Weird sensations/notions (Poss related to Time Slips/Shifts) ?

The Nelson Mandela one seems to be a rather common one. I also have the memory that he died while imprisoned and was shocked to find myself in a world where I'm the only one in my family that held that belief. ATS is the first place Ive met others who share memories of him having died in prison.

A lot of people swear Billy Graham died and had a huge memorial service covered by the press but I don't have that memory. Instead I have dual memories of actor Kevin McCarthy from the original Invasion of the Body Snatchers dying twice. It is confusing to say the least.

I have another story that was experienced by some of my classmates in high school along with me. It's a bit strange even for ATS so I'll just keep it to myself. Instead I'll just ask does anyone else out there have a memory, no matter how unlikely, of the East Coast being nuked to oblivion in 1980? I don't, in a sense, but I have a memory of an incident I can't explain and it would relate to such an event happening somehow in one alternate existence.

Originally posted by A55A551N
reply to post by destination now

 

It would have been at least 6yrs ago because that was around the time the drama school "closed" as it were.

Well she doesn't seem to think that Desmond Tutu is dead when she talks about him in this article from the Guardian in 2004, where she is glad that he is supporting her. And the drama school did not close as such, the board of trustees removed her from her position after she became ill in 2000 but fortunately as she recovered she started up her own school again and as she had so much support the original Anna Scher school lost most of it's custom as everyone flocked to support Anna. So perhaps you misunderstood the "loss" she was referring to?

Guardian Article

My children attend the class and have a wonderful time, and every week they return home with Scher's news - that Dawson and Andy Smith, the director, have resigned from the official theatre school; that Mahatma Gandhi's grandson Arun and Martin Luther King's daughter Yolanda and dear Desmond Tutu have joined the campaign to have her reinstated.

In fact, Scher phones up to tell me that she is visiting Tutu next week and will be taking him his favourite banana cake.

And a quote from the above article

Destination Now, I am sure by now you know that the way this works is that skeptics will inundate these discussions with posts of the facts as they stand in THIS timeline. That is futile as people are reporting observations they already know run contrary to these facts. Beating people over the heads with known facts from this timeline therefore will do nothing to explain why these witnesses have an "alternative memory" nor will it successfully argue them out of a memory stored, for whatever reason, in their minds. It will simply have a chilling effect on conversation and make people afraid to come forward with other experiences that might help shed some light on understanding this phenomena. But perhaps that's the intention? Some see this line of discussion as a passing fad that degrades the character of ATS. I see it as subject of study still in its infancy. as with stories of UFO sightings and alien abduction reports, we are just starting with people coming forward and telling long suppressed personal accounts. The time for sifting, organizing and debunking isn't quite here yet because people are still fearful oncoming forward. There isn't enough data to examine and make sense of yet.

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


I'm not beating anyone with anything...You should take a look at some of the other paranormal threads, where someone posts a picture, video or experience and watch the skeptics descend on them, none of them turn round then and say well if you don't believe, don't post - they accept that as a discussion forum, that others may dispute their beliefs, so I don't see why the timeshifting phenomena should be any different, I would even question if this subject should be in the paranormal forum, or if in fact it should be in the grey area! but instead of looking at the possibility that they may just be mistaken, have misheard or misunderstood, anyone who questions their version of events is automatically called a troll!! How is that allowing the subject to be opened up to debate and understanding?

I have simply posted an interview with Anna Scher, made at the time that the poster claims she was upset about the alleged death of Desmond Tutu, which in fact points to a totally different scenario...yes, Anna Scher was upset, she was upset that after 35 years of work building up a school that it should be taken from her after her illness, and that she was so glad that she had many supporters, including Desmond Tutu - and you honestly want to dismiss the possibility that the poster was mistaken about the cause of Anna Scher's upset??

I am genuinely interested in alternative universe theory and the possibilty of timeshifts and some people have posted some interesting experiences that would be worthy of further investigation, but I have given up posting on the other timeshift threads because I'm sorry but people who claim that friends they knew who had died 20 yrs ago and whose funeral they went to, suddenly re-appear on facebook and that they miraculously lost 40 pounds overnight due to timeshifts and I think by the absence of replies to these claims most other posters feel the same!

And if you are seriously suggesting that people are not allowed to question the OP or suggest other possibilities then perhaps ATS is not the forum for you!

