Virginia's new 'currency' debuts at the Capitol (Silver and Gold coins), page 1

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Topic started on 21-2-2011 @ 03:26 PM by ugie1028

Virginia's new 'currency' debuts at the Capitol (Silver and Gold coins)

voices.washingtonpost.com

Del. Bob Marshall's proposal for the state to begin minting its own gold and silver coins as an alternative currency to the U.S. dollar didn't quite make it through the legislature this session.

But in honor of the Prince William Republican, coins with Marshall's likeness with the words In Bob We Trust and Bob Bucks have been distributed around Capitol Square. They're called "Ginnies." Get it? For Virginia.

The coins first debuted at the annual Virginia Capitol Correspondents Association dinner two weeks ago, but have cropping up ever since at the state Capitol and the General Asse

(visit the link for the full news article)

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 03:26 PM by ugie1028

This is awesome mews for Virginia!

Need to get the fed off your back?

Do what Virginia is doing and use gold and silver! Well it is still a Bill but I think it may pass.

I think I may be moving to Virginia. I think the dollar collapse is going to happen one day but gold and silver will still be used as a means to trade goods. Although this Bill will allow their state to mint their own gold and silver, it is one of the safe alternatives in case the dollar does collapse.

what do you guys think?

voices.washingtonpost.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

edit on 2/21/2011 by ugie1028 because: I Have a horrible keyboard that cuts me off mid sentence... sorry!

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 03:39 PM by agentblue

reply to post by ugie1028

I think its a great idea since it will be a way to reassert the state's sovereignty. I am all for the seperation of a state from the conglomerate idea of federalism. The power should be with the people and the state not with the whole because the federal idea has wandered too far from the constitution.

one question..... will it be accepted in other states as a form of currency??? probably not but I definately applaud the idea!!! but then again gold and silver is used universally so it should be usable

edit on 21-2-2011 by agentblue because: wanted to add more to my post

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 03:47 PM by whaaa

I think the counterfeiters are licking their chops. Anyone with a vacuum caster and a basic knowledge of metalsmithing can make a mold and crank out coins that look like gold or silver but be completely worthless.

Also how will Virginia deal with the fluctuation in the metals market?

I think it's just posturing and will come to nothing.

edit on 21-2-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 03:52 PM by SevenBeans

Originally posted by whaaa
I think the counterfeiters are licking their chops. Anyone with a vacuum caster can make a mold and crank out coins that look like gold or silver but be completely worthless.

It's pretty easy to spot fake gold and silver.

Originally posted by whaaa
Also how will Virginia deal with the fluctuation in the metals market?

What about it, the dollar fluctuates too.

The dollar could go to zero, not likely for a gold or silver coin.

edit on 21-2-2011 by SevenBeans because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 03:52 PM by TheHistorian

I think this a scary precedent for states to start messing with a policy like this. I know why groups think making their own currency but this creates way too many prblems long term.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 03:57 PM by MichiganSwampBuck

This is not allowed by the U.S. Constitution, Section. 10. "No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; . . ."

However it goes on to say ". . .emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility."

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:02 PM by whaaa

Originally posted by SevenBeans

Originally posted by whaaa
I think the counterfeiters are licking their chops. Anyone with a vacuum caster can make a mold and crank out coins that look like gold or silver but be completely worthless.

It's pretty easy to spot fake gold and silver.

Not really, I've been a metalsmith for 25 years and there are some alloys that look identical to gold and sterling and I can't tell the difference with out one of these.

www.finishing.com...

And what about gold and silver plating on pot metal. Hard to spot.

www.youtube.com...

YouTube Link

Bunch of posers if you ask me.

edit on 21-2-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:09 PM by SevenBeans

Originally posted by whaaa
And what about gold and silver plating on pot metal. Hard to spot.

Easy to make something look like silver.. not so much something that weighs like silver, sounds like silver, conducts like silver etc. etc.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:15 PM by whaaa

Originally posted by SevenBeans

Originally posted by whaaa
And what about gold and silver plating on pot metal. Hard to spot.

Easy to make something look like silver.. not so much something that weighs like silver, sounds like silver, conducts like silver etc. etc.

Actually it's a mute point. The bill failed for the "Ginny" Read the article!

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:15 PM by Blackmarketeer

There's plenty of alternatives to the normal currency, look up "merchant scrips". Probably the most famous of these is the Canadian Tire money, it's accepted by over 400 shops in Canada. Mind you, merchant scrips like these stop just short of being legal tender. Towns and cities have also issued their own currency, used to be real popular back in the 70's, not as popular nowadays. I think most places wouldn't touch it since desktop counterfeiting has gotten so sophisticated and prevalent.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:51 PM by whaaa

I bet I can fabricate some real sterling silver "Ginnys" and sell them to collectors for some real coin.

I hope more states try to make their own coinage; we craftsmen can make a mint.

