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China's Crackdown in Hong Kong (One China, Two Bad Systems)

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posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 09:55 AM
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No doubt the Taiwanese are looking at how china is doing with Hong Kong and maybe glimpsing a bit of thier future:



In a heavy-handed move, Chinas highest lawmaking body decided on April 26 to leave alone Hong Kongs flawed voting laws, and insisted that any proposed electoral changes first go through Beijing. But the process by which the decision was made could, in the end, be more damaging to human rights in Hong Kong. While Beijings interpretation limited voting rights, its future decisions may strike at the basic rights of free expression, association and assembly that are key to Hong Kongs viability as an information-age city. The Chinese authorities were not resolving a textual ambiguity or simply interpreting the law. Instead, by adding additional procedural requirements, they changed the rules of the game, essentially amending the Basic Law. The outside world got the clear message that the rule of law was secondary to Beijings interests. Events in Hong Kong have taken a serious turn for the worse. In February, mainland newspapers, clearly acting at the central governments behest, began publishing attacks on pro-democratic legislators in Hong Kong, calling them unpatriotic. After the April 26 move, a senior academic referred to protests over the decision as a sign of a lack of respect for Beijing. And on May 5, in an unmistakable show of saber-rattling, a Peoples Liberation Army naval taskforce sailed through Victoria Harbour.

hrw.org...

Sorry about the long quotes. So what do we have here? Basically China is no longer living up to thier promises. Thier rule did not even last a decade before they started trying to quell free speech and free press. Recently 350,000 people in Hong Kong took to the streets in protest (some reports placed it as high as 500,000) of theses and other attempts by the mainland government to force changes in thier system that would violate thier basic rights.
All of this and thier constant threats aimed at Taiwan will do one thing and one thing only: Convince the people of Taiwan that independance is thier best option.

Sorry about the long

[edit on 11-7-2004 by FredT]




posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 10:14 AM
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Well what do you expect from a Communist stae country? Ofcourse they would do this.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 10:24 AM
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Originally posted by AD5673
Well what do you expect from a Communist stae country? Ofcourse they would do this.


Im not shocked at all, but several of the mainland posters trying to paint a different story. Why would anybody in thier right mind vote for thier system. Oh yeah, the gun thats to the back of my head.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 10:30 AM
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HAHA the 1 country 2 systems moto is a joke, there really is NO voting here and NO we cant elect our own governor or Chief Executive as the position is now called Bejing kindly does that for us.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 10:38 AM
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Originally posted by drunk
HAHA the 1 country 2 systems moto is a joke, there really is NO voting here and NO we cant elect our own governor or Chief Executive as the position is now called Bejing kindly does that for us.


When did Hong Kong election? Under British colonial rule?

This shows the clear hypocrisy of the West.

Who appointed Bush to be president? Not the people of US, but Supreme Court.

How pathetic that US policies are dictated by Jewish interest and mass media as well, and your precious and brave US soldiers are used as cannon folders for Israel interests.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 10:44 AM
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No not even under British rule and not even now ,Hong Kong people have wanted to elect their own Chief Executive but Beijing wont let us.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 11:58 AM
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Originally posted by drunk
No not even under British rule and not even now ,Hong Kong people have wanted to elect their own Chief Executive but Beijing wont let us.


Thanks for admiting that even under another cradle of Western democrazy, there was no democrazy in Hong Kong under British Imperial Rule.

Even today, Hong Kong has more say on their delegates than under British. I know eventually now is not appropriate. The major obstacle is that the West and Cult are using the freedom in Hong Kong to attack central government. Eventually there will be group aided by the West, adovacting Independence of Hong Kong, just like Taiwan. Will Chinese people allow that? No way


By the way, thanks for the warning


[edit on 11-7-2004 by zcheng]



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 04:02 PM
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In british time, HongKong is only a colony. While,now HongKong is part of China, they have their right back, why can not they vote?

I dont care HK's past, I care its future.

Communist is really really really dissappointed



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 05:26 PM
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Originally posted by superpyz
I dont care HK's past, I care its future.
Communist is really really really dissappointed


I have doubts that you are a real Chinese and from Mainland. Can you tell me where you are from?

Political system and Social development is a long process. I think you would rather prefer China follow the Soviet Union, and Chinese people suffer?

If you are one of FLG or so called MingYun, I will have no more words with you.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 06:40 PM
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ni zhe xiao zi zhen hui luan shuo hua, wo you wo de guan dian, ni you ni de guan dian, wo xiang zen me shuo jiu zen me shuo, ni yuan bu yuan yi shi ni de wen ti. wo bu shi shen me FLG, wo ye bu shi shen me min yun fen zi. ni zhen you dian e xin, da jia dou shi zhong guo ren, ping shen me jiu ni shuo de shi dui de? da jia you bu tong de guan dian, jiu tao lun er yi. tian tian jiao xiao ai guo ai guo,ni zhe jiao ai guo? KAo, wo ye lan de li ni le.
gao shu ni, wo lai zi zhong guo da lu, mei tian wan shang kan xin wen lian bo.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 06:49 PM
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Zcheng, I begin to doubt your nationality too now.
If you are a real Chinese, tell me what you know? I have my own idea,
listen , I HAVE MY OWN IDEA, I AM A REAL CHINESE.
You act like a spy, why should i tell you my home? I'm from beijing, shanghai, tianjin, guiyang,guangdong, kunming, then what? I watch "xin wen lian bo"because in my hometwon, I have no methods and right to watch CNN. In my hometown, install satellite TV device is prohibitted, I have to ask local police department to get permission.
How do you know China will be next USSR? How do you know russian people suffer? Have you ever been there? Where r u now? I'm in NYC, mahattan,come on, boy, show me your face. show me your spirit.
89, my cousins struggle in beijing, where r u that time? In a tank? Chinese communist party dose not give us a chance to build a real democracy country. How do you know we can not establish a better country? You have no confidence about Chinese people, I do.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 06:51 PM
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Do you guys over there really see China being able to swallow the center of Asian Capitalism (isn't it?) without undergoing some major changes in it's own system? And for that matter, why on earth would China want Taiwan. It is more western style capitalism to infect your socialism. I think you have a rough few years ahead in China while these basic questions are answering themselves. Don't think for a minute China can control it completely and the slow process will continue...

