Unemployment Benefits Expire

reply to post by freedish

Originally posted by freedish

OH PLEASE!!!
Our poverty in this country is NOTHING compared 3rd world countries like Haiti.
They are living in aluminum shelters now because of the earthquakes.
Oh not to mention they have to deal with a cholera outbreak.

And I feel badly for those who are suffering in the third world. I truly do. Unfortunately we are not discussing them. We are discussing the problems of a first world country and this straw man just doesn't apply.

If your neighbor lets his house go to Hell, do you, in turn, allow yours to fall into disrepair? Of course not.

Still... I can reference you to many areas of THIS country that are scarcely better off than the third world, and we don't have a catastrophic earthquake to blame for their plight.

Originally posted by freedish

Stop acting so spoiled. Just because someone is a millionaire doesn't mean that they're
sucking up all the money from you.
In fact it's the opposite. People with money create jobs.

Well then, by all means, would you please call all of these millionaires and remind them that we've lost hundreds of thousands of jobs due to downsizing and outsourcing - all while they were enjoying their Bush tax cuts for the rich?

People with money are supposed to create jobs. So... where are they, now, when we need jobs? Oh, that's right... They are telling us that they need to answer to Wall Street first.

Oh, and yes, we have a consumer driven economy. That means that the rich DO get their money from us. They provide a product or service and we pay for it. The problem with this, these days? Deregulation has destroyed competition, created monopolies, and turned us all into forced patrons of some of our services and products. Don't believe me? Try telling your power company to take a flying leap... and then you'll realize that you really don't have a choice BUT to deal with them.

Originally posted by freedish

Here''s a question, what if you became a millionaire by working your ass off
and the government decided to take half your income?
Would that seem fair to you? Even though you have a lot of money you earned it.

Half? The tax rates for the top 2% of Americans is between 28 and 35%. But this is misleading as it does not account for things like tax shelters and write offs. By way of comparison, a person who makes $34,000 a year pays 25% of their income in federal taxes while a person making $171,850 pays just 3% more.

You do realize that the middle class pays taxes too, right? Or do you buy into the myth that only the rich are taxed and the middle classed and poor all get fat, fat checks come April.

Whose shoes would you rather be in? I realize that neocons love to speak in absolute dollars where taxes are concerned, while ignoring percentages - as it suits their cause better to do so... but, in the end, who is more likely to survive... they man with 5 loafs of bread, who pays 1 in tax, or the man with 100 loafs who pays 10?

Originally posted by freedish

This is the land of opportunity, come up with a good idea and roll
with it man, don't blame 'greedy corporations'. Ugh.

You do realize that just this week, during the worst economic upheaval since the Great Depression, American Corporations just posted the largest profits in history?

Let me paint that a little more clearly. While the American worker is drowning, American corporations just pocketed more money than ever before.

Do these two dots not connect to you? They certainly do in my eyes. If the corporations were struggling right along with the rest of us, it would be one thing. But they are more wealthy than ever. Our suffering is their gain. They are biting the hand that feeds and, as sure as the sun rises... They will get bitten back.

~Heff

For those who are still into this left-right thing, please step out of la-la land.

It has been disclosed that the Fed made somewhere up to 9 trillion in loans at 0.0078% interest to bankers during the 2008 financial crisis. This near free money was then borrowed by the government from these banks at a much higher interest. Or better yet, this free money was then run through the population at 29% interest credit card rates.

Maybe be the people that get unemployment benefits are lazy, maybe they are not. But if the Fed can afford to loan (at near zero interest) bankers 9 trillion in order to support Wall Street profits (corporate welfare), I think the question of whether or not we can afford to grant extensions on unemployment benefits is really the wrong question.

Really? 9 trillion at near zero interest......and we are all debating about the affordability of unemployment benefits?

Really?

reply to post by SaturnFX


Finally!


naw, well yeah...

but i do see the need. i mean if i didnt have unemployment i couldnt sit at home all day on the internet...

reply to post by wutone
That's the point.

To keep all of us arguing about nothing.

So,what is the real problem?.

Equally interesting is the gross number of people who just glass over the fact that the GOP have repeatedly said they would be more than happy to extend the already overextended benefits if they could be funded via cuts to other areas of government spending rather than just added to our childrens' credit cards. Anyone who is getting angry at the GOP over this while not also getting angry at pet DNC funding projects that do nothing to put food on American workers' tables is a hypocrite.

The one year (!!!???!!!) extension bill they blocked would have cost $54 Billion. The Democrats weren't even willing to eliminate earmarks based on what a "small fraction of the overall budget" they represent. Why then would they have any interest in doing what every working class American is essentially forced by law to do, balance their checkbook? If the average American operated the way the government does, they'd be on a most wanted list for credit fraud and writing bad checks. Yet, when a party actually attempts to change that, they get crapped on by the people who buy into the liberal machine's "it's our duty to provide for them!" propaganda while simultaneously ignoring the fact that those dollars MUST come from somewhere and our future generations' prosperity is not a morally just source of funds.

