Man Proves TSA Policies are Unconstitutional

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
reply to post by GlennCanady

 

one question - who owns US airports ?

airlines are private corporations - so despite any silly claims - you [ US citizens ] do NOT have any right of " free travel " via private areoplanes

so - are airports private property - if so - you dont have any rights to freedom on private property

My argument would be that they are subsidized by taxpayers, therefore taxpayers should be granted their constituional rights while on/in/at the property.

reply to post by elevatedone


Based on your reply in this thread, I wonder how in the world YOU became a Super Moderator?
Did the site owners lose their mind when you giving you this privilege? YOU clearly EMBRACE ignorance!
If you dont fight for your rights, then you dont deserve any rights!

reply to post by elevatedone


That's what I'm saying. These people want to just go ahead on board someone's plane that they don't know.

They didn't have automobiles back in the day, so do you think they had planes in mind when they wrote about free travel? No, they meant they wanted people to go where they wanted in their own country, whenever. Just because you have that right to travel, doesn't mean you can go and steal someone's car and say you have free travel, because it's someone's property, not yours!

reply to post by GlennCanady


Yeah well.....good luck with that!

If we can't rid the IRS which also is unconstitutional, you think this fella has a chance? Nah, I doubt it.

Now, here. Have some hay, get back to the pasture and play nice with the other sheep. Baaaah.

Originally posted by elevatedone

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

No, what we have here is an arrogant idiot who wasted not ony 2.5 hours of his time, but 2.5 hours of resources and made a scene, just because he wanted to.


Look, I get not wanting to go through the machine, I really do. It's a frisking, you're not being assaulted or anything, it's quick and easy and in a couple of minutes you're on your way.

What we have is too many people with the mindset of, "me, me, me" "whats in it for me", "screw the world", "my rights, my rights", "i've been violated, give me money or compensation", or plain ole "attentions seekers". In my opinion of course.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

edit on 23-11-2010 by elevatedone because: (no reason given)

No, its quick and humiliating, and people shouldn't have to put up with it. Yeah, yeah, don't fly then, baloney, next it will be military checks on the streets and the old "well don't leave you're home then".

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
reply to post by GlennCanady

 

one question - who owns US airports ?

airlines are private corporations - so despite any silly claims - you [ US citizens ] do NOT have any right of " free travel " via private areoplanes

so - are airports private property - if so - you dont have any rights to freedom on private property

TSA is a government agency. Airports are public facilities. Airlines do not search or screen anyone, the TSA does. Airlines take your money in advance and then it's up to TSA to decide who can or can not fly, not the Airline who has already sold you a service you paid for in advance. If an Airline Employee were to touch you, they would be arrested immediately, only a TSA Officer can touch you or screen you and they are paid with taxpayer money, making them subject to all US Laws.

Your argument is faulty on it's face and has no merit. Were this a debate you would receive a failing grade I'm afraid.

The former head of TSA admitted on camera last week that this procedure is illegal but "necessary". That means to me that this will continue until the first court case hits and then a Judge will stop it because they have to show cause before they can detain or search you and they won't be able to show cause in nearly all cases. Traveling is not cause. It is not illegal. It is not a threat to anyone else.

If Police were to suddenly start randomly patting down people walking down the street for walking down the street, it would technically be the same thing, except the Officer would loose their badge and be prosecuted.

It's nobodies business why a person does not want to be viewed nude by a stranger or not have their genitals touched by a stranger. It only matters that they have the legal right to refuse without being detained. This is a test to see how far they go before people say no, no more!

I'm baffled why so many are so afraid to fly? It's illogical. We know that only about 4,000 Americans have been killed by Terrorist in the last hundred years. We also know that driving to work is hundreds if not thousands of times more dangerous. So we give up our right and our dignity because a some people are afraid of their own shadows and have irrational fears?

Forced nudity is a form of Torture. When it was done to Terrorists captured on the Battlefield it was called Torture by the world and people demanded they stop. They use it because it conditions the victim and strips them of their dignity and makes them easier to control. So why is it not torture now and it is if its done to a known Terrorist? Any thoughts on that at all.

For many people this will be a form of psycological torture and many will never fly again. That means they are being punished without any cause whatsoever. What crime did the Bladder Cancer survivor commit that he deserved to have his urine bag tore open and be forced to board an airplane soaked in Urine. Please name the crime he commited? What crime did the older lady with the knee implants commit that justified a TSO to stick her hands down the inside of her underwear and feel between the folds of her genitals with gloves that likely just touched somebody elses genitals? Neither of those cases are being denied by TSA. They are true, this is happening.

Recently TSA let it slip out on their Blog that they have hired 110,000 people in six years. Prior to that they even refused to answer to Congress about how many they hired. Told Congress "no" in fact. Did you know that Congress has no control over them? Anyway that answered the question. We know that they have funding for 43,000 people only. Therefore almost 65% of TSA employees quit. Those who quit are not allowed to tell anyone why they quit and they sign a document to that effect. Why? Why is employee numbers forbidden for Congress to know? How does that protect us?

Why is the former head of HLS now the CEO of the company that is getting fabulously wealthy selling the machines to TSA he ordered before he left? Please explain as that is also not in dispute.