I feel the US is counting on this in the future and knows that the more western and capitalist China becomes, the less we have to fight about. Make our toys long enough and let us pay you for them will turn you into us.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 07:00 PM
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Superpyz you cant install a satellite dish in your hometown without gettin permission from the police that sucks. Atleast you can have the internet
although I do not know if that requires permission also. The internet is indeed a great tool for the people of the world.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 07:13 PM
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We dont need permission to get access to internet, but the problem is,
some websites are blocked. I never visit www.playboy.com and some search engin in China successfully, even google was blocked once. I dont know what they are afraid?
Maybe Zcheng, give chicom too many hope, while I dont, I just want to bring some freedom idea back to my home and fight for my country.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 08:14 PM
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Originally posted by superpyz
I just want to bring some freedom idea back to my home and fight for my country.


Well said!



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 08:26 PM
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Originally posted by superpyz
How do you know China will be next USSR? How do you know russian people suffer? Have you ever been there? Where r u now? I'm in NYC, mahattan,come on, boy, show me your face. show me your spirit.
89, my cousins struggle in beijing, where r u that time? In a tank? Chinese communist party dose not give us a chance to build a real democracy country. How do you know we can not establish a better country? You have no confidence about Chinese people, I do.


I see you are one of the MingYun. Good luck to you. 89, I was still in high school. The movement of 89 was hijacked by the few aided by the West against China. I am glad that goverment controlled the situation, although I see some measure might be controversial. The crackdown was necessary.

I got a signature from Kelly and his wife Teresa, not long ago.

You are entitled to your opinion. Just think what will be good for Chinese people, when you speak and do. Eventually, China will be in some form of democrazy. Sure will not like US though.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 08:30 PM
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Originally posted by superpyz
We dont need permission to get access to internet, but the problem is,
some websites are blocked. I never visit www.playboy.com and some search engin in China successfully, even google was blocked once. I dont know what they are afraid?
Maybe Zcheng, give chicom too many hope, while I dont, I just want to bring some freedom idea back to my home and fight for my country.


They are afraid that you will enjoy sites like playboy.com, sex.com, etc all day. LOL.



posted on Jul, 11 2004 @ 08:56 PM
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89's I'm only 11, a primary school student. But I know what's happened, I dont get information from Chinese governmental news agency, either western media. I got information from my cousins, my relatives. My relatives told me what's happened, because they were there, because they saw the truth, no matter what you call me, minyun or whatever others. I'm a free man, I'm absolutely free, nobody can control me, control my brain.

Like many other chinese students in US, we still watch Chinese movie, because we like chinese culture. I also check news at www.sohu.com, but I check www.msn.com www.cnn.com too. I can tell who's saying the truth by myself. not Chinese government or US government. I'm not like you, I see democracy as Chinese future, not your ideal communist lead superpower. My family dont have power, or wealth in China. So I have chance to know lower level people live. They are suffering not from western countries, they struggle for their life. They fight for their rights. Do you know how City Manager( Cheng guan) treat them. I know people have to leave their house because their land was sold by governmental officials, they sold their lands to real estate bussinessmen. I dont believe you are not aware this. People don not against communist party, people fight for their basic rights. You said communist party lead Chinese people stand up among this world. you said CCP let people happy. Why I saw so many tragedies? I was a medical doctor in South China. I saw patients died because they have no money to pay their medical fee. Let me tell you this:
We dont hope communist party or foreign countries bring happiness to us, we will fight for our happiness by ourselves.

You really make me sick, how can you judge a people so simply? I'm not a minyun(Democracy activist), I am a international student. I come here by myself, I took GRE TOEFL by myself, I work harder to get my plane tickets. I'm not so luck that I have a communist official dad, then I could get money from people directly.

You still think CCP is the future, I insist democracy is Chinese future. You are like CCP, judge people like betrayer, Hanjian. because they are afraid people fight against them, because they scare loosing their power.

It seems that u r older than me, but I think u r more naive than me.



posted on Jul, 12 2004 @ 12:15 AM
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Originally posted by Ambient Sound
Do you guys over there really see China being able to swallow the center of Asian Capitalism (isn't it?) without undergoing some major changes in it's own system? And for that matter, why on earth would China want Taiwan.


Good point, the more exposure to a free society people get the more likely you will see changes (for the good) in thier political system. Why Taiwan? It really boild down to the same issue every time..... Money. Taiwan has modern factories, a highly skilled and educated workforce etc. Its would be the same as winning the lottery. Hong Kong was a major player in banking and finance, but Taiwan has alot more high tech type ventures going on. But as we have sen in the case of Hong Kong, There is flowery talk about 2 systems, but scratch the surface and its the same old PRC mentality going on.



posted on Jul, 12 2004 @ 02:37 AM
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Originally posted by superpyz
In british time, HongKong is only a colony. While,now HongKong is part of China, they have their right back, why can not they vote?

I dont care HK's past, I care its future.

Communist is really really really dissappointed

Hong Kong people have always had rights so why do you say "While HongKong is part of China,they have their rights back"? Hong Kong people has rights under British rule its just that tehy werent allowed to elect their own Governor, and its the same now.



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