Originally posted by Darkrunner

Answer my question.

Calm down mate, this is supposed to be a civil discussion is it not? Oh, I remember now, you deem a civil discussion to include insults and calling other posters 'children' who don't agree with your point of view.

How long should unemployment benefits be extended? Another 99 weeks? Five years? Ten? More?

As long as necessary. It's not the unemployed persons fault they are too sick, too old, too overqualified etc in a market that's outsourcing everything to India. I notice you conveniently skip over those most important facts.

There. I've answered your question against my better judgement. Usually I would completely ignore demanding tyrants like you but I'm feeling rather happy today so why the hell not.

reply to post by burdman30ott6


No offense, but blah, blah, blah......

The future generation will just do what has been done in the past, which is print more money, to fake a false sense of security.

The problem is, it's just paper, so why the worries?

It manages to buy groceries, though.

Cut, cut, cut, and make some more paper dolls, that is what the feds do.

This......

Originally posted by Darkrunner
The problem with unlimited unemployment benefits is many people don't even bother looking for work anymore.

Believe me, I know several of them, and they disgust me.

Contradicts this......

Yes, I have been unemployed. And I collected about 2 months of unemployment before I found work. My beef isn't with unemployment, it's with people that milk it for as long as they can before looking for work.

Regarding the soup kitchen, I've seen you mention this before, and I'm not sure what bearing this has on the topic of people milking unemployment benefits, but no, I don't volunteer, as I live in a town of about 3000 people. We don't even have a soup kitchen to my knowledge.

Going back to the 'many' argument that I defined for you using dictionary definitions and real stastistics, you still haven't answered why you believe MANY (meaning millions) of people don't even bother looking for work any more. Have you spoken to all 29.8 MILLION unemployed people and found each individual reason why they are or are not looking for work?

Didn't think so. Until you have spoken to ALL 28.9 MILLION of them, your opinion counts for naught.

Awaiting the "go away little boy, you are such a child" type of 'intelligent' response.

Originally posted by Darkrunner


I would say maybe ten percent are milking the system. And out of circa 29 million unemployed, that's 2.9 million too many, IMO.

Yet again with made up figures. Please, for the love of denying ignorance, if you are going to post statistics make sure you can back them up with verifiable evidence.

I see no evidence that 10% of unemployed are milking the system. SHOW ME YOUR EVIDENCE.

Originally posted by Blanca Rose
Cut, cut, cut, and make some more paper dolls, that is what the feds do.

Cut, cut, cut would rectify this situation quite nicely...
CUT some programs
CUT some government waste and
CUT the taxpayers a break for a change instead of just tacking on more uncoverable debt and the interest rates that accompany it.

Those pieces of paper aren't going to buy jack squat, let alone groceries if the government continues to devalue them by just racking up the debt and printing more bills. I'd kinda like to see the ones they've already printed get a chance to not suffer from rampant overpopulation and serve some purpose in their lifespans, like actually retaining their value.

I'll ask you, exactly how important are further extensions of unemployment benefits? Obviously they are important enough to lambast abyone who doesn't support them, but are they more important than, say, indescriminate federal student aid? PBS? funding for the arts? Earmarks? As I said, it's hypocritical and disingenuous to degrade people for actually caring about the value of the dollar rather than simply jacking up the printing presses and hot charging the credit cards. At some point the debt will become such that all the unemployment benefits in the world won't buy a damn thing because our money will be worthless and inflation will be uncontrolable... then I suppose short term memory kicks in and the blame will again be turned onto the government for not being smart enough to stop racking up more debt.

Originally posted by Darkrunner
The problem with unlimited unemployment benefits is many people don't even bother looking for work anymore.

Believe me, I know several of them, and they disgust me.

People are looking for work there just really is no jobs out there for people to make enough money to live off of. You cant even get a job at some fast food joint because they'd rather hire some 16 year old and pay them $5.50 an hour.

Id love to see people like you out of work and have to worry about the lights being shut off while walking around with a stack of applications. You disgust me.

9 trillion dollars given to the 6 biggest US banks during March 08 - May 09, and the fed now proposing to add extra funds to the EU bailout (around 500 billion euros for Spain, and 600 billion for Italy may be needed).

And they just cut unemployment benefits?!!!

REVOLT REVOLT REVOLT!!!!

reply to post by burdman30ott6


All those things are important. Did you see the Diane Sawyer special about China? They have more college graduates now, than the US does, and that isn't just because there are more of them.

China has lived under austere reigns for decades, and now they are one of the front runners in the global economy.

Something stinks, and it isn't in Denmark.

My point is, we can't keep just printing money, because it's worthless.

Outside of everything important that you mentioned being cut, have you been to the grocery store lately?

Mayhem is going to happen soon. We cannot go on the way things are. Children can't even get an education in the US unless they come from money, or take on student loans for the rest of their lives.

Who's going to run this place shortly? Pretty scary thought.

reply to post by Blanca Rose


I do not entirely disagree with you.

