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Oathkeepers

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posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 03:09 AM
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Hello my fellow ATSers! I want to bring attention to a cause that I feel strong about. I know there is a lot of uneasiness in the world today. I know a lot of you feel uneasy and scared. However, I want you to know that there are a lot of us out there that will not tread on you rights, that respect the constitution, and believe in the republic.

Oathkeepers

I am a government employee. I gave an oath to this country as did many of my peers. I took this oath seriously. I will protect, defend, and uphold the constitution to my utmost ability. Please know that I joined the Marines when I was young to protect and serve my country. I feel proud that my grandfathers served in WW2 and Korea. I felt I had something to live up to and I am proud to have served. Now, I am still in the government, a part of an agency taking a lot of heat lately. But, know that I have (and many others like me) have our peoples rights in mind. We love our constitution, country, and you!

Richard Mack

I took an oath and I will honor it. Many took an oath and they will honor it.




posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 03:59 AM
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It's great to see that the oath one takes means something to someone instead of it being just some arbitary formality that you have to pass to be able to get on with your career. I'm sure there WILL be a time when there is no more sitting on the fence and you HAVE to decide whether you want to help to uphold the status quo or do what's right. I just hope there are enough people like you out there.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:06 AM
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Originally posted by gator1177
Hello my fellow ATSers! I want to bring attention to a cause that I feel strong about. I know there is a lot of uneasiness in the world today. I know a lot of you feel uneasy and scared. However, I want you to know that there are a lot of us out there that will not tread on you rights, that respect the constitution, and believe in the republic.

Oathkeepers

I am a government employee. I gave an oath to this country as did many of my peers. I took this oath seriously. I will protect, defend, and uphold the constitution to my utmost ability. Please know that I joined the Marines when I was young to protect and serve my country. I feel proud that my grandfathers served in WW2 and Korea. I felt I had something to live up to and I am proud to have served. Now, I am still in the government, a part of an agency taking a lot of heat lately. But, know that I have (and many others like me) have our peoples rights in mind. We love our constitution, country, and you!

Richard Mack

I took an oath and I will honor it. Many took an oath and they will honor it.



It's all good talk but to be really honest the constitution was destroyed years ago..
What did the Oathkeepers do about it ??
The patriot act has been around for years, the military has been fighting illegal wars and the police force have been stamping on our rights..

Just when are the Oathkeepers going to do something??
WTF are they waiting for??
Maybe when we are all in FEMA camps??
Bit late by then..

IMO..Oathkeeps= all bark and no bite..



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:42 AM
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Who cares? Good for you. Pride can be dangerous.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 05:21 AM
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A word of advice gator1177,

The State Department recently released a paper saying anyone talking of the Constitution is considered a "domestic terrorist".

I too served in this countries military. I was disabled retired. I too was a Federal Employee. I quit because I saw people stealing. I followed regulation and reported those who were stealing/violating Federal Law.

Guess what they do to people who try to uphold their oath? They'll come after you. So I quit and filed reports with the Secret Service and FBI as well.

You are surrounded by crooks, if you want to feed your wives and kids...forget that oath and Constitution and shut up and color and let the crooks rob and pillage. If you actually try and do your duty to your country they will come after YOU.

Why do you think they forced you to sit at the computer and take that Web Base Training about "Office Politics" which tells you to shut up and color and NOT try to follow rules, regulations, and Federal Law?

IF you truly are where you say you are you will know about that mandatory web based training they made Federal Employee's click thru. For your families well being you may wish to cease and desist posting online your a Constitutionalist....and a Oath Keeper.

Those qualities are no longer favored in Federal Service. Why do you think DOD came up with NSPS? If you are in a NSPS position they can fire you quickly if the CO doesn't like you and you have ZERO appeal rights as the old Civil Service had. There's a reason they created that. They want "shut up and color" folk nowadays.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 07:50 AM
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I'll star and flag this thread and offer my thanks for your service to our country - THANK YOU!

People criticize the military for the being in Iraq and Afghanistan all the while forgetting that it was the government that ordered them there.

You follow orders and someone else gave the order to be in those countries.

Oathkeepers is what I might deem to call the "Thin Green Line", protecting the people from their own government.

It takes courage to publicly acclaim your allegiance to the Constitution these days but it is critical that those in high power realize there is only so far they can push you,

Thank you again for protecting our country and Constitution.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 08:00 AM
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reply to post by backinblack
 


What did you or I do to protect the Constitution?
Where were we when the Patriot Act was passed?
Our troubles are due to very few of us saying or doing anything.

Passing blame on our allies helps the cause of freedom how exactly?



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:19 PM
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reply to post by backinblack
 



It's all good talk but to be really honest the constitution was destroyed years ago..
What did the Oathkeepers do about it ??


