Curious Pentagon Footage , What Are These Guys Saying ?

reply to post by Shadow Herder

One thing I noticed years ago reviewing the images of the charred bodies from the Pentagon. They are all wearing orange jail jump-suits. Why?

Referring to the photo links (which YOU repeated, yet again....why?? Once is enough, thank you! I will not repeat).

First, from your post, used as evidence in the Moussaoui trial. You claim to see an "orange jail jump-suit"???

Firstly, WHAT makes it look like an "orange jump-suit" of any kind? And, secondly....how do make such an INCREDIBLE leap to "jail"??? Trying to drop innuendo? Sure looks like it.

In that sad photo (and, I am sorry to the OP, but I will break here.....I will be surmising that is most likely a Pentagon worker who was caught in the fireball explosion. The, sorry again, body is intact, and looks as if it suffered no high-G deceleration, as would be the case onboard the airplane. Absent the autopsy records for the specific individual, cannot say if there is any blnut trauma either. Appears not. SO, a "flash burn", and rapid death, *I hope*, was the case).

In any event, not to sound gruesome, but the only "orange" I see looks to be flesh.....internal human biology.

Also these bodies are burned badly yet their clothes are mainly intact.

So, you are an expert forensics investigator?? You can tell that their clothes are "mainly intact" how, exactly??
What other burn scene/victim photos are you comparing, for your "expert" opinion?

Also the man in the dress shirt and belt under the two jail inmates was moved after the explosion.

WHAT??? "jail inmates"??

Man, what a load of......

Here is an idea for you.....if you understand how a court of law works, then why not contact the defense attorney for Moussaoui, and tell him he SHOULD have objected to those photos, when entered into evidence by hte prosecution, on the grounds that they were not depicting the scene as per the claims.....oh, WAIT!!!

Know what? The defense DIDN'T object to them!!! This means, the defense was satisfied as to their veracity!!!


Or, you "know" something new?? Tell the defnese to demand a re-trial, then!! You've blown it wide open!! An "innocent" man may have been convicted!!!

reply to post by G.A.G.

The photograph you provided proves nothing.

Ever sat on a jury? Been in a courtroom situation??

Do you understand that those images were used in a court of law, and accepted by BOTH the defense, and prosecution, and the Court, as valid evidence??

This means that there was NO DOUBT as to what the photos depicted, and that they were actual representative images from the scene at the Pentagon.

They would have had a GREAT deal of corroborating chain-of-custody, and proof of validity....that satisfied all involved in the proceedings.

You lot seem to think, for some reason, that in this "Internet Age" you have some exclusive rights to view everything, that it ALL should be instantly accessible online.

Wake up to the real world.......and try to get some perspective on reality.

The absence of the "evidence" that YOU seem to feel is a sign of deception, is not "proof" of deception!! You (and the lot of "truthers") simply aren't in a position to be privy to evey last, gory detail.

Instead of belly-aching, from behind a computer keyboard, there are many things you could do....the jury who listened to the Moussaoui trial, for example. Perhaps they have no *gag order* imposed on them...ask them, if you dare, what led them to convict. THEY saw it all.....all of the evidence....not just the few snippets that happen to be online!

If they are *gagged*, or otherwise compelled not to discuss, then you may try the defense attorney(s) as well.

IF you really are seeking "truth"...and not preferring to wallow in the "conspiracy" mindset, since that is much more satisfying, eh???

reply to post by okbmd


Good find mate.

It is curious isn't it.

From what little i can gather, they mention AOCC (Air Operations Coordination Center) which as far as i can tell relates to Cargo aircraft.

The CRM DLE 147** also seems to refer to the Marine Corps Logistics unit.

So we have a possible link between cargo aircraft and Marine logistics (moving cargo).

It's also another interesting note that on 'the day', a C130 *military cargo* aircraft was witnesses flying around in the vicinity of the Pentagon.

Whether this has any real connection is for further research, but it certainly seems curious that these guys were mentioning Cargo, Marine Logistics, and witnesses report a military cargo plane in the area on 9/11.

Cheers.

reply to post by spikey


There is no mystery about the C 130. You can listen to the pilot here :-

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by weedwhacker


Two posts in a row, railing others' does nothing to make you appear knowledgable. Obviously you think people who dont percieve things the same way you do, are wrong and have no rights to their own opinion. In my opinion, at this time, with all the information, videos and testimonials out there, there is a 51% percent chance it was an attack with domestic connections and involvement...and 49% chance otherwise. Kinda split down the middle. However before you take my birthday away or use disparaging remarks directed at me anymore...u2u me and I'll debate you there, This is not the place.

Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by spikey

 

There is no mystery about the C 130. You can listen to the pilot here :-

www.youtube.com...

Thanks for the link, i wasn't aware this guy had come forward.

Took him six years to mention he was flying the C130 that was spotted over the Pentagon that day?

Why did it take him so long to speak up i wonder, and why didn't his CO or other higher command release this information sooner? He makes some vague mention of seeing theories springing up regarding the sighting of a military cargo plane in the area, and claims he is disturbed that anyone might think he and his aircraft had any involvement to the attacks..so strange that he would wait so long to set the record straight, as it were.

That's the problem with people coming 'forwards' years after the event, relying on testimony years later is fraught with problems.

It could be the honest truth, or it could be entirely concocted information, with relevant and supporting documentation inserted in appropriate places after the fact to suit the story, which would be a relatively minor bit of housekeeping in comparison to the planning of the entire attacks, assuming it was a partly or an entirely 'in house' operation.

But thanks anyway. An additional dimension to the puzzle can sometimes be the piece that completes a particular part of the picture. People may investigate this pilot and his history..it may turn out he is the salt of the Earth type of guy, honest as the day is long and was good to his mom and pop, or it may turn out he is a nasty bit of work, caught lying many times, and is ex-CIA or some such..either way, it might help move the puzzle forwards a little.

Cheers.

reply to post by spikey


It didn't take 6 years for Lt Col O'Brien to come forward; it was no secret from day 1. His evidence was recorded by the 9/11 Commission.

www.historycommons.org...

Am I the only one who sees the seat ? Pay close attention to where a seat would be if you weren't looking at such a gruesome scene .

Originally posted by okbmd
Am I the only one who sees the seat ? Pay close attention to where a seat would be if you weren't looking at such a gruesome scene .

edit on 20-1-2011 by okbmd because: (no reason given)

I am inclined to think your pic is most likely of a Pentagon employee. Mainly because the body is pretty much intact.

Now this one may be a different story :-

www.vaed.uscourts.gov...

Of course none of them have been publicly identified for good reason so it is speculative.

Originally posted by Shadow Herder
Can someone answer this?

One thing I noticed years ago reviewing the images of the charred bodies from the Pentagon. They are all wearing orange jail jump-suits. Why?

www.vaed.uscourts.gov...

www.vaed.uscourts.gov...


Also these bodies are burned badly yet their clothes are mainly intact. Also the man in the dress shirt and belt under the two jail inmates was moved after the explosion. Look at his belt line.

You said you did not see orange jump suits but when you click the links above it is quite clear they are wearing orange jumpsuits like worn by prison inmates or people in custody.


Its quite plain to see they are wearing orange matching outfits.

Originally posted by reeferman
reply to post by thethingreally

 

oh sweet.. so the pentagon has released the full video from the hotel & gas station .. along with numerous cameras on the building itself to clearly show a plane crashing into the side?

thank goodness it was about time..

just keep ignoring the witnesses..

brilliant video...it's long, watch the first 15 minutes then the last 10...brilliant

Photograph of bodies found inside the Pentagon after Flight 77 crashed into the building

Where does it say these bodies were passengers on the plane?

Could they not be pentagon staff?

189 people were killed on 9/11 at the Pentagon

All 64 people (5 being the terrorists) on the airliner were killed as well as 125 people who were in the Pentagon building itself were killed when an airliner crashed into it on September 11, 2001.

askville.amazon.com...

reply to post by Alfie1

It didn't take 6 years for Lt Col O'Brien to come forward; it was no secret from day 1. His evidence was recorded by the 9/11 Commission.

www.historycommons.org...

The 911 Commission report was proven a lie, why do you support it? Nothing can be taken seriously from that report.

Senator Max Cleland, one of the only vigilant members of the Commission, stepped down in December 2003, and became an outspoken critic of the cover-up. Cleland later said, “This is a scam, it’s disgusting. America is being cheated.” And, “As each day goes by, we learn that this government knew a whole lot more about these terrorists before September 11 than it has ever admitted…. Let’s chase this rabbit into the ground. They had a plan to go to war and when 9/11 happened that’s what they did; they went to war.” 10

Most of the 9/11 Commissioners had major conflicts of interest—ties to the Bush administration and/or certain corporations. Philip Zelikow, the executive director of the commission, was the one who directed the staff regarding which evidence and lines of inquiry they should follow. Zelikow was previously a member of the Bush/Cheney transition team and co-wrote a book with Condolleezza Rice. Vice chairman, Lee Hamilton, a prominent establishment democrat, had previously been involved in the cover-ups of the Iran Contra affair and the October Surprise election scandal. 8

The 2002 Joint Inquiry by the House and Senate Intelligence committees was called a cover up even by one of the two chairman who ran the Inquiry—Senator Bob Graham (D-FL). 28 pages of the report were classified and not released to the public. The contents of the redacted pages discuss sources of foreign support for some of the September 11th hijackers while they were in the United States. 5

www.truthmove.org...

