Psychosis: Mental Illness or Spiritual Awakening?

reply to post by RRokkyy

‘Schizophrenia is the action of separating oneself froms [sic] ones [sic] own consciousness. It is the avoidance of relationship to oneself.’ It continues, ‘Ordinary consciousness is also the action of separating oneself from oneself. Schizophrenia is a more intense form of that separation. The cure is simply to stop doing that action of separating oneself.’ And further, ‘Nothing else is necessary. You don’t have to join any group. You don’t have to pay any money. You don’t have to do anything but read these books. You should not stop taking any medications you are on, since Radical Understanding works even if you are on medicines.

I cannot hold with much of the above, these being quotes from the vid you posted. In no way is schizophrenia ‘separating oneself from one’s own consciousnesses. The split, schism, twin personality representations of schizophrenia comes from the movies not medicine.

The human mind has many filter systems. That is because it is capable of absorbing so much information at any one moment. When conversing with a companion we filter out the surrounding noise to facilitate concentration. When an individual is having a psychotic episode these filters tend to disappear or greatly reduce. There is a psychiatric condition, part of psychosis, called ‘acute hearing’. What this means is that if the psychotic is attempting to hold a conversation with you in a cafe – they can hear every conversation in that cafe as loudly as the person talking to them. They will even hear the dripping of a tap at the same volume. Head busting.

Another example of that filter system going down is ‘perfect memory syndrome’ where the psychotic no longer simply recalls what is required at that time...but remembers everything that has ever occurred in their life – all at one time. Every conversation, every movie, every book ever read – right back to early childhood. A head busting experience for sure. (People diagnosed with Asperger’s are often found to have this same syndrome)

The vid does state, correctly, that people should not take themselves off medications. I agree but for different reasons. These medications are dopamine uptake inhibitors, or with the new batch of meds serotonin uptake inhibitors. Dopamine and serotonin are among brain's primary neurotransmitters. To do their work these substances must combine with their receptors. What the medications do – is partially block that receptor so that the dopamine or serotonin cannot connect. The brain does not accept this – and in response greatly increases the quantity of dopamine and receptors – to redress the balance that the medication has altered.

While psychiatric treatment is based on the bio-medical model we will always be faced with ‘they’d be ok if they just took their meds.’ The biomedical model assumes that mental illness, psychosis is caused by a chemical imbalance and they seek to redress it with these chemical compounds. For a moment assume they are WRONG. What they are actually doing is CREATING that chemical imbalance. Therefore when a patient suddenly stops taking meds – and the receptors are no longer inhibited – the patient’s brain is flooded with an excess of dopamine or serotonin – and this presents as psychosis. It can take years to rebalance and requires medical supervision to do so. A patient coming off meds is considered to be relapsing – whereas I would argue they are withdrawing. These withdrawals do not present as sweats – but as an emotional rollercoaster during which untold damage can be done to self, relationships and quality of life. I do NOT recommend anyone suddenly taking themselves off meds without their doctors supervision.

My great-grandmother was a psychiatric nurse. She gave her patients morphine. Guess what? When they stopped taking their meds they ‘got weird’ too.

The situation seems to be that if you experience a manic or psychotic episode and your doc can take you through it without resorting to meds you will recover given time and a safe environment, however, once prescribed meds that alter the chemical balance of the brain your chances of successfully detoxing become slimmer.

Originally posted by Throwback
Are you serious? How many psychotic Tibetan monks do you know? If you're having problems get help...

I don't actually know any Tibetan monks personally and therefore cannot comment, however, I have met a psychotic christian monk before.

This has been brought up at ATS before.

Psychosis is a mental health problem and it is not the fault of the patient. It is NOT a spiritual awakening. To try to say that it is, is just romanticising an illness that is very, very hard on people and their families and friends. There is NOTHING good about psychosis.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Psychosis is NOT an illness - it could be the symptom of one, or the symptom of too many life stressors, but it is not an illness in and of itself.

Originally posted by christina-66
reply to post by RRokkyy

 

‘Schizophrenia is the action of separating oneself froms [sic] ones [sic] own consciousness. It is the avoidance of relationship to oneself.’ It continues, ‘Ordinary consciousness is also the action of separating oneself from oneself. Schizophrenia is a more intense form of that separation. The cure is simply to stop doing that action of separating oneself.’ And further, ‘Nothing else is necessary. You don’t have to join any group. You don’t have to pay any money. You don’t have to do anything but read these books. You should not stop taking any medications you are on, since Radical Understanding works even if you are on medicines.