Where did you read that I said you can't post anything here. I'm just saying certain lines of debunking are going to be futile, especially ones that pit facts from this reality against memories from a potential alternate reality. I'm not saying you are currently beating anyone over the head with anything but it won't be long before others will also chime in with everyone reposting the "facts" if this discussion ends up falling into the same pattern all similar discussions on ATS have. That has thus far gotten us nowhere but to kill the sharing of anecdotes and making people feel ridiculed and belittled because they have stories that conflict with accepted facts or mainstream beliefs. I really do not understand the hostility and contempt I've seen for people relating stories or feelings of possible time shifts on a forum where people routinely go unchallenged for talking openly about ghosts and vampires and marauding anal probing space aliens.

I had thought this topic in particular was an open invitation for anecdotes and observations. It perhaps does belong on Skunk Works or Gray Area for that reason. If it gets moved to one of those areas then perhaps we can proceed with more free sharing without falling into old patterns of arguments over the "dead again" phenomena.

And you are correct, ATS is not the forum for me. I do limit my posting to just a few a month on a very narrow group of topics for that reason. I enjoy reading the site, though. But even I can stand my own posts only in small doses.

I used to live in a little rural village. No car so every day I would walk down the road to a bridge across the river to another village where I caught a bus to my place of work.
Every now and then I like to have a drive out there for nostalgia's sake.
Well on the second last occasion I went and there was the village but no road leading to the bridge, just fields. Effectively the village was a dead end. I thought I must be going mad. I tried driving from another direction. The same.
A couple of weeks ago I tried it again.
This time the road was there exactly as I remembered it the first time round.
Bizarre.

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


Okay, I have to answer this and this will be my last post unless the OP wants to discuss the Anna Scher answer

First of all you said

Where did you read that I said you can't post anything here.

I didn't say I had read anything that claimed you said that...I was generalisng the types of response anyone gets when presenting known facts to timeshifters who claim they have memories of a different reality and who won't accept that everyone else has a different memory and sometimes the responses from the "timeshifters" is actually ruder and more dismissive than the posters questioning their memories of events.


then you said this:

I'm not saying you are currently beating anyone over the head with anything

When you previously said this:

Destination Now, I am sure by now you know that the way this works is that skeptics will inundate these discussions with posts of the facts as they stand in THIS timeline. That is futile as people are reporting observations they already know run contrary to these facts. Beating people over the heads with known facts from this timeline therefore will do nothing to explain why these witnesses have an "alternative memory"

And this, as I have already mentioned:

I really do not understand the hostility and contempt I've seen for people relating stories or feelings of possible time shifts on a forum where people routinely go unchallenged for talking openly about ghosts and vampires and marauding anal probing space aliens.

I totally refute, many people are challenged and ridiculed on many threads of this nature and I totally disagree that it stifles discussion, just look at the vast number of threads on these subject, people are not put off, but by accusing all of those who question anything as stifling debate, is stifling debate.

if as you say this is such a new subject and cannot be refuted in any way until there is further research and understanding, I would really like to know how you believe that knowledge and understanding can be attained without a balanced, albeit sometimes negative discussion as opposed to a group of people all just adding their own anecdotal experiences/perceptions of events?

reply to post by destination now

Lol I think I misread some of your points in your post myself, where you were addressing a general case scenario and not my comments specifically. I told you I'm annoying! I stated my opinion and can't really clarify it beyond what I already said. My opinion is irrelevant anyway. I'm not a moderator and I am not the original poster. I have no right to steer the discussion one way or another. I just hope we all remain civil and kind to each other and encourage more people to share their stories however we choose to analyze and explain them.

I personally am fascinated by the accounts of people encountering disappearing and reappearing or newly appearing landmarks in a way that defies ordinary explanation. Assuming people are reporting their accounts honestly and are of sound mind, something truly remarkable is going on.

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


Yes, I agree civility is always best, and whilst I will question some things, I make an effort never to be rude or come onto the thread just to be dismissive (as I know some do, and I will be the first to call them out) but like I said previously whilst there are some strange unexplainable phenomena happening to people, I have found some people's accounts to be preposterous in the extreme and when I and others have questioned their stories in an effort to gain further information or clarification, invariably the poster never replies or embellishes their story even more, which if I am being honest does incline me to question the truthfulness of the account and it would be more of a shame if this topic was simply ignored by a great number of posters who, have come to the conclusion that there is no scope for debate and discussion on the threads and is simply an outlet for almost fantasy scenarios, that go totally unchallenged.

