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What's wrong with nice guys....?

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posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 03:12 PM
By Kilgore trout in response to Orangetom

Originally posted by orangetom1999
Very few women or females I have ever known are interested in a man who is not at some point in control of themselves. For if he is not in control of himself how can he do anything other than be a liability to them and their children. Life requires discipline...for a woman to have a man who has discipline...or another word for it is gonads...a pair hanging...means she has options. Her RISKS are now lower..her options greater.,,for herself and children or future children. This is also called in a male.."Potential." The "P" word.

What both you and Edrick do not show in your posts is Potential.

Are you a woman? Or perhaps, Bobby Brown?

You are not qualified to make any of those judgements!

That may be what the women you have known may like in a man, something they can work with, you know, 'You', but not every woman is going to go for 'You', just as, you have clearly stated, you're are not interested in all women. Kind of stands to reason, really, doesn't it? As a woman, and from a purely personal perspective, I wouldn't want to speak for all women, that The Quiet Storm is intriguing and potentially quite adorable, at a pinch judgement based purely on his posts, similarly, Mr Edrick there, if I wasn't a confirmed Spinster, I'd be feeling myself coming on a little Elizabeth Bennett I am afraid. I daren't even reply to his posts for fear that I say something unbefitting a lady and completely offend his sensibilities.

In short, I can see absolutely no reason why those two gentlemen are bereft of female attention and you are not. If it was my choice, I know whose company I would choose, but then I doubt any of the women that you spend time with would like me either. I may not be Piece, but, I certainly am not Peace either, you can therefore, be assured that you wouldn't like me either. See? To each their own, rather than, your way or the highway.

Kilgore Trout,

Bear with me here as I have no idea who or what is Bobby Brown also this Elizabeth Bennet.

As to what women I have known may like in a man...I don't worry about it but so much. I know what I like and appreciate in a woman. I will not try out for their approval but so much. I simply do not have much interest in changing the settings and beliefs on my dial for theirs..along with all the RISKS on my part to so do. At least without something truly valuable in exchange from them. And it is not beauty and sex/sexuality of which I talk.

I agree..not every woman is going to go for me. No problem here with that concept. It is not a point over which I am want to lose sleep.

As to offending Edricks sensibilities or TQS..I wouldn't worry about it but so much. If they cannot withstand what is happening on these boards I can assure you they will never make it in the world of men nor women.

I can also assure you that they are not nice guys. They are not even good bad guys. And both are over rated.

In short, I can see absolutely no reason why those two gentlemen are bereft of female attention and you are not.

I'll tell you a little something here about a well rounded man nor woman both. They are ok with a partner or without a partner. They will not melt into the background clutter in disarray if they don't have a partner. They are comfortable with themselves either way. They don't spent inordinate amounts of time on on the phone or text messages trying to be a player or looking for confirmation of who and what they are. They don't spend alot of time calling their mothers or others et al.

With women when I detect that they spend alot of time calling mom with their problems...I often conclude that they have problems for which they don't want to take responsibility. It is worse to me with a male.

Getting women to come over here is not difficult for me Kilgore Trout. Getting women to come here and bring me Peace is difficult. Piece is not. It is that simple.

I am not here Kilgore Trout to be a nice guy..nor a bad guy. I am also not here to change the settings on my dial for someone else's without something of value to me in exchange.

I will illustrate you something about a Nice Guy and how this works for a male who knows as I have posted this before in the Relationships section.

My friend finally learned what it is to be a nice guy and what was wrong with the template was he himself..who was wrong and or imperceptive about many things to do with women/females. He learned that he spent to much time trying out for their approval. As I have if trying out for the baseball team...Try outs.

When His wife passed away..and he came back on the marketplace...he dated numerous women. Most of them with children.

While visiting him one weekend we did some "Guy Talk." and compared notes so to speak. What he told me was very profound and in line with what I was learning but expressing in different words.

He stated that he finally figured out what it was which was so stamped out in so many of the women he dated or was dating.