China is a different animal entirely. They are still a communist nation where your capacity for wealth is restricted solely by the government rather than by your own merits & skills. I didn't see the Dianne Sawyer program, so I cannot comment directly to that (I haven't watched her in many years and didn't even realize she was still around.)

I do not consider many of the places our dollars go to be that important. The arts, for instance, are fine for times of prosperity and plenty, but they aren't going to feed and clothe the land. In my opinion, we have skewed priorities when we are virtually insolvent, yet still dumping dollars into sucking economic voids like the arts, international aid, hypothetical pseudoscientific experiments (like wind farms), and educational grants/aid based solely on a person's background rather than on merit (if you cannot make it in school, your failure shouldn't be paid for by the tax payers.) Not that I am on board with either party's incessant policing of the world and the expenses that sets at our doorstep, either.

I have lost hope for any form of riots, revolution, or even organized resistance to government malfeasance in America. We are the Romans before the fall. Fat, unmotivated dullards who are too afraid to take any risks because of the potential pitfalls associated with them, regardless of the fact that we can see the butcher's hooks swinging for us just down the road. We'd rather crawl headfirst into guaranteed death and destruction on the path of the many than show some spine and take a risk that might lead to the same on the path of the few.

Originally posted by burdman30ott6
reply to post by Blanca Rose

 

I do not entirely disagree with you.

China is a different animal entirely. They are still a communist nation where your capacity for wealth is restricted solely by the government rather than by your own merits & skills. I didn't see the Dianne Sawyer program, so I cannot comment directly to that (I haven't watched her in many years and didn't even realize she was still around.)

I do not consider many of the places our dollars go to be that important. The arts, for instance, are fine for times of prosperity and plenty, but they aren't going to feed and clothe the land. In my opinion, we have skewed priorities when we are virtually insolvent, yet still dumping dollars into sucking economic voids like the arts, international aid, hypothetical pseudoscientific experiments (like wind farms), and educational grants/aid based solely on a person's background rather than on merit (if you cannot make it in school, your failure shouldn't be paid for by the tax payers.) Not that I am on board with either party's incessant policing of the world and the expenses that sets at our doorstep, either.

I have lost hope for any form of riots, revolution, or even organized resistance to government malfeasance in America. We are the Romans before the fall. Fat, unmotivated dullards who are too afraid to take any risks because of the potential pitfalls associated with them, regardless of the fact that we can see the butcher's hooks swinging for us just down the road. We'd rather crawl headfirst into guaranteed death and destruction on the path of the many than show some spine and take a risk that might lead to the same on the path of the few.

If you notice when something happens in Europe or other parts of the world the people actually go out into the streets and riot. Look at the UK and Italy just the other day. Americans just sit there and take it.... almost like its expected. Maybe because as soon as you protest against something the government does like a normal human being should and like our constitution tells us to everyone else thinks you're a nut? I dont know.. its like were not even human anymore.

reply to post by burdman30ott6


The world is a small place now, so, China really isn't something completely different.

As for the arts, some people excel in them, and should be able to pursue them, say, for instance in school. Why should a person who performs better in math be more able to get a grant for a school loan? Both things are just as important. I do agree that those who perform should be first in line for grants, loans, etc.

To be fair then, there should be cuts across the board? The educational system in the US stinks. Kids who can't even read or write have a high GPA because teachers can't teach.

Hey, you know it's getting bad, when on the fourth of July, you pick up a flag that reads, "Made in China."

If I was President I would end unemployment in America in 1 day.


I would say effective today anyone who had enough points into the Social Security system can retire at 55, effective immediately.


There would be no unemployment. We would have more jobs than available workers. 70 million baby boomers would be spending hundreds of Billions buying things, rent, services with their Social Security.

The only reason we try to prop up the dollar is to make the Saudi's think they will get something for their oil instead of worthless dollars. We've secured the middle east. Their demands can fall on deaf ears now.

The Chinese would be mad they'd lose their $1 Trillion loan we got from them. Give them Taiwan. They'd be happy.

Hey, you know it's getting bad, when on the fourth of July, you pick up a flag that reads, "Made in China."

I think its far worse that you have a 1 in 3 chance that the person holding that flag has no idea why the 4th of July is even celebrated.

Originally posted by AndrewJay

Hey, you know it's getting bad, when on the fourth of July, you pick up a flag that reads, "Made in China."

I think its far worse that you have a 1 in 3 chance that the person holding that flag has no idea why the 4th of July is even celebrated.

You got that right!!!!!!!!!!

Hence my lamentations about the educational system in the US.

Originally posted by Pervius



There would be no unemployment. We would have more jobs than available workers. 70 million baby boomers would be spending hundreds of Billions buying things, rent, services with their Social Security.

Gee, what a wonderful idea. The social security fund is just about, if not, dried up. Unless you have been under a rock, you would know that for the second year in a row, people who do get the benefit, are not getting a raise. So, they spend less on what costs more these days.

Nice thought, though.