You cannot prove something that was nothing, just like the airplane seat that some of you want to see.

reply to post by okbmd

there were no photos of airplane seats, bodies’ still strapped in their seats, no luggage no suitcases no nothing, that really is identifiable to even believe a plane crashed into the Pentagon. Yes, there are some claims of airplane parts being found at the Pentagon. However, those are claims, and it doesn’t “prove” they belong to said airplane.

As has been pointed out already , you are LYING , therefore , that makes you a liar , does it not ? Just because you choose to ignore and deny all of the evidence simply because it doesn't support your OPINION , does nothing in the way of convincing anyone of your credibility .

You’re the second poster to call me a liar, yet you cannot prove I am lying?
Just because I am not gullible as some are in here, who believes the garbage on television reported about 911, and the proven lies in all the 911 government reports.
You accuse me of denying and ignoring all of the evidence available?
Yet, you cannot provide one credible piece of evidence to prove your OS true.
You cannot show were I have “ignored credible evidence,” yet you continue to make these false allegations. Looks to me, before you start calling people a liar, you might want to get your facts straight.

The newer members don't need to take my word for it , they can study your post history and see for themselves that you continually deny every shred of evidence that has been shown to prove your claims false . This is not a personal attack , I am simply stating facts .

So, calling people a liar is not a “personal attack?”
Your facts are wrong, and everyone who does check my post history will be impressed.

You make all these allegation against me yet, you have failed to back your claims against me, what does that tell you?

Photos of airline seats at the Pentagon have been presented as evidence . Therefore , you are lying about that .

So I am a liar because I don’t see an airplane seat in your photo which clearly shows no seat. How does that make me a liar because you “imagined” there is a seat in the photo?
You are appealing to me on an emotional level, supported by blinding patriotic beliefs in supporting the OS fairytale.

Photos of portions of the landing gear have been presented , therefore , you are lying about that .

Photos of tires and wheels from the airplane have been presented , therefore , you are lying about that .

Photos of pieces of the fuselage have been presented , therefore , you are lying about that .

Photos of one of the engines from the plane have been presented , therefore , you are lying about that .

I.D. and personal effects of some of the passengers was found , therefore , you are lying about that .

Need I continue ? I really don't see the point in doing so , as you will simply continue to deny all of this

Again, you call me a liar because I will not except some photos that could have been photograph anywhere in the world by unknown persons.

I love to see you take many of those photos in a court room, I can guarantee any good attorney can get them thrown out of court as useless, because they are not credible evidence there are no chain of evidence to prove all the photos where taken at the alleged crash scenes.

So I can take a bunch a photo of an airplane Bone yard in Afghanistan zoom in on some airplane wreckage snap my photos upload my images and say here is a wheel from the alleged plane crash at the pentagon and you would lap it up as being all true. If anything I would say you are gullible and you want desperately the evidence to be true.

The fact is the OP on this thread asked a question concerning several men talking, yet we really do not see what they are saying however, we only hear what is being said yet, we do not know for a fact who is saying the information, so nothing was proven in this thread topic. We are entitle to our opinions without being insulted, don’t you agree?

reply to post by impressme

I love to see you take many of those photos in a court room, I can guarantee any good attorney can get them thrown out of court as useless, because they are not credible evidence there are no chain of evidence to prove all the photos where taken at the alleged crash scenes.

Did you somehow miss the fact that those photos were used in the trial of Zacharias Moussaoui ? And the defense attorneys did not even TRY to get them thrown out ? And they were indeed accepted as "credible evidence" ? Did you miss all of that ?

No , you did not . You knew all of this before you even made those irrational statements . You see , the thing is , you don't even really believe what you are saying . You know the evidence is good , you just refuse to admit it because you have some insane need to vilify the USG .

You have stated before that NOTHING , no matter how solid , would ever convince you that it was not an inside job . And don't ask me to dig through 800 of your posts to prove this , because you know it is true .