They were coming over to his house and looking at what they could get for themselves and their children. They were not looking at what they needed to bring to him of real value. They assumed that beauty and sex values were real value to him. That they should be all he needed. They were stereotyping and thinking that if they played their cards correctly he would buy the package and they would be off to the races in consumption rates for themselves and their children. It was not difficult for him to see that in the process they would be putting him in last place while taking first place with his RISKS. After all..he would be getting their body once in awhile..what more could a man possible want and expect from a woman/female??? You know..the "Best years of their lives!!"

They were incorrectly assuming that their pet beliefs and stereotypes were all that there was and so too their default settings. There is no other belief system out here with which they should be aware.
They were not asking what kind of RISKS he takes for his monies/living. They were assuming that the settings and beliefs on their radio dials is all that there is out here. They were also not perceptive sufficient to ask what was missing from his life. They incorrectly assumed it was sex and access to sex and beauty.

In other words they were willing to give the "appearance of value, the appearance of commitment" to him in exchange for his goods and services in lieu of what was really valuable to him. Subtly exchange his beliefs with theirs under the cover of beauty and sex.

It did not work. When he explained it to some of them..they were outraged and some dumbfounded that a man could even ask or propose such an concept. That a woman should have to work think and operate outside standard female default settings.

That somehow they were cheated...they gave him something of extreme value in the marketplace..they RISKED so much and he had cheated them. Therefore outrage and insult was now justified. He owed them much more.
He did not give them sex and beauty ..only they did this.

This Kilgore Trout is what happens to Nice Guys who don't catch on or educate themselves outside of the classroom. You will never see such an explanation outside of Victim programs/programming so popular today.

Fortunately for my friend he finally caught on after three failures. He finally got the pattern down.

He learned about Peace verses Piece.

More men should know this and not be nice guys...nor should they be bad guys.

They need to be men and expect more from women than the standard default settings so popular today.

Kilgore Trout. I can enjoy the company of women or leave them behind. No problem by me either way. I am comfortable and at Peace.

I hope you can understand now the concept of Peace verses Piece. To many not so nice guys settle for Piece when they could have Peace in their lives with or without children. Now if one did this to a woman ...they would scream "Victim" and be using the term Door Mat. But it was ok with the women if they did this to my friend under the cover of Marriage..because no one would see what was really happening..except the most perceptive women..and they wouldn't talk..except among themselves.

Hope this helps about what is wrong with the nice guy default setting. The bad guy setting as well.


posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 04:01 PM
I don't have time to read through your thread, I read a bit of the end to get the gist of it, but I have a simple answer to your initial question "What's wrong with nice guys....?". There's nothing wrong with nice guys...if you haven't noticed, nice guys don't make up too much of the population anymore, it's becoming "cool" to be sinister and uncaring, to treat others like crap and act like a king, to generally step all over others to climb your way to the top...essentially, our humanity and care for one other is being stripped away. As I said, there is nothing wrong with nice guys, the world is just full of assholes...

edit on 17-11-2010 by WhizPhiz because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 04:13 PM
Simple girls like being treated badly but wont admit it.
This nice guy would work well, but hmmmm maybe i should try something more fun.

Basically nice guys are here to fix what 100 a**holes broke when a women starts getting old.

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 04:30 PM
reply to post by orangetom1999

"What's wrong with nice guys?"
We usually finish i last place.
Some women are just confrontational and don't know it, sometimes being drawn to chaos and drama.
Some women want to be told what to do, or led and most nice guys would rather walk beside someone as a partner, not rule as the dominant figure.
I think Biology has some influence here but I'm not sure exactly how.

Additionally, maybe it is kind of like the grass is greener over there." in that if one is in a mellow. stable relationship, they may long for more excitement and less predictability. The same applies to the opposite, a person living the wild life or are attracted to bad boys may long for more stability and predictability.
I grew tired of trying to figure it out at the cost of someone's feelings, either mine or theirs, so I've been flying solo for some time, as a nice guy in last place, but that's okay.

edit on 17-11-2010 by speculativeoptimist because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 17 2010 @ 06:32 PM
I think the answer to this question lies right before our eyes.

Who gets the best responses here on ATS?