Why is it the best airport security on Earth does not use nor want to use these scanners or touch peoples genitals? Israel's people have a Degree that takes 18 months to earn and they are versed in how to spot Terrorists before they get anywhere near a plane. None of the Terrorists in the news lately would have made it past their security.

What do we have? We have low paid people who get two weeks training before they start deciding who travels and who does not. The job is so bad that 65% of them have quit even though it is hard times. That is what our glorious leaders have cooked up for us. An Agency exempt from Congressional control, manned by uneducated, low income workers who have never stopped a Terrorist even once. Just the training has cost over one billion dollars and to date all they have gotten for it is 120 various instruments and some packages of marijuana and one fit filled with heroin. The former TSA Director who gave the 120 number and examples on the air then refused to reveal a list because that to is secret. That means nobody, not even Congress would know if this is working or not.

As it is, anyone who wishes can simply place an object up their rectum and nothing they are doing would find it. The former head of Israels Security said in interview just last week, he could easily carry enough explosives through a scanner to take down an airplane, but Israel's security would catch it. They don't look at people naked. They don't fondle childrens genitals. They don't torture old people with implants. ...and yet, their airports are safer than ours. TSA's response was we have more airports. We also have more people. For one billion dollars, surely they could have trained properly 43,000 people by now. I would be safer. You would be safer.

Fear is a powerful weapon and it saddens me how scared some are and how easily they give up their freedom. No Terrorist will ever be caught by a TSO screening a US citizen traveling from inside the US to inside the US. That means the money is wasted and the only thing it does is strip us of our freedom and dignity.

Next time you get in your car and drive, remember you are taking a risk hundreds if not thousands of times more dangerous and ask yourself, would it be OK if an Officer were required to search and test you before you can go the convenience store to get a Pepsi? It's way more dangerous and you are taking way more risk.

I'm traveling for Christmas and I'll walk through the scanner and not do anything untoward, but while doing it I'll know that the Free Country I was born in is no more. It is gone forever because cowards have surrendered to a the Terrorists and our Leaders are using it to rape us of our rights.

"If you're not man enough to stand up for your rights then move out of the way because others haven't lost their dignity or soul yet WILL fight the tyranny of the new world order that some of you like to lick the boots of."

Actually, don't get out of the way. Just drop to the ground so we can all use you as a doormat to wipe our dirty shoes on. At least this way you'll be of some use.

Originally posted by elevatedone

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

No, what we have here is an arrogant idiot who wasted not ony 2.5 hours of his time, but 2.5 hours of resources and made a scene, just because he wanted to.


Look, I get not wanting to go through the machine, I really do. It's a frisking, you're not being assaulted or anything, it's quick and easy and in a couple of minutes you're on your way.

What we have is too many people with the mindset of, "me, me, me" "whats in it for me", "screw the world", "my rights, my rights", "i've been violated, give me money or compensation", or plain ole "attentions seekers". In my opinion of course.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

edit on 23-11-2010 by elevatedone because: (no reason given)

Where are all those "Tea Party Patriots" and defenders of the Constitution now?
Don't tread on me. Or feel me up.

Regardless of accidental deaths from firearms each year, you don't see anyone taking our right to bear arms away, do you? Washington D.C. couldn't do it. Supreme Court determined it was unconstitutional.
www.washingtonpost.com...

The Supreme Court announced yesterday that it will determine whether the District of Columbia's strict firearms law violates the Constitution

NYC Mayor Bloomberg couldn't even pass a law preventing suspected terrorists on an FBI watch list from purchasing a gun in the U.S. because it violates our 2nd Amendment right to bear arms.
www.newsweek.com...#

New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg and NYPD Commissioner Ray Kelly went to Capitol Hill earlier this week in an attempt to convince legislators to pass a bill designed to prevent people on the FBI's (terror watch) list from legally purchasing guns and explosives.

Andrew Arulanandam, a spokesman for the (NRA), told NEWSWEEK the bill is "21st-century McCarthyism." "Our system of justice doesn't say that secret lists can be judge and jury when it comes to denying Americans their constitutional rights,"

The point being it is the same argument. The TSA is trampling the Constitution
Regardless of the risk involved in airline travel we cannot trample the Fourth Amendment.
You cannot, under any circumstances, deny Americans their Constitutional Rights
en.wikipedia.org...

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and Warrants shall not be issued, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Border search exception Searches conducted at the United States border or the equivalent of the border (such as an international airport) may be conducted without a warrant or probable cause subject to the "border-search" exception. Most border searches may be conducted entirely at random, without any level of suspicion, pursuant to U.S. Customs and Border Protection plenary search authority.
However, searches that intrude upon a traveler's personal dignity and privacy interests, such as strip and body cavity searches, must be supported by "reasonable suspicion."

Without reasonable suspicion /no one can be pulled out of line and fondled.

It is a violation of the Constitution.

Sadly this will not amount to anything. The government does not need an excuse to protect our safety. I just fail to see how being groped increases my safety. More likely a distraction from real news.

reply to post by rusethorcain


There are no strip or cavity searches. Get patted down and tell me it's a cavity search or a strip search. Please.

Originally posted by Gnarly
reply to post by rusethorcain

 

There are no strip or cavity searches. Get patted down and tell me it's a cavity search or a strip search. Please.

Why should I? What are you driving at? Why not tell me your point. Please.