We enlisted in the armed forces - the arm of the "police state." We saw that this massive, incoherent blob referred to as 'society' was forsaking its responsibilities. If the police state that you fear is to be enacted, it has to get approval from the "E-4 Mafia."

Just in case you don't understand - the E-4s in a number of areas vastly out-number higher-ranking individuals - to the point a "mafia" will develop on the base, where even the CO is virtually powerless to enforce policies.

I am bouncing the ideas of this thread off of that one. Congress can sign whatever laws they want to. I, and a number of other 'oath takers,' have already drawn a line in the sand where we will simply not enforce anything violating a certain principle. You're more than welcome to try and cross-examine me and try to liken my support of wars you deem illegal as justifying your paranoia of a police state. However, I will not try to take your guns, corral you into prison camps, etc.


The patriot act has been around for years, the military has been fighting illegal wars and the police force have been stamping on our rights..


The Patriot Act is controversial, I understand. Personally - I'm in support of it. I know this will freak you out - but I've also read the thing. I've also read documentaries on what the CIA did back in the 70s and 80s. The Patriot Act actually curbs the more extreme solutions that were found by allowing for legal recourse as opposed to hunting accidents, brake failures, etc.

But this is already turning into a long post, and I don't want to debate the details of the Patriot Act and what-not here. It's been beat to death in other threads, and I know when I am hopelessly out-numbered.

There is also no such thing as an illegal war. War, itself, is a direct contest to the sovereign power of the nations involved. We have been fighting a war you disagree with. What else is new? We are there, now, and it would be absolutely criminal to leave prematurely after completely changing the socio-political climate in that region. It wouldn't be too far off from what started the whole anti-US sentiment in the middle-east - we backed these people in the 70s and 80s in their rebellions against the Soviets, promising them the full backing of the U.S. and various economic and trade deals. The Soviet Union collapsed and America drew back into its shell, dreaming of rainbows and unicorns.

And the police are enforcers, not legislators. They -can- go about enforcing laws the wrong way - due to arrogance, error, or incompetence. The best way to deal with this is to *politely* inform the officer of your rights. Typically, they will want you to get out of your car or something of the like to distance you from any possible weapons you may have - Officers live with the knowledge of their fellow officers being killed by some guy who whipped a handgun out from under the seat and blew his head off. It makes them antsy. If you want to stick to your rights, keep in mind that the officers are likely not trying to step on your rights, just keep their head on their shoulders.

If, however, an officer is acting completely out of line - they should be handled in the same way you handle any 'unstable' person - do what you can to put them at ease. Take their badge number down and report the incident to the police station. You may want to carbon-copy a report to a judge or lawyer if it was a severe case.


Just when are the Oathkeepers going to do something??


Statistically speaking, only 2% of the population are eligible for service in the military. The figures are larger for police forces - something a little over 5%, I would imagine - depending upon local standards.

With such a discrepancy, anything we did would have to be very extreme. We can't do much without the rest of you guys.


WTF are they waiting for??


We asked you the same question a few years ago. We sent it by the fastest communication means available, but we're apparently so far ahead that stuff traveling at the speed of light takes a few decades to get to you guys.

I expect you will never receive it, though - communication protocols are yet to be established, and the two packets will likely collide and be dropped completely.


Maybe when we are all in FEMA camps??


I'm sure you'd much rather be left to wander around the grassy plains, boiling grass for food. But, again, another debate.


IMO..Oathkeeps= all bark and no bite..


The Constitution established a system of government by which "barking" was the preferred method of resolving conflicts over "biting." The Constitution was established to define the powers of different levels of government so that "biting" could be kept to a minimum.

Far be it from me to take an oath to defend the Constitution and resort to extremes when things don't go my way in a system of government where many people collectively attempt to make decisions.

We're always carrying a proverbial rifle - we also realize that it doesn't need to be shot, or even pointed, at someone in order for us to resolve problems.



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 04:46 PM
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reply to post by Aim64C
 



You're more than welcome to try and cross-examine me and try to liken my support of wars you deem illegal as justifying your paranoia of a police state. However, I will not try to take your guns, corral you into prison camps, etc.


Even Clinton has admitted the wars were a MISTAKE...
No one would argue that the US is or is heading towards a police state..
You just need to see the way peacefull protesters are treated or how defenceless children,elderly and dissabled people are tasered by police..
As for not taking guns, ask the peacefull homeowners during Katrina about how that idea works..

I thank you for your reply but I still don't see any true action by the Oathkeepers and I have been hearing about them for years..
BTW I'm in Australia but we seem to follow US policy or sometimes they try it on us first, as with gun confiscation....



posted on Dec, 9 2010 @ 11:57 PM
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reply to post by backinblack
 



Even Clinton has admitted the wars were a MISTAKE...


