Jewish messianism discussion

I have been studying the Messiah concept for a good while now. It seems to all make sense when you use similar sources. Still the cards fall apart and then you have to rethink your steps. As a man of small faith in G-D. I see the Messiah concept as Israel truly coming back to Israel peacefully and the world finally able to unite for peace. I do agree the Messiah is an anointed figure which he will be a descended of David through Solomon. Still I don't see Israel being peaceful and it's neighbors liking how Israel treats them. I find this unacceptable today. The Scripture Requirements are very straight forward. You can see why I'm frustrated with this subject! Despite the religious differences in the Abrahamic faiths, other religions and non religious people: We want peace in the world and the Messiah age and future Messiah is what I believe will happen soon. I guess the dateline for the Messiah to appear is the Year 6000 (common year 2240.) I don't know about any of you but I can't wait that long for the Messiah age. Now I know I have debated before on what the Messiah is and who it is. I would like this thread to be about the future Jewish Messiah and the Messiah age. Cool?

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel
Romantic_Rebel,

The Jewish Messiah for Messianic Jews is the one known as Jesus Christ to Christians. The Jews that do not believe He was are still looking for him to come the first time. Mary the mother of Jesus was of the linage of David if you want to run it out that is found to be true. The non Messianic Jews have a crown ready for their coming Messiah but for me He, the true needs no Crown from man. He was the king from get go. The doubters will see the true before too long that is for sure. I differ with the yr. the earth being here with man 6,000 yrs. as I have found an accurate way to determine it and 2015 is it. The Bible is the most accurate record of true history there is. Our secular history was written by the winners and they wrote to a great extent a lie. I would refer to the history we have of "Roswell, Pearl Harbor, the Mura building, JFK assination, up to now of the Twin Towers 2001 - 911 and much in between. We are fed lies. The Truth these days is as scarce as hens teeth.

Jer 9:4 Take ye heed every one of his neighbour, and trust ye not in any brother: for every brother will utterly supplant, and every neighbour will walk with slanders.
Jer 9:5 And they will deceive every one his neighbour, and will not speak the truth: they have taught their tongue to speak lies, and weary themselves to commit iniquity.

The True Messiah when He comes, and again, will be the Great King the non Messianic Jews expected the first time. Satan had them decieved as he decieved Eve. Eyes have never seen or minds of men have not imagined the true scene of His coming again.

Truthiron.

Kind of depends on whether you think that the Messiah is meant to deliver the nation of Israel, or to deliver the Kingdom of God. If you believe the former, Messiah hasn't come and doesn't seem likely, given the democratic nature of the already restored state of Israel and the impossibility of rebuilding the Temple. If you believe the latter, Messiah came about 2000 years ago, and disputations of that come down to interpretations and expectations.

In other words, if one is Jewish, one's interpretation is that nothing in prophetic scripture says that Jesus was the Messiah. If one is Christian, on the other hand, nothing in prophetic scripture says that he wasn't.

And, to avoid the inevitable ruckus, a Christian cannot argue from scripture to convince a Jew, neither can a Jew argue from scripture to convince a Christian. Live and let live should be the path taken between these two perspectives.

Guys I know you believe in Jesus I can respect that. The discussing of the topic is the Jewish Messiah, Israel and G-D in Judaism. It's a difficult topic to discuss.

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel


Well, from a purely Jewish perspective, you'll be looking for a political figure, descended from David (I'm not sure how small or large that pool might be these days, or how well it's tracked) and all the rest of the scriptural affirmations, and who will restore the kingdom of Israel, rebuild the Temple, and basically lead the Jews to victory over their enemies.

Speculating wildly, one could imagine that a war will break out in the Middle East, Israel will start to crumble, a charismatic military leader will emerge, who will rally the troops (and/or the rest of the world) win the battle, and, if said battle should happen to destroy the Dome of the Rock in the process, rebuild the Temple after being named King of Israel by a grateful populace.

Lots of "ifs" there, but nothing that couldn't happen, and most would be hard pressed not to say that this person is not the foreseen Messiah.

reply to post by adjensen


That is why after messaging a Rabbi he said Elijah would return to confirm the Messiah is the Messiah and then a national revelation by God: like Moses leading the Hebrews will make God be known to everyone.

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel


That seems sensible, though I wonder how anyone could prove themselves to be Elijah? Obviously, they'd be considered nuts, even if subjected to Rabbinical scrutiny, but I suppose that, in conjunction with everything else happening, it might seem more acceptable.

The real implausibility in my scenario, though, is that, unlike the days of yore, a war between Israel and the Arab nations surrounding it would take days, perhaps hours, to resolve, and there wouldn't be much left to build your kingdom on after the (nuclear) dust settled. Rather than the "expected" victor type of Messiah, who comes out of the rank and file of Jewish society (akin to David), it seems more likely that a supernatural one, who could stop the war before it started, would be called for.

reply to post by adjensen


Not be Elijah. Elijah will return and prove who the Messiah is by his seed of David and Solomon. That is where I'm coming at here. You know it's confusing. God's presence is everywhere and yet how can we already have the Messiah age without destruction?

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
reply to post by adjensen

 

Not be Elijah. Elijah will return and prove who the Messiah is by his seed of David and Solomon. That is where I'm coming at here. You know it's confusing. God's presence is everywhere and yet how can we already have the Messiah age without destruction?

Yeah, you've got me. Stick with asking the Rabbi, he'll give you the correct information for the Jewish perspective.

reply to post by adjensen


Yeah that's what I continue to pursue. I have some sites for anyone who want's to learn more. Since I'm ill now and I have no time explaining my views.
Messiah 101
Messiah 101 2
Messiah site
Messiah of the Jewish encypedia