Having read a few of your posts though, I don't think you are in any way annoying and you have many interesting thoughts and your opinion is as valid as anyone elses, I suppose I was just fed up the other day when yet again, by simply asking the OP a question and providing a possible scenario where they may have had a misunderstanding rather than a time/alternative reality shift, I felt that yet again I was being attacked for questioning (which has happened a few times on these threads) so my apologies to you if I seemed overly defensive, but I truly do feel that by analysing different stories and being aware that as you say, not every poster is honest and of sound mind, that it enables us to look more closely at the more plausible (yet still unexplainable) scenarios in order to try and gain a better understanding of the experiences people have had, particularly if people are having similar type experiences!

reply to post by destination now


No problem. I am sorry if I seemed defensive myself. I'm sitting on a personal anecdote myself because I am struggling how to word it and am dealing with a memory that is thirty years old. I start to type it out and fear of ridicule stops me cold. I have seen how tough it can get on ATS. I am also seeing if I can track down at least one of the other witnesses. One of the boys died of a brain tumor while we were still teenagers. I never really knew the other kids well and don't recall their names. There is one girl I do remember but I've not found her via Facebook or our school's reunion page's free information. Even if I were to find her I'm not sure after thirty years I can just pop up and ask her about something all of us kids were determined to forget and never speak of again right after it happened. It would be nice to find an explanation and get some closure on that incident but not at just any price. If I have to disrupt lives it's better to just let some things remain a mystery.

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


You should recount your story, sometimes even just putting the events down in print can be helpful as it allows you to objectively analyse what has happened rather than allowing your brain to try and rationalise it, and of course whatever the event was, it may be that others have had similar experiences and can relate to your story. Don't worry about being ridiculed, there doesn't seem to be any of that on this thread anyway and anyone who uses ridicule to make fun of someone is rather ridiculous themselves and their opinion is of no worth.

Not saying I wouldn't ask questions, but I genuinely mean all of my questions to attempt to find out what has happened, not to just debunk for the sake of it and as you seem to be implying that several people were involved, perhaps you can also include their interpretation of the event at the time. Whilst posting your story may not lead to any satisfactory conclusion about what actually happened, at least you will have recounted the story and that in itself may be a useful exercise in terms of categorising as just one of those things that you may never get an explanation for but at least you tried.

reply to post by destination now


Hi, sorry not to get back to you sooner here. I got distracted by the TSA topics. I starred some of your posts there, by the way. I do find you to be sensible and pragmatic. I have given this matter here deep thought and decided not to share my story for now. With the holidays coming I want to be cheerful and I don't want to relive such a bad memory in writing. Also I noticed there is some sort of quantum jumping topic going on and while I find some aspects of that topic to be utterly ridiculous, I think there are some aspects within my story that touch on some of the ideas presented in that topic. Therefore I think my story now would seem like an almost faddish "me, too" kind of addition to the forum. And it's honestly too important to me personally to risk treating in that manner. At some point I might be willing to u2u the account to you. But like I said, not when I'm trying to be of good holiday cheer. I've got a big family dinner to host this Thursday!

reply to post by SheeplFlavoredAgain


Thanks, and I understand what you are saying! Just go and enjoy your holiday, have sent you a u2u so, if you want to discuss your experience, you know that you can.

reply to post by A55A551N


I also am fascinated by time slips and after reading some posts I remember in "99 watching tv one evening with my roommate and my boyfriend and seeing a very strange news report on about P Diddy ( back then Puffy Daddy) I can't remember exactly what it was about (something about him having a child he didn't know about) but I remember it was very funny cause we all laughed and mentioned how weird it was. The next day I mentioned it to my roommate and she told me i must have dreamed it because she didn't know what I was talking about so I shrugged it off thinking I drifted off while watching tv but now that I think about it i remember seeing other thing on tv that never happened including hearing that Beyonce was pregnant 5-6 years ago which I mentioned at work and my friend told me she didn't hear about it & various celebrity deaths. I do go to sleep with the tv so I just told myself i must have dreamed because it only happens later in the evening but would bet a million dollars I was awake and actually saw it on tv, Is this a time slip into another dimension where Beyonce has a baby & Oprahs dead? Weird

reply to post by A55A551N
I remember Tutu's death too. I started a thread concerning what he's up against these days.
Boycotts and Protests To Meet APA Keynote Speaker, Desmond Tutu I explain it like this:

I also remember the death of Desmond Tutu some years ago. So, his death has been retroactively canceled by some great power so that he can still speak. For those interested in such changes in reality, I would recommend The Lathe of Heaven, by Ursula K. Le Guin,

George Orr, a draftsman, has long been abusing drugs to prevent himself from having "effective" dreams, which retroactively change reality. After having one of these dreams, the new reality is the only reality for everyone else, but George retains memory of the previous reality.
en.wikipedia.org...