The people who have well thought out posts, make thoughtful comments, read and think about what others have posted, and reply in a thoughtful manner.

And they are not rude nor resort to "mean" tactics if they disagree.

Think about it.

Who is liked best, right here?

The NICE people!

posted on Nov, 18 2010 @ 02:14 PM
nice guys finnish last!

end of story


be safe people

posted on Nov, 20 2010 @ 06:54 AM
reply to post by orangetom1999

orangetom, nice to see one of your posts mate. Hope you are well. I think that, as usual, your OP was insightful and perceptive. I can see exactly what you are seeing amongst my friends who have settled down. There is a trade that takes place, where appearances are of primary importance. It is a privilege if a man is able to live in his own skin, but not one shared by many of the people that I see. The pursuit of wealth, luxury and pleasure are the default values of many men and women. However, the spiritual and the essence of things remain unknown except to those who can see life through a higher 'lens.'

Religion, in its more advanced forms, rises higher than poetry. It moves from individual to society. In its attitude towards the Ultimate Reality it is opposed to the limitations of man; it enlarges his claims and holds out the prospect of nothing less than a direct vision of Reality. Is it then possible to apply the purely rational method of philosophy to religion? The spirit of philosophy is one of free inquiry. It suspects all authority. Its function is to trace the uncritical assumptions of human thought to their hiding places, and in this pursuit it may finally end in denial or a frank admission of the incapacity of pure reason to reach the Ultimate Reality.

This was written from an unusual source - an Islamic polymath called Dr Allama Iqbal, I believe.

Anyway, I was just checking out ATS and I read your OP. However, nice guys don't finish last, mate, they win the race before it is run IMHO.

Wish you well.


posted on Nov, 21 2010 @ 01:56 AM

How good to read your post again. My thanks to you for stopping in to render your view and in like manner I hope all is well with you and your house. THere is sir..indeed a trade which takes place.
I have spoken of this very concept to many males and men of whom I come into contact. Most cannot see it in relation to the very fast lives we tend to live as they run one program after another and most of which are not their programs..but of others and expedited by crisis of others or the inabilities of others.

Many of them do recognize the concept of working for first place and taking first place risks but coming way down on the priority/pecking order while taking such risks.

LOL LOL...indeed...default values..indeed. Good to see that someone else recognizes the concept of default settings in play..and not necessarily of values or defaults of our own.

Oh..and that is a very deep quote by Dr Allama Iqbal. Very well thought out. I like it very much. Thanks for sending it along with your post.

There must be something wrong with me as I am not interested in being a "nice guy" nor am I interested in Racing. I would rather run my programs unto my conclusions. Everyone else can just pass on by. I am not that interested in finishing first or last...just finishing.

Thanks again,

edit on 21-11-2010 by orangetom1999 because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 22 2010 @ 05:22 AM
There is a difference between 'nice' guys and good guys.

I know lots of 'nice' guys. They act 'nice' because they are trying to hide their flaws. In essence they are presenting a false self to the world. And most decent girls see right through it. They dont trust them, end of story (and rightly so). However the girl that is looking for material possession, or a man to control, will snare the 'nice' guy as per the OP's post.

The good guy, however, is a different animal. He isnt a jerk or arse, because he isnt going out there with the intention of hurting anyone. His intentions are good, but his actions are real. He is presenting himself to the world because he is confident and happy with himself. This is a contrast to the 'nice' guy who lacks confidence and sitn prepared to show the real self to the world.

The good guy isnt going to be 'nice' to someone just to please them, however, if it disagrees with his values or goes against who he is. This is the big difference, and here is where the trust factor comes in. because he is genuine he can be trusted.

So that IMO is what is wrong with 'nice' guys, they are trying to deceive the world. And most of them dont even know it, they honestly think they are just being nice.

Similar to the OP, i am as happy without a relationship as i am with. If i dont find someone that is going to bring the best out of me then they are not going to be good for me in the long term. Whether i am single or not doesnt define me in the slightly, and i wont drop my own standards (for better or worse). Similarly if i am with someone long term i must bring out their best self.
edit on 22-11-2010 by zvezdar because: added a bit

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