I thought anyone who makes it into office was corrupt and evil. How do you know this whole: "The wars were a mistake" drama is not part of their plan to lead you astray?

TPTB have absolute control - this drama over the wars is but another of their tools to delude you.

(Not that I believe in "TPTB" - but that doesn't mean I can't argue).

Those people have more opportunities now than they know what to do with. Just like when I went to Korea - I formed a bond with those people, and I have kind of 'adopted' them as people I would be willing to put my life on the line for. It's the same way with the soldiers going to Iraq and Afghanistan. No one in the military really gives a damned about either of the Clintons.


No one would argue that the US is or is heading towards a police state..
You just need to see the way peacefull protesters are treated or how defenceless children,elderly and dissabled people are tasered by police..


Sources? I've seen how peaceful protesters are treated. Two uniformed police show up and are immediately verbally and physically assaulted by the protesters for "attempting to stifle free speech."

Let me give you a perspective. In the Republic of Korea (South Korea), protests are registered with the government. Any demonstrations occurring without government approval are shut down. Each demonstration is registered for a certain time and a certain number of people. The police show up one-for-one with the registered number of demonstrators. It is not uncommon to have protests registered in the hundreds and thousands.

The first year I went to Korea - there was a demonstration outside the gates of the small U.S. Navy base. Some 800 students were registered to demonstrate and protest U.S. presence in Korea (this was back in '08, prior to the more recent incidents that have practically inverted opinion). Only some 50 showed up, for whatever reasons. The police were bussed in and just sat, chilling out, as the demonstrators did their little thing and went home. No one was suppressed.

America couldn't tolerate it. Americans are very childish in their view of governments and agencies. The Cold War really messed with our collective heads. You place all of the power of the government and "TPTB" into any and every uniformed officer and government employee you see - much like a child places the power of God into his/her parents, teachers, and childhood idols.

A few police show up in the event a few hundred people decide to riot (which tends to happen amongst peace rallies), and suddenly you are being oppressed because you can't handle the simple concept of presence. It would be cute if it weren't such a massive portion of our socio-political instability.

Elderly people being tazered? How else do you deal with an insubordinate or downright hostile elderly person? Beat them, where you could easily shatter multiple bones in their body? Shoot them? I'm sure that'd make awesome headlines. Grapple with them? Again - same problem as beating them. The tazer actually poses the least health risks in pretty much every case where one would be used.


As for not taking guns, ask the peacefull homeowners during Katrina about how that idea works..


This is a blurry-line situation. Burglary was rampant, and there were literally warlords running around with what could only be described as paramilitary combat units.

I do not have all the information, and I was not there - I cannot say whether or not I would have agreed or disagreed with the situation. Ideally - I would disagree with the entire premise; an armed normal citizen is about as good as an armed sentry on my side.

However - many of the "normal" and "peaceful" people had already left. This is a tough and isolated decision - however, a number of people did disagree with it: www.examiner.com...

The only footage I have seen of the events in question shows door-to-door searches of vacant residences. The soldiers knock on the door to make their presence known to people who may still be there. I am not entirely sure what the orders were - but I would have collected firearms from abandoned residences to keep them out of the hands of criminals. www.claytoncramer.com...

The order came from the state level (the only ones who can directly order the national guard) and resulted in a number of legal repercussions that have, more or less, established the precedent that it will not be tolerated in the future.

It is my observation that the whole scenario was blown out of proportion. The difference between post-Katrina New Orleans and any functional city in the U.S. is the difference between Egypt and Rome. I suppose one could argue: "Well, wouldn't it be convenient if this happened all across the U.S.?" Not really - considering it would effectively trigger a continental apocalypse.


I thank you for your reply but I still don't see any true action by the Oathkeepers and I have been hearing about them for years..


As I said - only 2% of the population are eligible for military service - even eligible to take the oath. "We" could take action - but it would have to be fairly extreme action and effectively be us imposing our will on the nation as a whole. That's called an oligarchy.

"We" could put an end to the national government - force a complete reboot of all elected and appointed seats, as well as seriously disrupt both political parties and their leadership. The special forces learned a special type of warfare for bringing down social networks (like political parties) for use against AQ - and a number of them get out of the service and train the militia units.

It could be done.

Then what? Who fills the void, makes the decisions, decides how things are going to proceed from there? The "OathKeepers?" What about the people who are opposed - quite violently - to that degree of change? Round them up into camps, confiscate their guns?

The job of the "OathKeepers" is that of a vanguard. We are not supposed to act as overlords. We are the failsafe. Our job is to bounce the ball back into play, rather than steer it around the court.


BTW I'm in Australia but we seem to follow US policy or sometimes they try it on us first, as with gun confiscation....


It's the other way around. America is one big tourist and buys into import government policies like it buys into import chocolate. Again - it's almost cute if it weren't the cause of some serious problems.



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