Metalsmithing technology has advanced so drastically in the last few years, that even mere hobbyist can create the most intricate designs and duplicate almost anything in metal, even live lizards without harming the lizard.

edit on 21-2-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:54 PM by TrueBrit

reply to post by ugie1028

You know what would be better than having a currency which relies on things that the people cannot control, to function properly ? A currency that works in the following manner:

Say you have a loaf of bread. That has a cost associated with it, and at the moment, when its value goes up, faster than the value of the currency , you end up paying more currency for the bread than before right? Well stuff that. How about a currency that is ALWAYS worth the same amount, relative to the cost of the goods you buy ? So , say your bread goes up in price? Who cares, because with your better currency , you will always be able to hand over the same amount of money, regardless of the market worth of your bread. Wouldnt that be better?
Wouldnt preventing house prices going up and down all the time be a better way of making things work? Wouldnt it be better if it was illegal to charge more than a very small amount for what amounts to the basic right to shelter from the wind and the rain, rather than allowing droves of citizens to be evicted , sent to live in tent cities?
Wouldnt it be better to prevent ANY of the market forces from becoming more powerful than the will of the people ? Why yes it would... will anything be done about it... Hell no. Same problem over here in Britain.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 04:58 PM by Xcathdra

Originally posted by agentblue
reply to post by ugie1028

I think its a great idea since it will be a way to reassert the state's sovereignty. I am all for the seperation of a state from the conglomerate idea of federalism. The power should be with the people and the state not with the whole because the federal idea has wandered too far from the constitution.

one question..... will it be accepted in other states as a form of currency??? probably not but I definately applaud the idea!!! but then again gold and silver is used universally so it should be usable
edit on 21-2-2011 by agentblue because: wanted to add more to my post

Being only the Federal Government holds the authority to mint currency my guess is no, it cannot be accepted in other states.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 05:16 PM by Sashromi

reply to post by TrueBrit

Actually, this is almost exactly what the classic Gold Standard did - prior to 1933. From the founding of the US until the confiscation of gold by FDR in 1933, the inflation rate was virtually nil. This means that the 10 cents that George Washington paid for a loaf of bread in 1789 was the same 10 cents as FDR paid in 1932. While nothing can account for the fluctuations in the price of individual items due to true scarcity or over-abundance (record coffee crops, or failures for instance) that would TEMPORARILY increase/decrease the cost of an item, the Gold Standard kept everything constant. A commodities contract - say for a 100 loafs of bread in 10 years time - could do what you literally suggest, but the value of the contracts themselves flucuates. If a loaf of bread is $1 today, and you have a contract to buy 100 loafs in ten years for 100 dollars that's great unless a loaf of bread is selling for 50 cents then. In which case, you would be foolish to exercise such a contract (because you coul buy bread cheaper than the contract stipulates), and its value would be worthless. On the other hand, if bread is $2 a loaf in 10 yeras time, then your contract has actual value above its 'face value' of $100.

But either way, a Gold Standard is the only true way to keep items in constant prices, relative to one another.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 05:29 PM by Xcathdra

reply to post by Sashromi

For the most part I agree with what you are saying, but the one issue I see is the fact Gold has inflated over the years. Right now its close to $1,400.00 a troy ounce, up form $250.00 +/- from a few years ago. If gold is used as a currency, how do you control the amount of it in the system?

In 2010 alone there was close to a billion dollars in mined Gold from Alaska alone.

To be honest the only method I see where "currency" would not be affected by inflation would be to issue credits with no backing at all on them, and instituting that credit as a one world currency. Absent that you are still going to have countries / entities who want to manipulate the currency in order to profit from possessing it.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 06:19 PM by RestingInPieces

Originally posted by TrueBrit
reply to post by ugie1028

You know what would be better than having a currency which relies on things that the people cannot control, to function properly ? A currency that works in the following manner:

Say you have a loaf of bread. That has a cost associated with it, and at the moment, when its value goes up, faster than the value of the currency , you end up paying more currency for the bread than before right? Well stuff that. How about a currency that is ALWAYS worth the same amount, relative to the cost of the goods you buy ? So , say your bread goes up in price? Who cares, because with your better currency , you will always be able to hand over the same amount of money, regardless of the market worth of your bread. Wouldnt that be better?
Wouldnt preventing house prices going up and down all the time be a better way of making things work? Wouldnt it be better if it was illegal to charge more than a very small amount for what amounts to the basic right to shelter from the wind and the rain, rather than allowing droves of citizens to be evicted , sent to live in tent cities?
Wouldnt it be better to prevent ANY of the market forces from becoming more powerful than the will of the people ? Why yes it would... will anything be done about it... Hell no. Same problem over here in Britain.

Then how would an economy grow larger????

The whole idea of taking money off of the gold standard is because all the currency in the world already greatly out-valued the gold stores. We were literally forced off of it in order to grow. You'd literally have to mine more gold and silver before printing money to grow the economy.

Oh, let me take that back. You could artificially inflate the value of gold as the money supply needs to become larger... and as the gold is tied to the money, I'm sure you can see the problem with that.

Besides, say we did return to a gold standard. Then what? We have to pay our debts to foreign nations in GOLD? That does nothing but SHRINK our economy. US Treasury says we only have $223 billion in Gold! I'm sure you've noticed that our foreign debt is in the trillions.

reply posted on 21-2-2011 @ 06:40 PM by TheHistorian

reply to post by RestingInPieces

Good points. The return to the gold standard would be a horrible idea based on everything I have seen or heard about us trying to return to it. At one point in time we could have probably managed a transition back to the gold standard but now with our system of voodoo math it would be impossible. If you thought. The last economic crisis was bad the transition back to the gold standard would be economic armageddon.

reply posted on 22-2-2011 @ 04:11 AM by TrueBrit

reply to post by RestingInPieces

To be honest, I dont know that GOLD is a good idea, but I do think that currency value should be set up to follow the value of goods and services, to isolate the population from the mistakes of big businesses and governments. If you buy a house with three bedrooms in one decade, and then buy another in another decade, it should cost the same amount of currency, even though the value of the house may be larger. What I am saying is that currency value should be permanently attatched to the value of the things people buy, and not to other less important matters like debt and interest rates and all that horse crap which is not the fault of the people, and therefore not thier responsibility to solve.

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