floor.

"The situation is getting worse by the hour. We haven't hit bottom yet... We now have reports that unit 3 suffered perhaps a 90 percent uncovering of the core -- this is unprecedented since Chernobyl," Kaku said.

Third Fukushima Reactor Failing

Originally posted by Sanjur0
Well one thing should be taken in consideration is that Ukraine had absolutely no idea what they where doing or how to manage a power plant back then. There was still little know and more then that the morale was very low. After that happened a whole new set of laws were established. So a disaster a big as Chernobyl is unlikely. Especially since Japan has always been on the forefront in safety technology and things like that. Of course I could be wrong. Nonetheless nuclear energy is absurd.

This is worse than Chernobyl.
Dont just join up and then tell us all that we are wrong and that this is not serious.
The first reactor to blow up was a US made General Electric. So dont say the russians didnt know back then. The Americans and Japanese should of know better after the Chernobyl disaster.

The question then becomes what to do next?

Will the Japanese finally admit straight out it's a freaking disaster and start dumping graphite and whatever else is needed on the core and buildings? The Russians [After a few days of farting around] started dumping ton after ton and entombed the reactor.

Maybe it's time for the Japanese to admit defeat and get on with it already?

Originally posted by meathed

Originally posted by Sanjur0
Well one thing should be taken in consideration is that Ukraine had absolutely no idea what they where doing or how to manage a power plant back then. There was still little know and more then that the morale was very low. After that happened a whole new set of laws were established. So a disaster a big as Chernobyl is unlikely. Especially since Japan has always been on the forefront in safety technology and things like that. Of course I could be wrong. Nonetheless nuclear energy is absurd.

This is worse than Chernobyl.
Dont just join up and then tell us all that we are wrong and that this is not serious.
The first reactor to blow up was a US made General Electric. So dont say the russians didnt know back then. The Americans and Japanese should of know better after the Chernobyl disaster.

edit on 14-3-2011 by meathed because: (no reason given)

The reactor didnt blow up ding dong, a hydrogen explosion took out a crane room outside both the primary and secondary containment.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
The question then becomes what to do next?

What can they do?

Realistically, even if there is a worst case scenario here, they are already dealing with severely damaged infrastructure... MILLIONS of people on an ISLAND... Logistically it is a complete nightmare.

Telling people to stay indoors, and remain calm, control information and news, not cover it up, but minimize the severity so as to avoid mass panic. Evacuate as many people as possible nearest the affected sites. There isn't much more or less that they can do at this point, no matter how bad it gets.

Railroads damaged, roads, bridges damaged, airport runways damaged, sea ports damaged... Mass evacuations are logistically impossible, and would likely be as dangerous or worse than the quake and tsunami in regards to loss of life.

It is what it is.... Sadly so.

my sympathies are with the Japanese
compared too the military bomb experiments, and DU floating around it isn't that big a deal.
( like the ones that irradiated all the troops and surrounding civvies)
just anither brick in the wall