I cannot hold with much of the above, these being quotes from the vid you posted. In no way is schizophrenia ‘separating oneself from one’s own consciousnesses. The split, schism, twin personality representations of schizophrenia comes from the movies not medicine.

You completely misunderstood the video,however
it is a difficult subject to grasp. MY VIDEO does not mention split personalities (aka dissociative neurosis). The video refers to a split in consciousness itself.

The etymology of the term from the Greek roots skhizein (σχίζειν, "to split") and phrēn, phren- (φρήν, φρεν-; "mind"),

I think the Greeks were referring to a split
in consciousness not in personality.

The Knee of Listening is the Greatest Spiritual
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than from reading every other spiritual book put together. Read it Here

Originally posted by christina-66
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Psychosis is NOT an illness - it could be the symptom of one, or the symptom of too many life stressors, but it is not an illness in and of itself.

Psychosis is most definitely an illness. What on earth would make a sane person think otherwise?!

Are you aware that schizophrenia is just prolonged psychosis

reply to post by unityemissions


Psychosis could be a physiological reponse to significant emotional trauma; for example, death of a loved one. The mind cannot perhaps process the reality of what has occurred, thereby going into shut-down mode. Emotional trauma can affect our physical functions to an extreme degree, affecting our mental stability/reality to the point the mind goes into overdrive in trying to correct/help the body to adjust. People will lose their ability to think in reason, doubt their own existance, doubt all of their previous held beliefs because their mind is trying to readjust to the new reality of their condition. Is this a mental illness, break in self, psychosis or just an adaptive response to the trauma/incident that has occurred? Is it best to treat it with psych meds that oftentimes numbs the mind to the point where one feels nothing? Sometimes feeling nothing is better than feeling all that pain. But eventually, you will have to process the pain and the reality. Do meds just postpone this for you? Good questions and interesting and informative thread.

reply to post by queenofsheba


Seriously, why are you separating any of these things. Why does you mind have to do this? It's so bizarre and illogical. It's all of what you mentioned. It's most definitely a mental illness.

What I'm wondering about this is how you differentiate a psycotic episode from a spiritual awakening, they are very different ideas, yet easy to compare. In my opinion, it pisses me off that someone who has taken entheogens can be asessed by someone who hasn't, and be certified as psycotic, just because this person has no real understanding of the intensified emotional and mental states in which, the person who has experianced the entheogen does. I am also bothered by how quickly a psychiatrist reacts to a situation where someone has psycotic symptoms, and would think nothing of it afterward. In the end, they have no proof of what it "really is" that is going on, so in my opinion, they are afraid and lock up this person who has what they think are psycotic symptoms, and hope they're okay afterward. I believe being locked up and told your experiancing psycotic symptoms is more traumatizing than the intensified sensory experiance itself, especially because it can seem so believable, let alone beautiful. I have had this happen to me when I ingested a strong dose of psychedelic mushrooms. I have no opinion on what it is, because I have no fact or proof of the difference between the two concepts. I just disagree with how these experiances are handled pubically, there is no proof, and ignorance is raging when a concept like this comes up. Overall, it' extremely difficult to differentiate the two concepts of a psycotic episode and a spiritual awakening, because of how little we know of the two ideas. We've only scratched the surface in todays society.

reply to post by unityemissions


Because I don't think the mind is separate from the physical body; they are connected. It is as simple as that. You can most definitely have a spiritual awakening from an emotionally/physically traumautic experience. Why do you think it is separate?

Jesus, there's so much confusion on this topic. This is mind blowing!!!!

THEY ARE ONE IN THE SAME.

You have a psychotic episode?? Guess what, you just had a break from reality and have fragmented your personality.

Guess what this causes?!?! It causes our unconscious to meld with our consciousness.

Guess what this means?!?! It means we have "spiritual" experiences.

THEY"RE ALL ONE IN THE SAME.

It's like you guys automatically associate the word psychosis with a mental institution or the process of taking pharmaceuticals. WHY?!?!

People have psychotic episodes all the time and don't go to a doctor or get on meds.

I just don't understand how you guys don't see they are the exact same thing in most circumstances.