I just happened to think of something that I can't believe I forgot to begin with, because it has driven me insane for years! I would have posted it on the more recent thread about time slips but like I said, I forgot and since this one is active again, I'll put it here. Back around 1989-1990, I very distinctly remember Cindy Crawford being on the Arsenio Hall show and was about 5 months pregnant. She was talking about her pregnancy and how it affected her as a super model, etc. I remember she had a round, little "baby bump" and she was saying that the baby was a girl and so on and so on.

Fast forward about 15 years and I'm reading online and see that Cindy Crawford has just given birth to her first baby, at home and it's a boy. Naturally, I'm thinking, "WTF???" I search online, because I remembered her being pregnant and even remembered what the daughter looked like when she was 5 or 6 years old. Yet now, it seems the daughter never existed!

So, as it turns out, Cindy actually had her first baby in 1999 and it was a boy, and again, this is about 6 years earlier than when I found it out in 2005! She does have a daughter now, but she would be 20+ years old, if she was born when I remember her being born, but nope. She's still a child.

So, again, I say, "WTF???" Does anyone else remember this? I thought that maybe I had her mistaken for another supermodel, but I know that isn't possible, because I even remember seeing Cindy with her daughter in a magazine and she looked just like a little Cindy! And this was YEARS ago!

I'm still confused as ever.

Edited to add:

Here's a pic of the little girl, looking exactly the way I remember her about 15 years ago.

I have just realised I never came back to this thread and replied to DestinationNow - She probably won't even see this now either lol...

I knew Anna personally, I'd been a student of hers from '92 until the very moment I was discussing... I was in the class she was taking when she mentioned Desmond's death... She never got to express her 'upset' about the Drama school because her illness affected her at the time so badly nobody ever really got to see or speak to her.

And without meaning to sound rude or anything I know exactly what happened, I was there and among a group of people who at the time were dedicated to getting her back into the drama school. However it did close... It was then handed off to a buyer, renamed and rebranded and then she opened up shop again elsewhere...

Yes, I'm still here...And whilst I cannot doubt that you believe you witnessed Anna Scher apparently upset about the alleged death of Desmond Tutu, she clearly does not believe he is dead when she was interviewed by the Guardian, though does talk about how upset she was at having been betrayed in her hour of need.

It is obvious from the date of the article and the dates you believe you witnessed Anna's upset at the supposed death of her friend, that they happened at the same time, and whilst you believe what you witnessed to be true, i.e that Desmond Tutu was dead and Anna was upset, so do I believe that what I read to be true, that Desmond Tutu is very much alive, and that Anna found great strength from their friendship at a time she was very upset at being ousted from the school she had given her whole life to.

There is no way to prove your scenario at all, but the fact that Desmond Tutu is alive lends more credence to my belief, and whilst I cannot say for definite that somehow in your reality that this scenario did not happen, unfortunately you can never prove it

And therein lies the problem with this phenomena, the alternative reality leaves no trace, except from the individual's memory

reply to post by destination now


It's great to see you're still kicking and contributing at ATS, DN!

And I see your opinion on the matter and respect it... However as has been pointed out I was not the only one who remembers hearing DT had died. I know the lady (Anna Scher) personally as well as I said and would recall if I'd been confused over her upset on her removal as opposed to DT's death.

She hadn't been removed at this stage and was still taking a class, when she mentioned the death... It's not something I'd read. I remember it well because that same weekend the theatre was being visited by Coretta Scott King (MLK Jnr's widow) who sadly died two years later... (I'm ASSUMING she has passed?)

I am remembering what I am, with clarity... I have all my faculties about me - I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree and as Evelyn Beatrice Hall once said (which ironically is also one of Anna's favourite quotes and often misattributed to Voltaire)

"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

reply to post by A55A551N

It's great to see you're still kicking and contributing at ATS, DN!

Thanks and yes, if there have been any rumours of my death, they have been greatly exaggerated

I totally agree with you on the agreeing to disagree and if I'm totally honest there is so much in this Universe that we do not understand or know about, I suppose that anything is possible, but being the argumentative type, if I think I know a different truth, I just have to state my case

And your final quote I most certainly agree with, we ALL have our right to our own opinion

Looking forward to many more debates with you

Peace