You have also been known to tell other members that it is okay to post false and misleading information , information that was proven false in the very same thread . Call me a liar and say it aint so . I know exactly where that little gem is hiding .

You have been presented with more than enough evidence that flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon . You will never accept it because you have an emotional need to believe in a conspiracy .

The government won their case with this evidence . If you are challenging it , then the burden of proving it to be fake and non-credible is upon you .

You better get started , you've wasted 10 years already .

reply to post by Shadow Herder


NO!!! It is not "quite clear" that they are in orange jumpsuits????!!! THAT is your assertion???

DISCLAIMER! DISCLAIMER! DISCLAIMER!

I will try to write something, below, in response to this ATS member that will, to some (it does to ME, even as I compose it) seem heartless and unfeeling. It is meant to be a dispassionate appraisal of the facts....

...some also may find it "offensive", and claim it lacks sensitivity to the dead, and to their loved ones. NOTHING can be further from the truth, I must say. This is done with no light heart, nor ill intent, I assure you.
As abhorrent as it is, it is an attempt at a logical assessment of another's bogus "claims"...I have added a gap, vertically, in this post. So that you may opt out....there are no "gory" images, no intended diisrespect, just text.






















Only the strangest stretch of imagination would see charred, blacked SKIN, and the insides of a person, as the skin has sloughed off, to reveal the expected color of cooked meat, inside....and call it "orange jumpsuits"!!!

I AM sorry, but this ghoulish obsession is disgusting. AND, to attempt to justify some weird, and twisted fantasy...of what? Guantanomo Bay prisoners?? For THAT is what ("who"...sorry, pronouns count, even for the accused) is in/(are in) those photos, correct???

To allege that those prisoners, captured and held as a result of the Bush Administration's actions.....AFTER the events of September 11. 2001???!!! Were somehow, what? Transported back in time???

Truly, the "truth movement" is scraping the bottom of the barrel, at this point......delusion after delusion, and ....well....fillin the ______________________.

reply to post by okbmd

My responds to you, can be read here:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
There is no point in continuing to derail this thread topic.

reply to post by impressme

Thankyou honored sir!

I read the first page of this thread and figured I'd skip to the end and throw in my two cents worth, but when I did, the posts appeared to be coming from some other thread, a thread I might add, that has been done to death already anyway, but which I acknowledge has every right to be hashed over again by those interested.

I'm all for free speech, even redundant free speech.

Anyway, the video referenced by the OP is interesting. From the truther perspective, I would love it to be a great piece of evidence to be used against the criminal Bush administration. I would love it to be a piece from a cruise missile with something scrawled on it in real combat military style, the way they used to write on the bombs used in WW2 and 'Nam, back in the day. It would have to be updated for the circumstances, of course. Something like "Death to forensic accounting." Something that would definitely connect it to the perps.

But the fact is, we know nothing about this piece of metal. Nothing. Nothing. Nothing. And just because someone says it came from a light aircraft, not a commercial one, means nothing. We don't know if it fell off a truck a week before 9/11.

If more pieces of the same metal were found all over the lawn and inside the Pentagon, and it were possible to piece the thing together and determine that indeed it came from the Army Beer Cooler in the room the forensic accounting guys were using to go over the financial records, well, that would be different.

In and of itself the video is tantalizing but probably amounts to squat. That'll be two cents, please.

reply to post by weedwhacker


Hahaha, you got owned again at these forums and had your butt handed to you again.

You dont have to take it so personally. The images of the pentagon victims are wearing clothes right? 2 of them are wearing almost identical clothing right? Well these identical clothings also have identical colours right? therefore the two victims are wearing coloured jumpsuits. Why is this so damaging to your case?

I guess we hit a nerve here guys. Must mean something. The 2 men in the images from the pentagon are wearing orange jumpsuits.www.vaed.uscourts.gov...
www.vaed.uscourts.gov...

Hypothesis? Maybe they put inmates, undesirables, suspected terrorists at the location of where they knew they explosion took place at the heliport They blast proofed that wall that was "struck" right before 911. So they knew obviously.

reply to post by Shadow Herder

If the guys in the orange jumpsuits were in handcuffs and leg irons, it would be easier to buy your hypothesis. Even one prisoner dressed in that style with matching "jewellry" stands out in a non prison environment as I know from witnessing the sight. The arrival of a group of people like that at the Pentagon would have been a very obvious cause for alert apprehension by witnesses. Interesting idea though.

Unfortunately also, orange is a popular color for work coveralls, as the following link shows.

www.alibaba.com...