Originally posted by queenofsheba
reply to post by unityemissions

 

Because I don't think the mind is separate from the physical body; they are connected. It is as simple as that. You can most definitely have a spiritual awakening from an emotionally/physically traumautic experience. Why do you think it is separate?

WTH are you talking about?!

I don't believe the mind is separate from the body either.

I DON"T THINK THESE ARE SEPARATE.

It's like I'm talking to toddlers here.

reply to post by unityemissions


Why does you mind have to do this?

I thought your question was what does your mind have to do with this? Sorry if I took it out of context. I was trying to answer your question and apparently misunderstood what you were saying. My philosophy stands, though. I believe emotional trauma causes a physical response and the mind can react in any number of ways. How one responds to it is individual. I know people that have seemingly handled extreme trauma so well you wouldn't know anything happened, some choose to deal with it entirely different. Eventually we all come to terms, (hopefully) to the trauma that causes our emotional/physical pain. Does handling it well mean there is no psychological trauma? Or does it mean they are handling their experience spiritually? Does using religion/spiritual beliefs to get through a hard time preclude people of the label psychosis? Does it preclude them from a psychological label because they deal with it in a different way then going to your psychiatrist for meds?

Not everyone who has suffered with Psychosis has a Spiritual Experience or something that could be likened to one.

Not all Delusions and Hallucinations that go hand in hand with Psychotic Disorders are based around God, Jesus, the Devil, Demons, a higher state of consiousness, heightened awareness, psychic phenomina etc.

reply to post by christina-66


If it destroys people's careers, families, and friendships its bad.

It doesn't matter if its called schizophrenia, demonic possession or kundalini awakening.

It ruins people's cognition and perception.

Thats not what I call an awakening.

People are not going to find gnosis at a bookstore, on the internet, with some new age guru and especially anything coiled in their rumps.

Just my opinion from having worked in an ER for a decade... Nope, what I saw had nothing to do with any sort of spiritual awakening. It had to do with destroyed lives and destroyed hopes. It had to do with fellow human beings suffering from such a horrific illness that they could not reach their potential and there is really no way to help them fully. If what I saw is supposed to be a spiritual awakening.... I want no part of that. Of all of the things Id seen and experienced in that ER.. things that I cant ever unsee or unhear.. the people who were so effected by mental illness were the most horrible and the things that stick with me. Not just the things they do... but that they are trapped in that place or state is nightmarish. ANY mental illness is a nightmare.

Originally posted by unityemissions

Are you aware that schizophrenia is just prolonged psychosis

edit on 13-1-2011 by unityemissions because: (no reason given)

I'd lol if your statement wasn't so concerning. People diagnosed with schizophrenia have likely had at least one psychotic episode, preceded by, or followed by a depressed episode. (It used to take years to label a patient now it can happen with simply one episode - that label alone can ruin a life as career opportunities dissipate.) There is not yet a label describing anyone living in a permanent state of psychosis - because it simply does not happen. That's why I refer to it as a symptom - not as an illness. Any further psychotic episodes are likely to occur if/when the sufferer stops taking the medications for the chemical imbalance reasons I referred to in an earlier post.

Psychosis will last for a period of weeks - occasionally stretching to months but it is NEVER a permanent state and there is always some form of trauma behind it that is more complex than the simple bio-medical/chemical imbalance/faulty genes explanation presently in favour by the medical profession. I may catch flu every two years - does that mean you will label me as being 'fluistic for the rest of my life?

I think that spiritual awakenings can often start with something very similar in nature to a psychotic break.
But I don't think even a few psychotic breaks are any sort of spiritual awakening.

Repeated psychotic breaks destroy the brain, and the person.

In many cultures, when one is headed towards a break, that is when the shaman steps in to help them through it. Our society doesn't have a lot for that.

Even if they are a spirtual awakening, one can get lost in the experience, and destroyed by it. Repeated psychosis destroys the brain- the ventricles enlarge, the lobes shrink.

Crowley talked about the abyss. He wasn't a dumb man. It is what will change you- you can either plunge into it voluntarily or it takes you. It will change you. If you have the strength of spirit to pull yourself back together and assemble yourself as a stronger, more spiritual, enlightened person, then I think one can call their plunge into psychosis a true spiritual experience. Otherwise, you are sick. Most end up sick.